Ha ha...so you admit that men wrote this book. Good, we agree. Therefore, it was subject to men making it what they wanted and not the literal word of God.I don't recall God sitting down at a desk with ink, quill and parchment...
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Should you believe the trinity doctrine?
- Thread starter anonymous9887
- Start date
First Baseman
Retired athlete
No, sir. It was directly inspired by the Holy Spirit sent from God. Therefore it is 100% accurate and reliable.
Those who do not believe in God or spirits cannot accept this, of course.
Neo Deist
Th.D. & D.Div. h.c.
Prove that is was divinely inspired. And in which language are you saying it has 100% accuracy? And which version/revision of the Bible do you refer to, because the Autographs have long since been lost/destroyed.
anonymous9887
bible reader
Again I don't believe Jesus was God. The bible uses the expression they walk on all fours as an expression. Jesus used a seed they were familiar with. You have to be careful with the word all because you have to know what the person has in mind when he is saying all. At my rate to each his own.
First Baseman
Retired athlete
Matthew 16
1 The Pharisees also with the Sadducees came, and tempting desired him that he would shew them a sign from heaven.
2 He answered and said unto them, When it is evening, ye say, It will be fair weather: for the sky is red.
3 And in the morning, It will be foul weather to day: for the sky is red and lowering. O ye hypocrites, ye can discern the face of the sky; but can ye not discern the signs of the times?
4 A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas. And he left them, and departed.
First Baseman
Retired athlete
anonymous9887
bible reader
That scripture cannot be used to prove the trinity, because being one is used as in being in union or agreement.
anonymous9887
bible reader
John 17:11,21,23
First Baseman
Retired athlete
On the contrary scripture can be used to interpret it. What you do not understand is that God is one God in three persons. According to the Biblical text it is obvious. Hence, the doctrine of the trinity.
If you choose to deny it then in my humble opinion you are wrong, sir.
Nada
#
I and the Father are one refers to a spiritual union where the son does as the Father commands.What you see with Jesus Christ is what you get with God.Jesus is God's representative here on earth.It in no way refers to a Trinity.The Holy Spirit is never mentioned in this union.
Lets take John 17:21. Here is says, " that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me."
OK.. Here we have Jesus asking God if the ones with Jesus could also be in union with the Father and Son.Jesus actually says,"just as you are in me and I am in you" So this does not mean they are literally in them.It speaks of a spiritual union.The same as The Father and Son.Notice the Holy Spirit is never mentioned here either.Are we then to believe that these people are also part of the Trinity if they are in the Father and Son too?
Also in John 20:17 Jesus makes it clear there is no Three.Jesus clearly states he has a God and is going to him soon.
"Jesus said, "Do not hold on to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. Go instead to my brothers and tell them, 'I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.'"
So, it is very clear there is no Trinity and Jesus Christ is not God.God cannot have a God, if He is the Almighty.Jesus Christ is the Son of Jehovah God the Almighty.
Lets take John 17:21. Here is says, " that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me."
OK.. Here we have Jesus asking God if the ones with Jesus could also be in union with the Father and Son.Jesus actually says,"just as you are in me and I am in you" So this does not mean they are literally in them.It speaks of a spiritual union.The same as The Father and Son.Notice the Holy Spirit is never mentioned here either.Are we then to believe that these people are also part of the Trinity if they are in the Father and Son too?
Also in John 20:17 Jesus makes it clear there is no Three.Jesus clearly states he has a God and is going to him soon.
"Jesus said, "Do not hold on to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. Go instead to my brothers and tell them, 'I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.'"
So, it is very clear there is no Trinity and Jesus Christ is not God.God cannot have a God, if He is the Almighty.Jesus Christ is the Son of Jehovah God the Almighty.
anonymous9887
bible reader
I don't know if you understand what I am saying. That particular scripture you chose as a trinity proof text cannot be used as a proof text, it's not enough nor clear enough.
So the persons of the trinity are all fully God right?
Nada
#
What is obvious is a traditional teaching that has no biblical backing whatsoever.It has been twisted to mean something it is not.This Trinity doctrine goes back beyond the birth of Christianity.So does the cross.You can see this in Egypt,Greece,Babylonia,Sumeria,India etc.. The Trinitarian belief is a pagan one that goes back further than you think.In Egypt they were using the Ankh cross during the 18th Dynasty, 1500 years before Christ.All of this is common knowledge.The "Christianity" you know is tainted with old Babylonian practices that include sun worship.This can be seen in St.Peters square.The obelisk in the center was brought from Egypt by Caligula.It is a sun worship piece used in pagan rituals.The Egyptians were pagans.Ask yourself,Why would the Vatican have an ancient Egyptian pagan sun worship symbol on the Vatican grounds if they represent God?
Here is one in Washington D.C.,the nations capital.
We have many powerful governments and religious establishments showing us who they truly represent.The clues are right there for anyone to see.
First Baseman
Retired athlete
I will not argue with you about it. Taken together, all scripture, especially NT scripture, clearly points to the trinity as quite factual.
If you do not see it that way then believe as you will but I think you are wrong.
Nada
#
No.Paul is correct.According to the holy scriptures you are incorrect.
First Baseman
Retired athlete
Again, you fail to realize that the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit are One God in three persons. Your conclusion does not take into account that God is quite able to appear as three separate entities in three different places at 3 different times.
With God, all things are possible.
Again, I will not argue about it.
First Baseman
Retired athlete
Paul does not in any way say that God does not exist in three persons. There is no scripture anywhere that implies that.
anonymous9887
bible reader
The point here is to discuss the trinity and defend the truth.
1. Man says that Jesus the Holy Spirit and the father are of the same substance.
2. God substance is all knowing, all powerful, and omnipresent. I'm sure all agree.
3. The bible says the father is the one who is truly all knowing ( Matthew 24:36)
4. Why is the Holy Spirit and Jesus excluded from knowing the day and the hour if all 3 persons of the trinity are all fully God?
Nada
#
But there is no Trinity First Baseman.I understand you are a Catholic, but what the RCC teaches is in now way what Jesus taught.If we are to study and show what the HS actually says,it in no way speaks of a Trinity.Everything the RCC teaches is based on their understanding of things and traditions.Jesus never used idols.Jesus never said he was God.Jesus made it clear he has a God who commands him.There is no place where God tortures you in a fire for all eternity. Al of these things are not what God commands or teaches in His Word.
First Baseman
Retired athlete
Because that is the way it is. Asking that question in no way proves your point. If that is the only "proof" you have your argument is in deep trouble.
You could ask all sorts of questions about God that no human being can answer. So that proves nothing. With God all things are possible so there are no limits on God whatsoever.
First Baseman
Retired athlete
As I previously stated I will not argue with you about it. If you will not hear then you will not hear.
Changing the subject to your problems with the RCC is something I would really rather not hear, not trying to be a smart alec, I just don't want to hear those arguments. I do not believe every doctrine that comes out of Rome. But scripture is inherent and infallible.