Seven Churches of Asia

[Fool]

Why in the world would a jewish teacher, group that had been established in the middle east have any relationship to churches in asia minor?


seems like they'd been more focused on their core followers in jerusalem than some far flung outpost?


had john ever been to any of these churches? surely there was trouble aplenty in the churches nearest to core.

 

[Kenny]

Because it was about the world and not a location... "In Jerusalem, Judea, and in Samaria and to the uttermost parts of the world"

 

[shunyadragon]

Why in the world would a jewish teacher, group that had been established in the middle east have any relationship to churches in asia minor?


seems like they'd been more focused on their core followers in jerusalem than some far flung outpost?


had john ever been to any of these churches? surely there was trouble aplenty in the churches nearest to core.

Paul or Saul was a Hellenist Jew with close family ties to Asia Minor.

 

[Fool]

Paul or Saul was a Hellenist Jew with close family ties to Asia Minor.

Sorry, but Paul, Simon Peter, didn't write revelation.


‘Revelations,’ by Elaine Pagels

 

[Thinking Homer]

Why in the world would a jewish teacher, group that had been established in the middle east have any relationship to churches in asia minor?


seems like they'd been more focused on their core followers in jerusalem than some far flung outpost?


had john ever been to any of these churches? surely there was trouble aplenty in the churches nearest to core.

Asia minor is located in modern day Turkey of today, so it's not that far from Jerusalem. And besides, St. Paul traveled through this region extensively during his 3 missionaries journeys (as recorded in the book of Acts) and founded numerous churches there.

It was necessary for Paul to do this because it was his calling from God to minister to the Gentiles (non-Jews).

'But the Lord said to him, "Go, for he is a chosen instrument of Mine, to bear My name before the Gentiles and kings and the sons of Israel; for I will show him how much he must suffer for My name's sake." ' Acts 9:15-16 (NASB)

 

[Fool]

Asia minor is located in modern day Turkey of today, so it's not that far from Jerusalem. And besides, St. Paul traveled through this region extensively during his 3 missionaries journeys (as recorded in the book of Acts) and founded numerous churches there.

It was necessary for Paul to do this because it was his calling from God to minister to the Gentiles (non-Jews).

'But the Lord said to him, "Go, for he is a chosen instrument of Mine, to bear My name before the Gentiles and kings and the sons of Israel; for I will show him how much he must suffer for My name's sake." ' Acts 9:15-16 (NASB)

so if paul traveled don't you suppose the others did too?

Nasranis - The Saint Thomas Christians of India

1st Century


52 AD: Arrival of Saint Thomas

After the death and Resurrection of Isho Mishiha (Jesus Christ), His apostles proceed to various lands to spread the faith. Mar Thoma Sleeha (Saint Thomas the Apostle) arrives in the Malabar coast of India and establishes Christian communities. Malabar is the region on the south-west coast of India that encompasses the area, both inside the modern Kerala State and its adjoining regions. Malabar is known to the outside world for its pepper and other spices. Ports of Malabar, during the first century are a hub on the Sea Silk route - connecting Malabar with both the West (including Greco-Roman) and the Far East.

It is believed that St Thomas was in search of Aramaic speakers (Jews, Persians, and other middle-Eastern communities) who settled along the spice routes. Aramaic was the lingua-franca of trade in the early centuries. Traders lived in the empires of Parthia and Persia had monopoly in spices, diamonds, and other valuable materials from south India. Since the spoken language of these traders and Saint Thomas was Aramaic, it is believed that Saint Thomas won many adherants to his master's Gospel.






The bulk of traditional sources date the book(revelation) to the reign of the emperor Domitian (AD 81–96), and the evidence tends to confirm this.[4]

 

[Thinking Homer]

so if paul traveled don't you suppose the others did too?

Nasranis - The Saint Thomas Christians of India

1st Century


52 AD: Arrival of Saint Thomas

After the death and Resurrection of Isho Mishiha (Jesus Christ), His apostles proceed to various lands to spread the faith. Mar Thoma Sleeha (Saint Thomas the Apostle) arrives in the Malabar coast of India and establishes Christian communities. Malabar is the region on the south-west coast of India that encompasses the area, both inside the modern Kerala State and its adjoining regions. Malabar is known to the outside world for its pepper and other spices. Ports of Malabar, during the first century are a hub on the Sea Silk route - connecting Malabar with both the West (including Greco-Roman) and the Far East.

It is believed that St Thomas was in search of Aramaic speakers (Jews, Persians, and other middle-Eastern communities) who settled along the spice routes. Aramaic was the lingua-franca of trade in the early centuries. Traders lived in the empires of Parthia and Persia had monopoly in spices, diamonds, and other valuable materials from south India. Since the spoken language of these traders and Saint Thomas was Aramaic, it is believed that Saint Thomas won many adherants to his master's Gospel.






The bulk of traditional sources date the book(revelation) to the reign of the emperor Domitian (AD 81–96), and the evidence tends to confirm this.[4]

Yeah sure. Thomas was thought to have been the first person to introduce Christianity to India and was ultimately martyred there. There were also many followers of Paul who helped him spread the Gospel throughout the Greco-Roman world, notably Barnabas, Apollos and Timothy amongst others. From my understanding many of the original disciples of Jesus decided to stay behind in Jerusalem and minister to their native people, the Jews.

This is the discussion that the apostles had when they all met at the Jerusalem council:
'For God, who was at work in Peter as an apostle to the circumcised [the Jews], was also at work in me as an apostle to the Gentiles. James, Cephas [Peter] and John, those esteemed as pillars, gave me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship when they recognized the grace given to me. They agreed that we should go to the Gentiles, and they to the circumcised. ' Galatians 2:8-9

Many Christians esteem Paul as an Apostle because he was the one who really caused an explosion of Christianity in the 1st century and gave it his all to preach the Good News to the Gentile unbelievers, which he was ultimately martyred for by Caesar Nero.

 

[Fool]

Yeah sure. Thomas was thought to have been the first person to introduce Christianity to India and was ultimately martyred there. There were also many followers of Paul who helped him spread the Gospel throughout the Greco-Roman world, notably Barnabas, Apollos and Timothy amongst others. From my understanding many of the original disciples of Jesus decided to stay behind in Jerusalem and minister to their native people, the Jews.

This is the discussion that the apostles had when they all met at the Jerusalem council:
'For God, who was at work in Peter as an apostle to the circumcised [the Jews], was also at work in me as an apostle to the Gentiles. James, Cephas [Peter] and John, those esteemed as pillars, gave me and Barnabas the right hand of fellowship when they recognized the grace given to me. They agreed that we should go to the Gentiles, and they to the circumcised. ' Galatians 2:8-9

Many Christians esteem Paul as an Apostle because he was the one who really caused an explosion of Christianity in the 1st century and gave it his all to preach the Good News to the Gentile unbelievers, for which he was ultimately martyred by Caesar Nero.

paul is never mentioned in the book of revelation; so why the importance of paul? obviously you've discerned the 11 of the kingdom were scattered in darkness; where there was gnashing of teeth.

and given this why do the majority of christians ignore the gospel of thomas and other gnostic gospels? obviously the 11 took the good news to the world with the exception of james.

revelation is a gnostic gospel. paul's letters are not.

 

[Thinking Homer]

Okay so I established that there is a link between the churches in Asia minor and the other Apostles. Since Paul returned to Jerusalem at the end of each journey, John must have heard extensively about these churches and the condition which they were in.

Notice that much of the books in the New Testament are Epistles, which were letters. This last book in the Bible was a revelation which John received from God, which he wrote down for the purpose of distribution. Much of this revelation had to do with End-time prophecies, but there is also a portion dedicated to the 7 churches of Asia minor. Here Jesus reveals to John the issues and concerns He has with the 7 churches. John must have written all of this down on a piece of parchment and distributed it in some way or another, seeing as he was in exile. The purpose of sending these revelations to the churches was so that they would read it, and correct whatever they were doing wrong:

(1) Ephesus (Revelation 2:1-7) - the church that had forsaken its first love (2:4).
(2) Smyrna (Revelation 2:8-11) - the church that would suffer persecution (2:10).
(3) Pergamum (Revelation 2:12-17) - the church that needed to repent (2:16).
(4) Thyatira (Revelation 2:18-29) - the church that had a false prophetess (2:20).
(5) Sardis (Revelation 3:1-6) - the church that had fallen asleep (3:2).
(6) Philadelphia (Revelation 3:7-13) - the church that had endured patiently (3:10). [only church without criticism]
(7) Laodicea (Revelation 3:14-22) - the church with the lukewarm faith (3:16).

Note that the reason Christians do not read the Gnostic Gospels is because most of the doctrines there contradict what is written in the original Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. There is also the question of whether these Gnostic Gospels were actually written by the original Apostles, or whether they were forgeries made by Gnostics in the 1st century. The early church fathers regarded it as so, and labelled Gnosticism as a heresy to the Christian faith. If you compare the two belief systems, you will understand why they would say such a thing.

What is Christian Gnosticism?

 

[Fool]

Okay so I established that there is a link between the churches in Asia minor and the other Apostles. Since Paul returned to Jerusalem at the end of each journey, John must have heard extensively about these churches and the condition which they were in.

Notice that much of the books in the New Testament are Epistles, which were letters. This last book in the Bible was a revelation which John received from God, which he wrote down for the purpose of distribution. Much of this revelation had to do with End-time prophecies, but there is also a portion dedicated to the 7 churches of Asia minor. Here Jesus reveals to John the issues and concerns He has with the 7 churches. John must have written all of this down on a piece of parchment and distributed it in some way or another, seeing as he was in exile. The purpose of sending these revelations to the churches was so that they would read it, and correct whatever they were doing wrong:

(1) Ephesus (Revelation 2:1-7) - the church that had forsaken its first love (2:4).
(2) Smyrna (Revelation 2:8-11) - the church that would suffer persecution (2:10).
(3) Pergamum (Revelation 2:12-17) - the church that needed to repent (2:16).
(4) Thyatira (Revelation 2:18-29) - the church that had a false prophetess (2:20).
(5) Sardis (Revelation 3:1-6) - the church that had fallen asleep (3:2).
(6) Philadelphia (Revelation 3:7-13) - the church that had endured patiently (3:10). [only church without criticism]
(7) Laodicea (Revelation 3:14-22) - the church with the lukewarm faith (3:16).

Note that the reason Christians do not read the Gnostic Gospels is because most of the doctrines there contradict what is written in the original Gospels of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. There is also the question of whether these Gnostic Gospels were actually written by the original Apostles, or whether they were forgeries made by Gnostics in the 1st century. The early church fathers regarded it as so, and labelled Gnosticism as a heresy to the Christian faith. If you compare the two belief systems, you will understand why they would say such a thing.

What is Christian Gnosticism?

gnostics are mystics, they can be found in many religions.

gnostic means -believer in a mystical religious doctrine of spiritual knowledge- jesus was a teacher of the secrets of the kingdom. its esoteric. mystic gnosis is for those in the inner circle. mystics are those who know the mysteries of the kingdom. the outer court is for the exoteric, the inner court for the mystics.


He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.


Woe unto you, lawyers! for you have taken away the key of gnosis(knowledge): you entered not in yourselves, and them that were entering in you hindered.


gnosticism

 

[shunyadragon]

Sorry, but Paul, Simon Peter, didn't write revelation.


‘Revelations,’ by Elaine Pagels

Did not say they did. The author is unknown.

 

[MonkeyFire]

The 7churches are 7 minds

 

[allfoak]

Why in the world would a jewish teacher, group that had been established in the middle east have any relationship to churches in asia minor?


seems like they'd been more focused on their core followers in jerusalem than some far flung outpost?


had john ever been to any of these churches? surely there was trouble aplenty in the churches nearest to core.

It's not a history book.
Think metaphor and allegory.

 

[Fool]

It's not a history book.
Think metaphor and allegory.

asia = orient
orient = eastward
eastward = aster = star

star of the east = venus = morning star

And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.

 

[shunyadragon]

It's not a history book.
Think metaphor and allegory.

. . . a bad dream . . .

 

[allfoak]

. . . a bad dream . . .