States and cities defy and disobey Trumps order!

[Riders]

Who is our President? Apparently Trumps not sense our Politicians don't have to do what he says.

Hes saying Sanctuary cities have to put all undocumented immigrants in jail? WOW! Some president. The states and cities that are sanctuary cities are disobeying his orders. Only one is doing it,Miami that's it.

Sense all jails are over crowded just like Miami, wonder how many real prisoners they have to let out to hold them.This is getting nutty.

I thought there wasn't gonna be all this drama what happened? My democrat friends from my church told me in 4 a few months Trump and his supporters will be upset, there are things that are going down.

 

[sun rise]

Good. The more resistance the better

 

[Phil25]

When Democrats are in Power, Republicans are for States' Rights. When Republicans are in Power, Democrats are for States' Rights. Have a consistent ideology people.

 

[Revoltingest]

I wonder about sanctuary cities.....
The seem to be well liked by the left.
But the left also wants to prosecute employers who hire illegals.
Of course, these conflicting stances aren't necessarily coming
from the same individuals, but it looks like an inconsistency.

So I've questions....
Anyone think they deserve sanctuary without employment?
Or is it OK to employ illegals?

 

[esmith]

Who is our President? Apparently Trumps not sense our Politicians don't have to do what he says.

Hes saying Sanctuary cities have to put all undocumented immigrants in jail? WOW! Some president. The states and cities that are sanctuary cities are disobeying his orders. Only one is doing it,Miami that's it.

Sense all jails are over crowded just like Miami, wonder how many real prisoners they have to let out to hold them.This is getting nutty.

I thought there wasn't gonna be all this drama what happened? My democrat friends from my church told me in 4 a few months Trump and his supporters will be upset, there are things that are going down.

Well it seems that you are real good a producing inaccurate facts. Want to try using facts vice your hyperbole or misinformation from your "friends". Everything you have stated is either false or misleading.

 

[fantome profane]

I wonder about sanctuary cities.....
The seem to be well liked by the left.
But the left also wants to prosecute employers who hire illegals.
Of course, these conflicting stances aren't necessarily coming
from the same individuals, but it looks like an inconsistency.

So I've questions....
Anyone think they deserve sanctuary without employment?
Or is it OK to employ illegals?

I admit to holding both those two positions. And I admit it is a conflict. But it is an imperfect response to an imperfect world.

I will say that when I talk about prosecuting employers who hire illegals, I am not proposing anything draconian. I am just suggesting some policies that encourage employees to hire either citizens or legal immigrants. Until the U.S. deals with its illegal immigration problem sanctuary cities are necessary. It is a messy problem. But I think the best way to start dealing with it is to start by finding a way to fill those jobs currently being done by illegals and get legal immigrates (possibly by giving these illegals legal status) or citizens. And then you can deal with the sanctuary cities. To do it in the other order will only serve to harass innocent people who just want a job and harm the American economy. But it won't solve the problem. It will only make things worse to score some political points.

 

[Revoltingest]

I admit to holding both those two positions. And I admit it is a conflict. But it is an imperfect response to an imperfect world.

I will say that when I talk about prosecuting employers who hire illegals, I am not proposing anything draconian. I am just suggesting some policies that encourage employees to hire either citizens or legal immigrants. Until the U.S. deals with its illegal immigration problem sanctuary cities are necessary. It is a messy problem. But I think the best way to start dealing with it is to start by finding a way to fill those jobs currently being done by illegals and get legal immigrates (possibly by giving these illegals legal status) or citizens. And then you can deal with the sanctuary cities. To do it in the other order will only serve to harass innocent people who just want a job and harm the American economy. But it won't solve the problem. It will only make things worse to score some political points.

Who would prosecute employers who hire illegals, thereby subverting immigration policy?
If it's the feds, then it would make sense to also prosecute cities offering sanctuary.
But if its local gov hauling employers into criminal court, do they expect illegals to live off taxpayer charity?

 

[Quetzal]

I have questions!

Hes saying Sanctuary cities have to put all undocumented immigrants in jail? WOW! Some president.

But wait, if they are here illegally (expired visa, no visa at all, etc), shouldn't they be held accountable according to our law? Is this only limited to sanctuary cities?

Sense all jails are over crowded just like Miami, wonder how many real prisoners they have to let out to hold them.This is getting nutty.

This isn't Trump's fault though. The over crowded-ness of jails is actually due to many actions taken by the Clinton administration. (@Revoltingest, feel free to fact check me here, but I think I'm right.)

Anyone think they deserve sanctuary without employment?
Or is it OK to employ illegals?

My .02: if they are here illegally, they need to pay the penalty. If they are employed illegally, they are not paying taxes. I am not okay with that.

 

[Revoltingest]

My .02: if they are here illegally, they need to pay the penalty. If they are employed illegally, they are not paying taxes. I am not okay with that.

How do they survive if they can't work?
And they could be illegal, but still pay taxes.

 

[habiru]

Who is our President? Apparently Trumps not sense our Politicians don't have to do what he says.

Hes saying Sanctuary cities have to put all undocumented immigrants in jail? WOW! Some president. The states and cities that are sanctuary cities are disobeying his orders. Only one is doing it,Miami that's it.

Sense all jails are over crowded just like Miami, wonder how many real prisoners they have to let out to hold them.This is getting nutty.

I thought there wasn't gonna be all this drama what happened? My democrat friends from my church told me in 4 a few months Trump and his supporters will be upset, there are things that are going down.

It is just a few cities that are doing that.
I heard that he is going to stop federal funding these cities and which that will make certain federal employees upset, because of their checks will be IOU's. And the section 8 program is federal funded, and which the landlords will be evicted a lot of people and those people will get the money to pay their rent from out of the mayor's hide. But now he has a good excuse to remove those that are against him.

Misconduct MC 255 - Insubordination

 

[fantome profane]

Who would prosecute employers who hire illegals, thereby subverting immigration policy?
If it's the feds, then it would make sense to also prosecute cities offering sanctuary.
But if its local gov hauling employers into criminal court, do they expect illegals to live off taxpayer charity?

If it is the local government they can simply impose fines on the employers, that will help the taxpayer. And I know I am having trouble explaining this, because to me it is quite a subtle idea. It is like a complex knot. If you just start pulling on it randomly you will only end up tightening it. To correctly untie it you have to loosen the right thread first, then go the second thread and loosen that, then you might go to another spot, or you might loosen the first one a little more. It is a complicated process, but you have to go slow and do it in the right order. It is like a puzzle. Does that make sense?

So if you start imposing some fines on the employers, that does not mean that every illegal immigrant becomes immediately unemployed. But some few jobs might now go to legals rather than illegals. The knot loosens just a little. Next you put some more resources into immigration and get legitimate work visas for immigrants to do jobs Americans won't. The knot loosens a little bit more. Now that you have made it easier to get the job legally, start looking at those who are doing it illegally (they have less of an excuse now) and maybe deport some (again this does not mean instantly rounding up everyone, but just a few more.) Now the knot has loosen up more. Maybe now you start thinking about increasing the fine on the employers and being a bit more vigilant about it. So on and so on.

That is how you untie a knot. But it is hard to explain and it certainly would not get a lot of play in an election campaign.

 

[esmith]

I admit to holding both those two positions. And I admit it is a conflict. But it is an imperfect response to an imperfect world.

I will say that when I talk about prosecuting employers who hire illegals, I am not proposing anything draconian. I am just suggesting some policies that encourage employees to hire either citizens or legal immigrants. Until the U.S. deals with its illegal immigration problem sanctuary cities are necessary. It is a messy problem. But I think the best way to start dealing with it is to start by finding a way to fill those jobs currently being done by illegals and get legal immigrates (possibly by giving these illegals legal status) or citizens. And then you can deal with the sanctuary cities. To do it in the other order will only serve to harass innocent people who just want a job and harm the American economy. But it won't solve the problem. It will only make things worse to score some political points.

The major problem is that citizens do not want to do the jobs that illegals do. However, since I live in a state that relies on migrant workers and can not find persons who are legally in the country to do the work they are between a rock and a hard spot.
I do not have the answer, but I do know that I support the idea of deportation of those illegals, or any green card holder that are convicted of a felony. .

 

[fantome profane]

The major problem is that citizens do not want to do the jobs that illegals do. However, since I live in a state that relies on migrant workers and can not find persons who are legally in the country to do the work they are between a rock and a hard spot.
I do not have the answer, but I do know that I support the idea of deportation of those illegals, or any green card holder that are convicted of a felony. .

I understand that. So get legal immigrants with work visas. That way you know who is in your country, you can keep track of them, and if they do break the law in a serious way you can revoke their visa and deport them

There are two reasons it is not done this way. First is that although immigrants on a work visa would not have to be paid a minimum wage they would still have to get some protection from outright exploitation. This would make it slightly more expensive for employers, cheaper than hiring American citizens but more expensive than illegals. And the second reason is that you would have to invest immigration services (start putting money into immigration courts, public defenders, etc). So it would cost, but it would help with the immigration problem, and it would just be the right ethical thing to do.

 

[Kemosloby]

That doesn't sound accurate that Trump ordered all illegal immigrants jailed. What I heard is Trump ordered all jailed illegal immigrants turned over to ICE and deported. Why would we want to pay to incarcerate jailed illegal immigrants?

 

[buddhist]

Who is our President? Apparently Trumps not sense our Politicians don't have to do what he says ... My democrat friends ...

Your Democrat friend Clinton & his comrades seems to agree with Trump

 

[Kemosloby]

When Democrats are in Power, Republicans are for States' Rights. When Republicans are in Power, Democrats are for States' Rights. Have a consistent ideology people.

Harboring criminals isn't one of the states rights, because they are in the country illegally, not in the state illegally. See the difference?

 

[Revoltingest]

If it is the local government they can simply impose fines on the employers, that will help the taxpayer. And I know I am having trouble explaining this, because to me it is quite a subtle idea. It is like a complex knot. If you just start pulling on it randomly you will only end up tightening it. To correctly untie it you have to loosen the right thread first, then go the second thread and loosen that, then you might go to another spot, or you might loosen the first one a little more. It is a complicated process, but you have to go slow and do it in the right order. It is like a puzzle. Does that make sense?

So if you start imposing some fines on the employers, that does not mean that every illegal immigrant becomes immediately unemployed. But some few jobs might now go to legals rather than illegals. The knot loosens just a little. Next you put some more resources into immigration and get legitimate work visas for immigrants to do jobs Americans won't. The knot loosens a little bit more. Now that you have made it easier to get the job legally, start looking at those who are doing it illegally (they have less of an excuse now) and maybe deport some (again this does not mean instantly rounding up everyone, but just a few more.) Now the knot has loosen up more. Maybe now you start thinking about increasing the fine on the employers and being a bit more vigilant about it. So on and so on.

That is how you untie a knot. But it is hard to explain and it certainly would not get a lot of play in an election campaign.

I believe I understand.
I prefer something less nuanced, ie, give'm the boot or let'm stay without fining anyone.
Cities which violate federal law should have the responsible leaders prosecuted.

 

[omega2xx]

Who is our President? Apparently Trumps not sense our Politicians don't have to do what he says.

Hes saying Sanctuary cities have to put all undocumented immigrants in jail? WOW! Some president. The states and cities that are sanctuary cities are disobeying his orders. Only one is doing it,Miami that's it.

Sense all jails are over crowded just like Miami, wonder how many real prisoners they have to let out to hold them.This is getting nutty.

I thought there wasn't gonna be all this drama what happened? My democrat friends from my church told me in 4 a few months Trump and his supporters will be upset, there are things that are going down.

When the current administration stops funding sanctuary cities, and taxes have to be raised to support unlawful conduct, maybe enough will start to sing a different tune.

How can honest people support breaking the law?

 

[Monk Of Reason]

When the current administration stops funding sanctuary cities, and taxes have to be raised to support unlawful conduct, maybe enough will start to sing a different tune.

How can honest people support breaking the law?

"If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so." - Thomas Jefferson

 

[Jeremiahcp]

I think Trump confused the word President with the word King, and he is learning about something we use to take pride in: Balance of Power.