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Stephen Hawking and his "no need for God" hypothesis

Jainarayan

Jainarayan

ॐ नमो भगवते वासुदेवाय
Staff member
Premium Member
I've always respected Stephen Hawking's intelligence and tenacity in the face of his illness.

Last night I got to see the full episode of the show in which he describes why there is no need for God in the creation of the universe. As I understood his reasoning, before the Big Bang, time did not exist and there was no "before". Therefore there was nothing for God to exist in. However, I see one flaw in his reasoning (how arrogant of me :p). He seems to be referring to a pantheistic God, a God who is the universe. He doesn't consider the possibility of a panentheistic and transcendent God. If God is transcendent, which as a panentheistic Hindu I believe, then God exists outside of time. A transcendent God does not need time or anything to exist in, therefore in my reasoning, the universe could very well have been created by God, even though there was "no before" this universe.

What say you?
 
fallingblood

fallingblood

Agnostic Theist
I say that he is also making a bold statement by saying nothing existed before the big bang. It is possible that there have been a series of big bangs and really, we don't know what was there before.
 
A

Awoon

Well-Known Member
Any more I like reading about the Universe, it's too large to care about, however
I've read that if the Universe is eternal no creator would be needed.

Would a self exiting essence principle need to be created?
 
Jainarayan

Jainarayan

ॐ नमो भगवते वासुदेवाय
Staff member
Premium Member
fallingblood said:
I say that he is also making a bold statement by saying nothing existed before the big bang. It is possible that there have been a series of big bangs and really, we don't know what was there before.
Click to expand...

Odion said:
I agree. :)


Also, what about if the Big Bang came from something else? Then there could have still been time and space; just not here.
Click to expand...

Yes, I agree it is a bold statement, one that I think is colored by personal belief (or lack thereof). But I'm not attempting to assassinate his character. My own belief is that universes pop into and out of existence, like soap bubbles, perhaps by a black hole singularity from another universe. Consider all the matter and energy that falls into a black hole. One universe "pinching one off" if you will, to form another.
 
idav

idav

Being
Premium Member
Jainarayan said:
What say you?
Click to expand...

Some interesting logic where all of a sudden an unfathomable amount of energy just existed without time needing to pass. The calculation has to do with the point the universe "started" expanding, which says little about where all of it came from.
 
Breathe

Breathe

Hostis humani generis
Jainarayan said:
My own belief is that universes pop into and out of existence, like soap bubbles, perhaps by a black hole singularity from another universe. Consider all the matter and energy that falls into a black hole. One universe "pinching one off" if you will, to form another.
Click to expand...
Totally agree. :D
 
Jainarayan

Jainarayan

ॐ नमो भगवते वासुदेवाय
Staff member
Premium Member
idav said:
Some interesting logic where all of a sudden an unfathomable amount of energy just existed without time needing to pass. The calculation has to do with the point the universe "started" expanding, which says little about where all of it came from.
Click to expand...

It seems to me he is saying that the universe self-created ex nihilo. Me = mind-blown.
 
Me Myself

Me Myself

Back to my username
Jainarayan said:
I've always respected Stephen Hawking's intelligence and tenacity in the face of his illness.

Last night I got to see the full episode of the show in which he describes why there is no need for God in the creation of the universe. As I understood his reasoning, before the Big Bang, time did not exist and there was no "before". Therefore there was nothing for God to exist in. However, I see one flaw in his reasoning (how arrogant of me :p). He seems to be referring to a pantheistic God, a God who is the universe. He doesn't consider the possibility of a panentheistic and transcendent God. If God is transcendent, which as a panentheistic Hindu I believe, then God exists outside of time. A transcendent God does not need time or anything to exist in, therefore in my reasoning, the universe could very well have been created by God, even though there was "no before" this universe.

What say you?
Click to expand...

There would still be "no need" for it to be true, even if it could. He is saying we dont need God to explain anything. While a panentheistic God is posible (and pretty much what I believe :D ) it doesnt offer any explanation of the stuff that he spoke on such documental.
 
Super Universe

Super Universe

Defender of God
Jainarayan said:
I've always respected Stephen Hawking's intelligence and tenacity in the face of his illness.

Last night I got to see the full episode of the show in which he describes why there is no need for God in the creation of the universe. As I understood his reasoning, before the Big Bang, time did not exist and there was no "before". Therefore there was nothing for God to exist in. However, I see one flaw in his reasoning (how arrogant of me :p). He seems to be referring to a pantheistic God, a God who is the universe. He doesn't consider the possibility of a panentheistic and transcendent God. If God is transcendent, which as a panentheistic Hindu I believe, then God exists outside of time. A transcendent God does not need time or anything to exist in, therefore in my reasoning, the universe could very well have been created by God, even though there was "no before" this universe.

What say you?
Click to expand...

And how would Stephen Hawking know one way or another?

Humans sure have greatly inflated ego's. All of human knowledge wouldn't even complete the first page in the book of the universe.
 
dyanaprajna2011

dyanaprajna2011

Dharmapala
A Buddhist explanation is that this is not the first universe to have existed, and it won't be the last. Once one universe has run it's course, another one takes it's place, and the process continues. Whatever was left of the last universe was probably what started this one off, is my personal belief. As a Buddhist, I see no need of a creator god to have started it all off. It's possible the universe, or rather, the energies that make up the universe, are themselves eternal, but this is simply speculation on my part. Ultimately, we still don't know for sure, and I'm not sure we're ever really going to.
 
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