Sexism In the Nerd Community

[Monk Of Reason]

There exists an almost unanimous patriarichal overtone in the nerd community. The vast majority of the comic book heros tend to be male. The female superheros, game characters, ect are far more often than not, objetified and obviously garnishing questionable attire.

Though it seems to run deeper than that. I am a nerd. As is my wife. However when I go into a comic or card shop I don't get a second glance. If my wife goes into a shop like that one of three reactions. 1) normal and they actually treat her like a person. 2) three guys have a heart attack and can't help but comment. 3) people avoid her like the plague.

Very few women seem to play MTG or other strategic card games and this has to do both with the marketing and the attitude of the players. I've seen, personally, several situations during MTG tournaments or FNM's where women were treated with blatant sexism.

It also doesn't help that the internet is abuzz with "nerd girl" memes and photos that range between "your not a nerd. Your a whore with glasses" to sexuality and objectifying women because the thought of a nerd girl turns you on. Things have gotten somewhat better but any girl who is a nerd has no doubt met at least some sexism during her travels. As a male I have seen it first hand on more occasions than I would like to admit.

What is the root of this underbelly of sexism in a seemingly unrelated culture? What can be done to help it?

 

[Penumbra]

There exists an almost unanimous patriarichal overtone in the nerd community. The vast majority of the comic book heros tend to be male. The female superheros, game characters, ect are far more often than not, objetified and obviously garnishing questionable attire.

Though it seems to run deeper than that. I am a nerd. As is my wife. However when I go into a comic or card shop I don't get a second glance. If my wife goes into a shop like that one of three reactions. 1) normal and they actually treat her like a person. 2) three guys have a heart attack and can't help but comment. 3) people avoid her like the plague.

Very few women seem to play MTG or other strategic card games and this has to do both with the marketing and the attitude of the players. I've seen, personally, several situations during MTG tournaments or FNM's where women were treated with blatant sexism.

It also doesn't help that the internet is abuzz with "nerd girl" memes and photos that range between "your not a nerd. Your a whore with glasses" to sexuality and objectifying women because the thought of a nerd girl turns you on. Things have gotten somewhat better but any girl who is a nerd has no doubt met at least some sexism during her travels. As a male I have seen it first hand on more occasions than I would like to admit.

I've had similar experiences, and am also a nerd. I have played in MTG tournaments in card/comic shops (usually Standard constructed), though not anymore. It was indeed often awkward. The good part was that I went with a group of male friends that were cool, so I had that kind of "bubble" around me so I could always talk to them at the very least.

Probably the most awkward individual thing was this guy that had a card playmat with just the most obnoxiously sexist anime picture you can imagine. It's like, her butt is right in the opponent's face and she was shimmery with sweat or water or something, mostly naked, and this was a 30+ year old engineer with this mat. So whenever I played him, I'd have to look at this picture for the duration of the match. Besides that, there was just either people that didn't seem to know how to talk to me or people that say awkward things. A "deer in headlights" look was pretty common, and had instances where through the whole match I'm playing with this guy and he's like "" the whole match. But a lot of people were great and friendly and totally cool.

Another thing was that I used to play Starcraft in high school, online. I learned pretty quickly not to use a female-sounding username, which at the time was my first name and some numbers. I would constantly get chatted up during gameplay like:
"r u a grl?"
"You're not a girl. Girls don't play this."
"What do u look like? Ugly rite?"
"Lolz ur like real life Queen of Blades omg"

And I would often get rush-attacked by people specifically for being a girl and then mocked with sexist comments while losing to them if they teamed up on me like that.

I changed my username to something that was neutral and people assumed I was a guy, and it all cleared up instantly. I played in peace, didn't get harassed in chats or in gameplay (like rush-attacks are still part of the game but I wasn't getting these specific and malicious "rush the girl lol she sux" attacks). That was nearly a decade ago so maybe it has gotten better since then.

So I don't know to what extent it's really gotten better or not.

What is the root of this underbelly of sexism in a seemingly unrelated culture?

That nerds as a general rule are more inclined to be antisocial and have often not had much experience with the opposite sex? That'd be my guess. Sexism exists pretty much anywhere but I think that aspect plays a role in some of the sexism in nerd communities.

Like you pointed out, there are people in that community that are totally cool about this, so it's by no means universal.

What can be done to help it?

Calling it out, I guess.

 

[DreadFish]

I am also a nerd and I know other nerds both cool, and more socially awkward/underdeveloped.

I think that this is a product of the nerd's lifestyle which has continued from the past. Nerds have mostly been males who were bad at socializing and grouped amongst themselves, sometimes because of rejection from other social groups. These guys never talk with girls much, so they fantasize and channel their sexual interests into female characters and that sort of thing.

If you're really not getting any and you probably won't be getting any anywhere in the foreseeable future, ever, why not at least enjoy suggestively dressed female characters and cartoons?

So, these games are their interests and they channel their sexual drives into these interests in lieu of actual sexual stuff with real girls.

I would also mention that this isn't necessarily just one way towards females, though it's definitely like 98% that way. There definitely are nerd girls who do similar things with male characters in fan fiction for things like anime and video games.

In League of Legends, most of the female characters are clearly suggestively dressed. There was a new, male champion recently released and the staff had mentioned that one of the female staff members insisted that he have an alternate skin that was shirtless. It made me laugh to see that, at least, women also enjoy suggestive looking male characters too.

Short answer: it's about channeling unfulfilled sexual frustration into other interests and, in other examples, lashing out at females out of frustration over not being an object of female attention/attraction.

EDIT: as far as what to do about it; I guess like what Penumbra said, call it out when you see it. You can't just change an entire subculture, but maybe you can influence a person here or there.

 

[Flankerl]

What is the root of this underbelly of sexism in a seemingly unrelated culture? What can be done to help it?

Ah yes those evil Nerds.

"Nerds" usually dont interact with women. When a woman sets foot into their domain its like an Alien is visiting them. An Alien with boobs and a butt and they dont know how to react.

You want to cure that? Give them a girlfriend and laid. Which is not going to happen.


So yeah those evil Nerds...

 

[Gjallarhorn]

Let's counteract it with this:

 

[Monk Of Reason]

Obviously not every Nerd is going to be sexist. (I am a nerd and very feminist for example) but I guess I don't fall into stereotypical (and often wrong) image of a nerd.

Though women are just as likely to enjoy nerd-esk things but they are drastically underrepresented in most western cultures. It should be noted that I don't see the same kind of unbalance in Otaku genres. I wonder why?

 

[Erebus]

Instantly thought of this skit:

[youtube]OTGh0EMmMC8[/youtube]
Female Armor Sucks - YouTube

It's hard to say for sure where the sexism in the nerd community stems from. In my experience the most sexist nerds also seem to be the most socially awkward in general, so perhaps that's the problem?
These people aren't likely to change unfortunately, but as nerd culture grows and becomes more accessible to everybody the attitude should improve as well.

 

[Pegg]

males who can't speak to females are most likely porn affected.

Pornography stifles their ability to see females for who they are because when they see a female, all they see are images of pornography.... their minds are warped/perverted.

 

[Debater Slayer]

males who can't speak to females are most likely porn affected.

Pornography stifles their ability to see females for who they are because when they see a female, all they see are images of pornography.... their minds are warped/perverted.

Are you a feminist, Pegg?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I am also a nerd and I know other nerds both cool, and more socially awkward/underdeveloped.

I think that this is a product of the nerd's lifestyle which has continued from the past. Nerds have mostly been males who were bad at socializing and grouped amongst themselves, sometimes because of rejection from other social groups. These guys never talk with girls much, so they fantasize and channel their sexual interests into female characters and that sort of thing.

If you're really not getting any and you probably won't be getting any anywhere in the foreseeable future, ever, why not at least enjoy suggestively dressed female characters and cartoons?

So, these games are their interests and they channel their sexual drives into these interests in lieu of actual sexual stuff with real girls.

That is probably a strong reason. When you look at "nerd" things like D&D, RPGs, or MTG, there isn't a very strong appeal outside of the subculture that mostly indulges in these activities. And there are many in this subculture that are the "highly intelligent and socially awkward" types who are known for having fewer dates and relationships. You really can't blame them for indulging in fantasies of the nature, and the fantasies are certainly far more benign than many portrayed in mainstream culture.

males who can't speak to females are most likely porn affected.

Pornography stifles their ability to see females for who they are because when they see a female, all they see are images of pornography.... their minds are warped/perverted.

Not true. Actually, one study has shown that men who watch pornography are more likely to go into a protective mode around women. It's still sexist in thinking that women need protecting and can't protect themselves, but it's a far-cry from becoming a violent sex-crazed serial rapist.

The female armor often times does, not really annoy, but somewhere between annoyance and a "WTF?" type of question. Or sometimes it's really not even noticable, such as in the Elder Scroll Games. And then there was the "armor" of 300, which gave me a response of something between annoyance and laughter. Still abit of "WTF?" but it just looked too silly to really get anymore than slightly annoyed with it.

 

[Infinitum]

I've recently been pleasantly surprised over how well the male gamers have taken to me in online games during recent years. I used to hang around in game stores playing MtG as the only female in a male dominated circle and was always welcomed as an equal when I was introduced to newcomers. Sure some of the especially younger boys looked confused at first, but the example of the older guys had a clear impact on their attitude. This might be a Scandinavian thing since especially the role-playing scene is very female dominated in some genres (LARPs especially).

What has been the big surprise is how League of Legends players have reacted to me online. I naturally don't go around announcing I'm a female, since it has absolutely no relevance to the game. However I often make friends with players when I perform well and many of them can tell I'm a female by the way I write. If they're surprised they keep it to themselves. Still I find the need to mention very early that I'm married, since I don't feel comfortable with guys flirting with me. Then again this isn't just a sexist thing. If a guy is single and meets a girl they like I can't blame them if they get a crush on me (I know I would, I remember how I was as a teen ). It's just kinder to tell them straight away I'm already taken.

Lastly. I found this mobile game lately that really blew me away with their focus on equality. Not just gender, but colour as well. The main NPCs range from white to black with the black person being by far the most fun character (in my opinion). You can freely change the sex and race of your characters any time you like and all gear you collect looks just as bad*** whether you're male or female - and yes, many of them show a fair share of bare skin. I haven't spoken to the other gamers in the game yet, but I tip my hat at the game makers for the effort.

 

[Alceste]

I don't have experience with this specific issue, not being a gamer (more of a bookish nerd, and reading is a solitary hobby). The deer in headlights comment struck a chord with me though, since I work with crews that are almost always entirely male. I think there is a correlation between surrounding yourself with pictures of objectified women and not knowing how to cope with the presence of an actual woman - most work trucks have a picture of a naked woman on them somewhere, and those specific crews are extremely awkward around me. They don't talk to me at all or respond to any effort to strike up a conversation, leaving me feeling like a total outsider. They also don't let me do very much work, often grabbing things right out of my hands, as if they think I'll inevitably **** it up if I do anything.

The crews without naked women on the work truck act totally normal and comfortable around me, and are openly appreciative of my various contributions to the team effort.

I also find that as a general rule, the older men are, the better they are at treating women like people. On set, talking to guys my age or younger is often painfully awkward. Any man over 50 has no trouble at all. It's like they've learned to interact with women without evaluating their appeal prospective sex partner - a calculation that seems to place such a burden on a young man's brain that he becomes incapable of anything but awkward silence or stupid comments.

 

[Kilgore Trout]

What is the root of this underbelly of sexism in a seemingly unrelated culture? What can be done to help it?

Groups of males who are socially isolated from females tend to not know how to socially interact with females. Contemporary "nerds" (which I think are more accurately described as geeks) are a prototypical example of this.

Also, paritcularly in geek culture, there is a broad, underlying current of adolescence and immaturity, which predictably manifests in adolescent and immature attitudes about women.

 

[Fireside_Hindu]

I also find that as a general rule, the older men are, the better they are at treating women like people. On set, talking to guys my age or younger is often painfully awkward. Any man over 50 has no trouble at all. It's like they've learned to interact with women without evaluating their appeal prospective sex partner - a calculation that seems to place such a burden on a young man's brain that he becomes incapable of anything but awkward silence or stupid comments.

This was my experience on a long study abroad trip. The older men I interacted with were always respectful and polite. The men (boys?) my age or younger were either uncomfortable, wouldn't meet my gaze or worst of all, full of cat calls.

:camp: