Scientists finally prove there IS life after death

[Guy Threepwood]

Yes, imagination is limitless, as seems to be the ability of some to stretch anything thin enough to fit their preconceptions.

Very true, you mean like Piltdown Man, the 'big crunch' , the flying spaghetti multiverse etc?

But imagination is also the ultimate creative power, the only phenomena truly able to create anything, it's not clear anything can exist without it.

 

[ArtieE]

How sure you're that water existed on earth naturally and not by God's plan?
Do you have an evidence for that?

What do you mean? Is there any contradiction between water existing naturally and "God's plan"? What if hypothetically it was part of God's plan that water should exist naturally?

and how water actually formed on earth by the chemical reaction
between Hydrogen and Oxygen?

Interesting question! And looking for the answers I stumbled upon this amazing article. Read and be amazed. This is God producing water on an almost unimaginably grand scale! https://www.fastcompany.com/1769468/scientists-discover-oldest-largest-body-water-existence-space

 

[FearGod]

What do you mean? Is there any contradiction between water existing naturally and "God's plan"? What if hypothetically it was part of God's plan that water should exist naturally?

Naturally but not randomly.

Interesting question! And looking for the answers I stumbled upon this amazing article. Read and be amazed. This is God producing water on an almost unimaginably grand scale! https://www.fastcompany.com/1769468/scientists-discover-oldest-largest-body-water-existence-space

It's interesting and the most amazing to me that such unimaginable thing was there before 12 billion years during
the creation of the universe and God was there according to one verse, Was it God's throne?!

And it is He who created the heavens and the earth in six days - and His Throne had been upon water - that He might test you as to which of you is best in deed. But if you say, "Indeed, you are resurrected after death," those who disbelieve will surely say, "This is not but obvious magic."(11:7)

 

[ArtieE]

And it is He who created the heavens and the earth

And who created Him? Or is He a result of chance or does He exist naturally? Or is being the result of chance and existing naturally the same thing?

I wonder why theists can't see the irony in claiming that the universe couldn't exist naturally but would have to have been created by a creator who wasn't created but exists naturally.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

And who created Him? Or is He a result of chance or does He exist naturally? Or is being the result of chance and existing naturally the same thing?

God is allowed to be eternal, but nothing else is allowed to be eternal. Go figure.

 

[ArtieE]

But imagination is also the ultimate creative power, the only phenomena truly able to create anything, it's not clear anything can exist without it.

If nothing exists without it first having been imagined and created why would God exist in the first place?

 

[FearGod]

And who created Him? Or is He a result of chance or does He exist naturally? Or is being the result of chance and existing naturally the same thing?

I wonder why theists can't see the irony in claiming that the universe couldn't exist naturally but would have to have been created by a creator who wasn't created but exists naturally.

That question is asked by everyone even children are asking the same question, my son asked me the same question
when he was 5 years old and still asking me while he's 7 years old, i don't pretend to know or even to find a logical
answer for it and even the prophet said if you'll think how God was created then you'll never have an answer and that
will lead you to choose the wrong path, so be aware.

As we said before that we have 2 options, nothing existed or a thing existing.

We know that nothingness won't produce anything, that means it'll be always and always nothingness,
the other option that something was existing and always existing, but how and why, we can never
know, we have the answer but we don't know of how and why.

 

[ArtieE]

Naturally but not randomly.

But random chance is part of the reason why we evolved and exist naturally! We couldn't exist naturally if it wasn't in part due to random chance!

 

[ArtieE]

That question is asked by everyone even children are asking the same question, my son asked me the same question
when he was 5 years old and still asking me while he's 7 years old, i don't pretend to know or even to find a logical
answer for it and even the prophet said if you'll think how God was created then you'll never have an answer and that
will lead you to choose the wrong path, so be aware.

Your son is on the right path when he asks questions and wants answers. It isn't his fault that you can't provide any. This is part of the reason why I'm an atheist. I could possibly believe that a god exists but not if theists can't even give me a logical and rational reason why this god would exist in the first place.

 

[FearGod]

But random chance is part of the reason why we evolved and exist naturally! We couldn't exist naturally if it wasn't in part due to random chance!

The DNA structure and the biological information that encoded in the sequence of the nitrogen bases
is by itself an evidence for a design and not for randomness, the same example of the TV set, arranging
the elements randomly will never make the TV to work.

 

[FearGod]

Your son is on the right path when he asks questions and wants answers. It isn't his fault that you can't provide any. This is part of the reason why I'm an atheist. I could possibly believe that a god exists but not if theists can't even give me a logical and rational reason why this god would exist in the first place.

How my answer is illogical.

I asked you to choose if something was existing or there was nothing existing, you chose that something
was always existing in order for things to exist as nothingness will be always nothingness.

So the rational answer that something always existing is the only right option, if you have another
rational option then I'm all ear.

 

[ArtieE]

The DNA structure and the biological information that encoded in the sequence of the nitrogen bases
is by itself an evidence for a design and not for randomness, the same example of the TV set, arranging
the elements randomly will never make the TV to work.

Unlike atoms and molecules and DNA the tv components don't have properties making them able to stick together and interact with each other and produce assemblies and replicate by themselves FearGod. A TV set has to be put together. A human being evolves from only two cells. No god assembled all the atoms and molecules I am made of personally to make me. No god assembled the two cells I evolved from either they simply evolved from earlier simple structures just like I evolved from them.

 

[ArtieE]

So the rational answer that something always existing is the only right option, if you have another
rational option then I'm all ear.

And since something has always existed no god is required to make something exist including the universe. The universe is simply the present configuration of all or some of what has always existed.

 

[FearGod]

Unlike atoms and molecules and DNA the tv components don't have properties making them able to stick together and interact with each other and produce assemblies and replicate by themselves FearGod. A TV set has to be put together. A human being evolves from only two cells. No god assembled all the atoms and molecules I am made of personally to make me. No god assembled the two cells I evolved from either they simply evolved from earlier simple structures just like I evolved from them.

The electronic components have its properties as well, for example the resistors resist current flow and
each resistor has its specific value which if changed in a specific circuit will affect the whole device, the
same thing with the capacitors, diodes , transistors ..etc, all can be connected and react in a specific way.

 

[FearGod]

And since something has always existed no god is required to make something exist including the universe. The universe is simply the present configuration of all or some of what has always existed.

So what do you think the thing that was always existing, the stones.

 

[ArtieE]

The electronic components have its properties as well

So what? They don't have the properties I mentioned and can't self assemble into more complicated structures like a TV set. Atoms and molecules can evolve into more complicated structures.

 

[FearGod]

So what? They don't have the properties I mentioned and can't self assemble into more complicated structures like a TV set. Atoms and molecules can evolve into more complicated structures.

The human represents the nature, one work randomly to assemble the TV and the other work
with plan to assemble the TV , so which one will work?

 

[ArtieE]

So what do you think the thing that was always existing, the stones.

I found a lovely poster.

 

[Kelly of the Phoenix]

What happens if we let tv-assembling robots learn how to make better ones? We didn't design the new TVs. The program kinda did, I guess, but the AI would be using trial and error unless we defined certain goals first (and that's not how evolution works), the new TVs could be very different.


It's like this video I watched where they let AI run Super Mario Bros. The AI knew to rack up points, and since that was pretty much the only goal, it started cheating hard and doing things that most human players would never do because for the AI, the game wasn't important, only the total score at the end.

Long story short, even "unnatural" things can evolve if given the opportunity.

 

[ArtieE]

The human represents the nature, one work randomly to assemble the TV and the other work
with plan to assemble the TV , so which one will work?

Nonsense. When are you going to get into your skull that atoms and molecules are able to stick together and interact with each other and produce assemblies and make complicated structures that can replicate but tv components can't evolve into a TV?