IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Of course. But I wasn't really addressing Gentile servants who might be part of the Jew's household. I'm speaking of the billions of Gentiles in general on our earthly home.
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Sabbath Issues
- Thread starter Walter and Debbie
- Start date
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Exactly
But they are part of a Jew's household. All Christians claim to be servants of Jesus. That makes them part of his household.
I didn't say it wasn't important. I am merely wondering what makes you think that Saturday was the actual 1st of Kislev.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Okay, you are speaking esoterically, using language ideosyncratically. I have nothing more to say to you if you talk that way. By being part of a Jewish household, I'm of course referring to literal home of Jews, not some figurative meaning. And no, Christians are not part of any household of Israel, either literally or figuratively, unless they are directly employed in a literal Jewish home as a worker of some kind. Now, if you are tempted to wax eloquent on figurative uses of the word household, please just keep it to yourself. I'm utterly not interested.
God would like humans to rest on weekends. This defines in terms of God's sovereignty, such that today's human rest in accordance to such a requirement. That's all your calendars marked Saturday and Sunday red.
Sabbath is the rest day specified in the Jewish covenants applicable to only the Jews. A covenant won't die away along with the emergence of a newer covenant. Gentiles abide by an older covenant possibly started with Noah, which specifies that we need to act in accordance to our inner conscience, though it grow weaker as time goes by. Then New Covenant emerges that we rely on believing in Jesus to be saved. However it by no means says that we no longer need to follow our conscience to act. We still need to abide by the older covenant to act according to our conscience. However, this is no longer good enough to be saved as we can't help but walking away from what our conscience says (possibly without our own awareness). In 30s, possibly there was only 1% humans can get to pornography because we felt that it's not right. Today possibly less than 1% of us never ever touched pornography. As a result, only faith can identify who shall be saved as 99% behave the same and sin to the same level.
Similarly, even when a Jew chooses to believe in Jesus, he's still a Jew in accordance to the Jewish covenant. He needs to observe the Jewish Sabbath while gathering with Christians. If gentile Christians choose to gather on the same Sabbath, it means the Jews won't be able to abide by their older covenant. As a result, the Lord's day is shifted to Sunday, such that the Jews can abide by the older covenant to observe Sabbath on Saturday then to join the Christian Lord's day on Sunday. This is how covenants work!
Sabbath is the rest day specified in the Jewish covenants applicable to only the Jews. A covenant won't die away along with the emergence of a newer covenant. Gentiles abide by an older covenant possibly started with Noah, which specifies that we need to act in accordance to our inner conscience, though it grow weaker as time goes by. Then New Covenant emerges that we rely on believing in Jesus to be saved. However it by no means says that we no longer need to follow our conscience to act. We still need to abide by the older covenant to act according to our conscience. However, this is no longer good enough to be saved as we can't help but walking away from what our conscience says (possibly without our own awareness). In 30s, possibly there was only 1% humans can get to pornography because we felt that it's not right. Today possibly less than 1% of us never ever touched pornography. As a result, only faith can identify who shall be saved as 99% behave the same and sin to the same level.
Similarly, even when a Jew chooses to believe in Jesus, he's still a Jew in accordance to the Jewish covenant. He needs to observe the Jewish Sabbath while gathering with Christians. If gentile Christians choose to gather on the same Sabbath, it means the Jews won't be able to abide by their older covenant. As a result, the Lord's day is shifted to Sunday, such that the Jews can abide by the older covenant to observe Sabbath on Saturday then to join the Christian Lord's day on Sunday. This is how covenants work!
It is quite simple. The Christian religions, daughters of Babylon, are following the "beast with two horns like a lamb" (Rev 13), Constantine with his two Christ like leaders, Peter (Zech 11:17) & Paul (Zech 11:10), who decreed in 321 A.D. that his Roman minions could not buy or sell on the day of his Lord/god, Sol Invictus, whose day is the day of the sun, Sunday, for he closed all shops and government services on the day of the sun. As stated in Rev 13, he was to deceive those who "dwell on the earth". His followers now bear the mark of the beast and will apparently have to drink from the cup of God's "anger" (Rev 14:10), at which wine tasting will happen in the "day of the LORD", Har-Magedon.
The Roman Catholic church follows the pope, the supposed heir of Peter, who was given the keys of David (Isaiah 22) and was put "in charge of the royal household" (Isaiah 22:15), all set up by Yeshua in fulfillment of the Law and the prophets (Mt 5). Of course, the guy who was put in charge of the royal household/church, Peter, was to "shame" his "masters house" and be deposed (Is 22:18-19) into a far country (Rome). According to Isaiah 14:1-2, "strangers"/Gentiles will become "servants" to Jacob when the LORD will have compassion on Jacob and set Jacob (Israel & Judah) back on their own land (Ez 37:15-25) after Israel has been gathered out of the nations (Ez 36). According to Joel 3:8, the nations/Gentiles will be sold into slavery after the "day of the LORD", and the "nations" will be ruled by an "iron rod" by the "Word of God" (Rev 19:15).
lostwanderingsoul
Well-Known Member
Thank you. One of the best answers I have heard.
Elihoenai
Well-Known Member
How do you Follow/Observe the Sabbath?
AdamjEdgar
Active Member
The apostle Paul througout the book of Hebrews, talks a lot about the relationship between the Old testament Sanctuary and the Heavenly Sanctuary. And in Galations he talks about the Israelites and Spiritual Israel. It is his claim that we, the Gentiles, have inherited the right to call ourselves "Spiritual Israel".
I would suggest that Paul telling us that we are now part of the same set of covenants that were given to the Jews "they will be my people and I will be their God". We, just like Abraham, are saved by the very same grace afforded to him through our faith in the redemptive power of the death of Christ. This did not change between the two testaments (the two witnesses) of the Bible.
The only difference between the Old and New Covenants is this:
I disagree that we can create two separate forms of worship here, one group who follow the law, and one group who do not follow the law (its black and white, you either follow the law or you don't) ...there is but one God. How then do we support the claim that He has made a set of rules for the original "chosen people" and a different set of rules for us (spiritual Israel)? It is inconsistent that One God makes two sets of rules for those who are saved through Christ. Are we saying that all those who died prior to the Cross are not saved by faith? Paul very clearly states, Abraham certainly believed he was saved by faith, he was saved by the death of the exact same messiah that we are saved by!
According the to claims of modern Christians, Abraham could not possibly have known of the new covenant. This means he could not have possibly known that the old one was going to fail. So to me this means that Abraham is saved in the exact same manner as we are...by Grace through Faith and that even for Abraham, any attempt to be saved through the law and his own works were, as James wrote, "but filthy rags"!
6So also, “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness.”a 7Understand, then, that those who have faith are sons of Abraham. 8The Scripture foresaw that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, and foretold the gospel to Abraham: “All nations will be blessed through you.”b 9So those who have faith are blessed along with Abraham, the man of faith.10All who rely on works of the law are under a curse. For it is written: “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.”c 11Now it is clear that no one is justified before God by the law, because, “The righteous will live by faith.”d 12The law, however, is not based on faith; on the contrary, “The man who does these things will live by them.”e13Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us. For it is written: “Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree.”f 14He redeemed us in order that the blessing promised to Abrahamg would come to the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, so that by faith we might receive the promise of the Spirit.
We know that the law is a curse, but that is not because the law isn't perfect, but that we are simply sinful beings who by ourselves are not capable of living by it. The interesting thing about the law and salvation is this, if we could keep the law perfectly, we would not need a messiah or salvation! (that is the point of this)
I would suggest that Paul telling us that we are now part of the same set of covenants that were given to the Jews "they will be my people and I will be their God". We, just like Abraham, are saved by the very same grace afforded to him through our faith in the redemptive power of the death of Christ. This did not change between the two testaments (the two witnesses) of the Bible.
The only difference between the Old and New Covenants is this:
In the new covenant God says "I will write my laws in their hearts and on their minds" ....it is now God who takes upon Himself the responsibility of ensuring the pathway to salvation is given to us. Prior to that, it was the people (Israelites) who made the promise...and they failed miserably at that so God chose a different option in light of the failure of the people. This does not mean God failed...he almost certainly knew that the Israelites would fail to live up the original covenant, but he gave them the option to try anyway.
I disagree that we can create two separate forms of worship here, one group who follow the law, and one group who do not follow the law (its black and white, you either follow the law or you don't) ...there is but one God. How then do we support the claim that He has made a set of rules for the original "chosen people" and a different set of rules for us (spiritual Israel)? It is inconsistent that One God makes two sets of rules for those who are saved through Christ. Are we saying that all those who died prior to the Cross are not saved by faith? Paul very clearly states, Abraham certainly believed he was saved by faith, he was saved by the death of the exact same messiah that we are saved by!
According the to claims of modern Christians, Abraham could not possibly have known of the new covenant. This means he could not have possibly known that the old one was going to fail. So to me this means that Abraham is saved in the exact same manner as we are...by Grace through Faith and that even for Abraham, any attempt to be saved through the law and his own works were, as James wrote, "but filthy rags"!
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The basis for saying Christians are servants in the house of Jesus comes from the Christian New Testament. It isn't based on any putative eloquence on my part.
Jesus is quoted in the Christian New Testament saying a person can not serve two masters. Christians are servants of Jesus, not servants of Peter. See I Corinthians 4:1-2, Galatians 1:10, Philippians 1:1-2 among other verses.
Walter and Debbie
Active Member
Hello Elihoenai, Good question, the scriptures to me are saying not to do the things that you normally would do in six days on the seventh day, for example, we do things that pertain to Sabbath in studies, but mainly prayer and rest, what about you?
Isaiah 58:
13 If thou turn away thy foot from the sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the sabbath a delight, the holy of the Lord, honourable; and shalt honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own pleasure, nor speaking thine own words:
14 Then shalt thou delight thyself in the Lord; and I will cause thee to ride upon the high places of the earth, and feed thee with the heritage of Jacob thy father: for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it.
Walter
Elihoenai
Well-Known Member
Isaiah 56:2
2 Blessed is the man that doeth this, and the son of man that layeth hold on it; that keepeth the sabbath from polluting it, and keepeth his hand from doing any evil.
Does this mean that after Sabbath Day is over you do your own pleasures, your own ways and speak your own words?
I'm on Sabbath right now writing on Behalf of Elohim/God. Therefore, on Sabbath Day the Aspiration is to bring every Thought and Act in Subjection and Homage to Elohim/God. Have you ever kept the Sabbath from Polluting it?
Walter and Debbie
Active Member
Isaiah 56:1 I like to refer to the 1st. verse as to being fair.
1 Thus saith the Lord, Keep ye judgment, and do justice: for my salvation is near to come, and my righteousness to be revealed.
Yes, I have honestly tried and have succeeded to keep it from polluting it.
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Elihoenai
Well-Known Member
What does it mean to you to Keep the Sabbath from Polluting it? You have made the Claim that you have kept Perfect/Pure Sabbath.
Readers have noticed you haven't answered these Critical Questions in Relation to Isaiah 58:13:
Does this mean that after Sabbath Day is over you do your own pleasures, your own ways and speak your own words?
Is it correct that you Subscribe to "Triumph Prophetic Ministries", Keeping the Sabbath and the Feast Days?
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Well, according to the traditions of the Roman Catholic church, the pope, supposedly Peter's heir, is "Christ on earth". As for your referred quotes from the NT, a product of a harlot daughter of Babylon (Rev 17), who sits on the "beast"/Rome (Rev 17:3), Paul (Zech 11:10) is one of the two horns like a lamb (Rev 13), who is to "deceive those who dwell on the earth", who supposedly wrote the text you refer to in your shallow defense of Christian dogma, or in the terms of Rev 17:5, "Abominations of the earth". As per what Yeshua said in Mt 16:23, the leader of the Roman Catholic church, Peter, is "Satan", and a "stumbling block to me". Per the traditions of the "Christian" churches, their god is mammon, and their main message is for one to give 10% of their mammon to the church coffers, instead of giving to widows and orphans. They follow the founding father of the church, the Roman emperor Constantine, in that they hallow his god, Sol Invictus (the dragon/devil) in keeping the day of the Sun as a day of rest, per his 321 A.D. edict.
Walter and Debbie
Active Member
Hi 3rdAngel, how are you all? Shabbat Shalom, we are well, thank you.HAPPY SABBATH EVERYONE!
Love, Walter and Debbie