Saudi Arabia Considering Retrial/Beheading of Raif Badawi

[Nietzsche]

Read again, State execution. Iam not saying individuals should make list of apostates and hunt for them

Doesn't matter. Killing someone because they don't agree with you or the assumed will of your deity is wrong. Whether the state does it or a group of individuals, it is equally wrong. And it is even worse to say that others should not intervene when something clearly terrible is happening. You & those who agree with you should be ashamed and shunned.

 

[gsa]

Done away with? I think the invasions tried that. It didnt work. More invasions wont work either. You can keep try, it only gets stronger and leads to unity between muslims.


I dont compromise on my beliefs to appease the people of disbelief, weither they are my relatives or friends. Compromising is for the apologists and those whose imaan is weak.

Western intervention has not been for the purpose of ending, reforming or otherwise weakening Islam. The best way for the West to do that is to support ex-Muslim dissidents, liberal Muslims and others who are opposed to the fundamentalist mindset of Islam. And when they prevail, the dominant ideology will die.

 

[FearGod]

It openly shows how uncivilized Much of the (real) Muslim world is.
I wish all writers and cartoonists spread such messages so that the world will truly understand how evil they are. Islam is terror.
It shows how uncivilized and cruel the followers of Allah and Mohammed (How can peace be upon him?) are.

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It is silly to judge Islam, Christianity, Hinduism, Atheism..etc according to what their followers do.

 

[gsa]

It is silly to judge Islam, Christianity, Hinduism, Atheism..etc according to what their followers do.

I agree on atheism. Like general theism, pantheism, etc. it has no doctrines.

But we'd be fools not to judge Christianity and Islam by the actions and beliefs of Christians and Muslims. Unless you want us to judge them by scriptures, which is even worse.

 

[FearGod]

I agree on atheism. Like general theism, pantheism, etc. it has no doctrines.

But we'd be fools not to judge Christianity and Islam by the actions and beliefs of Christians and Muslims. Unless you want us to judge them by scriptures, which is even worse.

Islam doesn't order to kill people for discussing religion,we'd be fools to believe otherwise.

 

[Jumi]

It is silly to judge Islam, Christianity, Hinduism, Atheism..etc according to what their followers do.

True, no one should be forced to be one or the other. We should be allowed to openly think and say what's in our 'hearts.

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

What if he is not telling the truth? And declares himself an atheist if he is released and goes to Canada?

@gsaseeker I told you many times, in that case he deserves state execution. Iam not gonna hide my belief for you to appease you or others. This is what the islamic law based on quran and hadiths declares about apostates, and it is treason that can only be nullified through repentance. Iam not like those(jews) who hide the law of Moses because of fear for mankind. And they leave the law with which Moses(Peace be upon him) came, to seek a 'better' law(manmade laws).

We cant look in the hearts of people.


I must say this(apostasy law) is the belief held by followers of the madhabs(sunni madhabs and shia madhab). The truth is there is no earthly punishment for apostasy in qur'an. Followers of Quran(quranites, sect)dont believe in the punishment for apostasy.

So you admit you aren't a Muslim/Quranite? Oh and while I have your attention, would you care to rectify this blatant contradiction in your own statements?

 

[Jumi]

Compulsion makes people dumb and leads to weakness of the group in the long run. In the short run, they will fear and follow the oppressor.

 

[Jumi]

So you admit you aren't a Muslim/Quranite? Oh and while I have your attention, would you care to rectify this blatant contradiction in your own statements?

Quranites are people who believe in only the Quran. Much like some Christians are sola scriptura.

 

[Nietzsche]

It is silly to judge Islam, Christianity, Hinduism, Atheism..etc according to what their followers do.

I agree actually. However, that is why one says "Muslim people" and not "Islam". The problem isn't Islam. It's some of the adherents. And in this case, it's the Saudi judges & those who agree with them or defend them.

 

[gsa]

Islam doesn't order to kill people for discussing religion,we'd be fools to believe otherwise.

So if someone leaves the religion and says, "I do not believe that Muhammad was a prophet and I believe he was immoral," there's no penalty in Islam?

 

[columbus]

It is silly to judge Islam, Christianity, Hinduism, Atheism..etc according to what their followers do.

I think you are totally wrong. The behavior that an ideology inspires in it's following is the only standard by which to judge the ideology itself. There is no other objective standard.

Although I can understand why you prefer that Islam not be judged by the behavior of Muslims. It must be hard to maintain the belief Islam is the religion of peace , given the behavior Islam inspires in so many people.

Tom

 

[FearGod]

I agree actually. However, that is why one says "Muslim people" and not "Islam". The problem isn't Islam. It's some of the adherents. And in this case, it's the Saudi judges & those who agree with them or defend them.

Yes, i agree with you.

 

[FearGod]

So if someone leaves the religion and says, "I do not believe that Muhammad was a prophet and I believe he was immoral," there's no penalty in Islam?

So what if one did, Al Razi did it already in the 10th century while the Islamic world were under the Shariah law, he authored a book criticizing religion.

Al-Razi directed his most vehement attack against the holy books in general, including the Qur'an, because he saw them as illogical and self-contradictory. He also believed that all human beings were equal in their intellectual capacities as they were in all other things. It made no sense therefore that God should single out one individual from among them in order to reveal to him his divine wisdom and assign him the task of guiding other human beings. Furthermore, he found that prophets' pronouncements and stories often contradicted those of other prophets. If their source was divine revelation as is claimed, their views would have been identical. The idea of a divinely-appointed mediator was therefore a myth.

When Islamic atheism thrived | Amira Nowaira | Comment is free | The Guardian

 

[FearGod]

I think you are totally wrong. The behavior that an ideology inspires in it's following is the only standard by which to judge the ideology itself. There is no other objective standard.

Although I can understand why you prefer that Islam not be judged by the behavior of Muslims. It must be hard to maintain the belief Islam is the religion of peace , given the behavior Islam inspires in so many people.

Tom

Not true, now if an American soldier raped and killed children then does that mean he's following the American military ideology or if a dictator ..etc

 

[columbus]

Not true,

Yes it is. You advocate Muslim violence, taught by the Quran. Killing people who realize that the Quran is not from God is an Islamic crime. Raif Badawari is just another victim of Islam.

now if an American soldier raped and killed children then does that mean he's following the American military ideology or if a dictator ..etc

If he is following an ideology then yes. But the USA doesn't have any such ideology. Some USonians do, which is why I will criticize the USA so hard. I was out on the street for months fighting against the invasion of Iraq.

One difference between us is that while I love my country I think it's important to criticize it when it's wrong. So I do.

Muslims get killed by Muslims for criticising Islam. That is why Islamic culture is still so primitive and violent.

Tom

 

[FearGod]

Yes it is. You advocate Muslim violence, taught by the Quran. Killing people who realize that the Quran is not from God is an Islamic crime. Raif Badawari is just another victim of Islam.

Islam doesn't teach violence.

If he is following an ideology then yes. But the USA doesn't have any such ideology. Some USonians do, which is why I will criticize the USA so hard. I was out on the street for months fighting against the invasion of Iraq.

Similarly Islam doesn't have such ideology as to kill people according to their beliefs, and while you refused the US invasion others supported it, so you can't paint people with a broad brush

One difference between us is that while I love my country I think it's important to criticize it when it's wrong. So I do.

And what criticizing has done ?

Muslims get killed by Muslims for criticising Islam. That is why Islamic culture is still so primitive and violent.

Tom

Comparing Muslim of today to the real Islamic world during the middle ages then yes, today they are primitive and way far from what Islam is.

 

[Smart_Guy]

It openly shows how uncivilized Much of the (real) Muslim world is.
I wish all writers and cartoonists spread such messages so that the world will truly understand how evil they are. Islam is terror.
It shows how uncivilized and cruel the followers of Allah and Mohammed (How can peace be upon him?) are.

I can't believe you said that

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

I don't see this as any different to what Isis believe and do.
perhaps there is a stronger link between Saudi Arabia and ISIS than our governments want to admit.

 

[Jumi]

I actually voted other, because I'm not sure if US pressure is going to do anything except show such foreign pressure is useless in this.