Science vs Faith

[Willamena]

Facts based on our interpretations of truth?

Facts interpreted by our individual fundamental axioms (truths).


Edit: Three examples of fundamental truths that influence the very way we think about the world: something that is, is; things are or they are not; and nothing is what it isn't. But people similarly have unquestioned truths about the world that they have accepted, ones that are less fundamental (in that they can be changed) but just as influential. Usually these are impressed upon them: by society or culture, by parents and teachers, by ideals and ideologies.

 

[Willamena]

What if I made an observation that wasn't true made a heading that was absolutely ridiculous; and wanted you follow in what you observed or base judgments on only small details to feed intellectual or emotional assumption.

Buyer beware.

Good judgements are those you make, not those you allow someone else to make for you. It's critical thinking.

 

[meghanwaterlillies]

Buyer beware.

Good judgements are those you make, not those you allow someone else to make for you. It's critical thinking.

some thoughts from outside sources aren't and sometimes you don't know what you don't know.

 

[Willamena]

some thoughts from outside sources aren't and sometimes you don't know what you don't know.

I would think it's always the case that you don't know what you don't know. And as for identifying which thoughts are yours and which aren't, that's a much larger discussion for another thread.

 

[meghanwaterlillies]

I would think it's always the case that you don't know what you don't know. And as for identifying which thoughts are yours and which aren't, that's a much larger discussion for another thread.

lol, LOL .... I also meant it via someone else.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Another example that is closer to every day experience are the sun and stars. We are fairly sure the 'sun will rise' and tomorrow will come that is more faith than truth

I think I understood all you said and it is a very good explanation. The above stuck out only because I understood it better.

True, expecting the sun to rise is more faith than truth. What is different is that we also see the sun rise and fall. In spiritual truth, we cannot always rely on our experiences. Take someone who is delusional. Would we say in reality he or she is living truth (fact) of her experience or is it a delusion? The delusion itself is real but not based on fact just as the sun rises does.

I found in my religious experiences, I'll say, I'd compare it to a healthy and well-experience "delusion." I say that because I believe our spiritual experiences from from the mind. They are not external. The spirits that are in the rocks are not the rocks themselves. (Just as Jesus/human is not god/spirit himself type of thing). Though the spirits are in the rocks creating its sacredness by changing the nature of a round thing like Jesus, with the spirit of god in him, changing his nature and making it one with his god.

Instead of faith, I'd say my belief is a fact because they are based on experiences; and, those experiences come from external means (seeing a soul deceased) but interpreted as such, rather defined as such, because of how my mind sees life. It is no different in any other religious person's experience and irrelegous person because we all have the same brains. We aren't alien to each other.

That said, I understood what you mean, though I can't really compare the faith of the sun rising to religious faith. One is based on fact-what we can test that is universally known and people know exist while the other is based on the mind where not everyone knows each other that well to judge if our spiritual experiences are fact/universal truth.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Facts interpreted by our individual fundamental axioms (truths).


Edit: Three examples of fundamental truths that influence the very way we think about the world: something that is, is; things are or they are not; and nothing is what it isn't. But people similarly have unquestioned truths about the world that they have accepted, ones that are less fundamental (in that they can be changed) but just as influential. Usually these are impressed upon them: by society or culture, by parents and teachers, by ideals and ideologies.

Hmm. Facts (like the sun exist) interpreted by our individual truths (what we see as truth that's influenced by society and culture, parents, teachers, etc..)?

So the sun exist based on how we interpret those facts which is based on our individual truths-truths influenced by society, culture, parents, etc.

 

[Willamena]

Hmm. Facts (like the sun exist) interpreted by our individual truths (what we see as truth that's influenced by society and culture, parents, teachers, etc..)?

So the sun exist based on how we interpret those facts which is based on our individual truths-truths influenced by society, culture, parents, etc.

Some of the features the sun may have are a product of what we think about the sun. Yes.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Some of the features the sun may have are a product of what we think about the sun. Yes.

Do you think it may be an illusion of seeing the sun? I know we think of the sun as a whole; but, I think you said or someone else its a bundle of individual heat waves (?) flying pass each other. I can't remember what who said it was held together by. I never took astronomy I'm a geology person. But even then...

 

[psychoslice]

Self defeating argument

To those who just want to be right, yes it would seem that way.

 

[Thief]

Careful about the Dark Side though.

dark energy and matter?....
are you asking me to believe in something that cannot be detected?

 

[Willamena]

Do you think it may be an illusion of seeing the sun? I know we think of the sun as a whole; but, I think you said or someone else its a bundle of individual heat waves (?) flying pass each other. I can't remember what who said it was held together by. I never took astronomy I'm a geology person. But even then...

Why would the sun being "a bundle of heat waves" make it an illusion? Surely if that's what it is, then that's what it is.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Why would the sun being "a bundle of heat waves" make it an illusion? Surely if that's what it is, then that's what it is.

The illusion is more seeing things as a solid and as a whole. The fact is everything is always moving so the "definition" of something is never static. It works in the laws of nature but when talking about a chair, we call it that because of the way it's shaped. But the truth, behind meaning, it's not anything but, say wood. Language makes an illusion that the words are actually static and literally defines an object or person.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

are you asking me to believe in something that cannot be detected?

You already do..."God"!

 

[Thief]

You already do..."God"!

yeah.....and I have an inclination to believe in science....
could all of that dark energy and matter BE ........God?

 

[Willamena]

The illusion is more seeing things as a solid and as a whole. The fact is everything is always moving so the "definition" of something is never static. It works in the laws of nature but when talking about a chair, we call it that because of the way it's shaped. But the truth, behind meaning, it's not anything but, say wood. Language makes an illusion that the words are actually static and literally defines an object or person.

I see.

Both the atomic and concrete nature of the sun are a product of what we think about the sun. Both are informed by truths.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

yeah.....and I have an inclination to believe in science....
could all of that dark energy and matter BE ........God?

I suppose God could be in there, sitting in the dark.

 

[Thief]

I suppose God could be in there, sitting in the dark.

oh no.....He created light....
not likely to be sitting in the 'dark'

 

[Rick O'Shez]

oh no.....He created light....
not likely to be sitting in the 'dark'

He is obviously hiding away, he hasn't been seen since he was invented 2000 years ago. Perhaps he is shy?

 

[`mud]

What year was that ?
~
'mud