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Suicide
- Thread starter Ori
- Start date
Suicide is a difficult issue. There are times when it is cowardly and times when it is entirely justified.
However, as each and every one of us should be able to do with our life what we like I think we should all have the right to death too. By what right can you force me to stay alive if I dont want to? Its my life, my choice.
This issue faces problems in that sometimes the person on the verge of suicide is just 'at a low' and if they can recieve conselling then they might be able to find purpose in their life again. So some argue that suicide shouldnt be allowed because everyone has something to live for. This is a valid point.
The fact that suicide is sometimes cowardly is an opinion and shouldnt be a basis for prevention of suicide.
Suicide usually affects loved ones, but I dont think this is necessarily always a good basis for prevention either. Every choice you make in life affects those around you.
The situation is very different if the potential suicider has dependants. i.e. Children.
Were you faced with a terrible affliction such as motor neurone disease, I think you have a very strong basis for suicide. There is no reason to make someone go through such terrible suffering and so I am in favour of Euthanasia.
I dont agree that it gives the hospital / family a way of killing of unwanted patients. There is the idea that people would be pressured into euthenasia becuase they dont want to be a burden.
Basically, Euthenasia needs to be an extremely stringent procedure. For example the request for euthanasia should be authorised by a special court - or hearing of some kind - where a panel of jurors can assess properly whether the person in question does indeed want to die for legit reasons.. It should certainly not be a matter of getting a couple of doctors signatures!!!!
Im not religious so im not concerned what the bible has to say. Let us remember though that in Japan suicide was (and to some extent still is) considered an extremely honourable way to die.
However, as each and every one of us should be able to do with our life what we like I think we should all have the right to death too. By what right can you force me to stay alive if I dont want to? Its my life, my choice.
This issue faces problems in that sometimes the person on the verge of suicide is just 'at a low' and if they can recieve conselling then they might be able to find purpose in their life again. So some argue that suicide shouldnt be allowed because everyone has something to live for. This is a valid point.
The fact that suicide is sometimes cowardly is an opinion and shouldnt be a basis for prevention of suicide.
Suicide usually affects loved ones, but I dont think this is necessarily always a good basis for prevention either. Every choice you make in life affects those around you.
The situation is very different if the potential suicider has dependants. i.e. Children.
Were you faced with a terrible affliction such as motor neurone disease, I think you have a very strong basis for suicide. There is no reason to make someone go through such terrible suffering and so I am in favour of Euthanasia.
I dont agree that it gives the hospital / family a way of killing of unwanted patients. There is the idea that people would be pressured into euthenasia becuase they dont want to be a burden.
Basically, Euthenasia needs to be an extremely stringent procedure. For example the request for euthanasia should be authorised by a special court - or hearing of some kind - where a panel of jurors can assess properly whether the person in question does indeed want to die for legit reasons.. It should certainly not be a matter of getting a couple of doctors signatures!!!!
Im not religious so im not concerned what the bible has to say. Let us remember though that in Japan suicide was (and to some extent still is) considered an extremely honourable way to die.
retrorich
SUPER NOT-A-MOD
Ah...yet another suicide thread. 
Yes, I think suicide is totally acceptable. If a person want's to take his/her life, I believe it is his/her right to do so. It is just unfortunate that assisted suicides are not available, so people could end their lives with reasonable comfort and dignity--without blowing their brains all over the place.
Free Dr. Kavorkian!
Yes, I think suicide is totally acceptable. If a person want's to take his/her life, I believe it is his/her right to do so. It is just unfortunate that assisted suicides are not available, so people could end their lives with reasonable comfort and dignity--without blowing their brains all over the place.
Free Dr. Kavorkian!
Thank you Rich; I know you know I've tried a few times myself - and each attempt was 'selfless', except for the first time, when I was scared stiff as a young boy at school. Acceptable ? - I don't honestly know - from a wordly point of view; from a 'self' point of vies, believing in reincarnation as I do, it's doubly hard on yourself - the way I see it; it just means you have to go through the same old".........." again.retrorich said:Ah...yet another suicide thread.
Yes, I think suicide is totally acceptable. If a person want's to take his/her life, I believe it is his/her right to do so. It is just unfortunate that assisted suicides are not available, so people could end their lives with reasonable comfort and dignity--without blowing their brains all over the place.
Free Dr. Kavorkian!
Melody
Well-Known Member
Whenever I read about someone who committed suicide....and I'm not talking about people who are terminal or in a lot of physical pain that can't be controlled....I somehow think that we (society) have failed them. Nobody should feel that alone or helpless that the only valid alternative for them is death. Few suicides commit suicide without giving warning signs. Why isn't anyone noticing?
retrorich
SUPER NOT-A-MOD
ayani
member
i agree whole-heartedly with Tawn.
from the standpoint of someone who does not want to end their own life, i do not understand suicide. i'm not going to project my own good luck and sentiments on someone in a situation i've never faced. i will, however, do what i can to let them know they're loved and listen to them. i think sometimes that's the best thing you can do.
from the standpoint of someone who does not want to end their own life, i do not understand suicide. i'm not going to project my own good luck and sentiments on someone in a situation i've never faced. i will, however, do what i can to let them know they're loved and listen to them. i think sometimes that's the best thing you can do.
jewscout
Religious Zionist
oy veyretrorich said:Ah...yet another suicide thread.
Yes, I think suicide is totally acceptable. If a person want's to take his/her life, I believe it is his/her right to do so. It is just unfortunate that assisted suicides are not available, so people could end their lives with reasonable comfort and dignity--without blowing their brains all over the place.
Free Dr. Kavorkian!
you know what i'm here by making this thread off limits to myself...if anyone cares my opinions can be found on the original suicide thread here:
http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7616&page=2&pp=10
post #20 and it goes on from there
niamhwitch
Celtic Faery Wiccan )O(
I believe that suicide is only acceptable if one is in tremendous physical pain that will never go away. For example, someone who is terminally ill and will die within a few months, but they are in severe pain and medication is not working. I do not however agree with suicide when done as a solution to a temperary problem. Suicide is perminant.
Prima
Well-Known Member
Why wouldn't suicide be acceptable?
Just because you don't want it yourself doesn't make it unacceptable. I don't want to be Southern Baptist (sorry guys ) but that doesn't mean I'm going to stop someone from converting.
If someone truly wants to die, and is making the decision separate from mental/emotional disorder or angst, I'm all for it. Most people who want to suicide don't REALLY want to, they're just so miserable that they see it as their only option and as their only escape from pain. Unless their disorder is not 'improvable' I don't consider that to be a good reason. I only see it as 'acceptable' if it is a decision make with a cool, level head. Like someone else said, it's not reversible!
Just because you don't want it yourself doesn't make it unacceptable. I don't want to be Southern Baptist (sorry guys
) but that doesn't mean I'm going to stop someone from converting. If someone truly wants to die, and is making the decision separate from mental/emotional disorder or angst, I'm all for it. Most people who want to suicide don't REALLY want to, they're just so miserable that they see it as their only option and as their only escape from pain. Unless their disorder is not 'improvable' I don't consider that to be a good reason. I only see it as 'acceptable' if it is a decision make with a cool, level head. Like someone else said, it's not reversible!
I agree with this. People don't notice because they don't want to notice. Check out my thread in the Prayers Forum to see my checklist for suicide warning signs.
martha
Active Member
Suicide to my mind for the most part, unacceptable. I have been is such a total state of inconceivable pain that I literally cried out to God, " Please, please Father, take me now, I can't stand this pain anymore !" Banging my head against the headboard of my bed every day at some point, praying for relief from the excruciating pain. Here I am today, pain free, and glad that I was not taken from this life. My freedom from pain was not granted overnight, but took some time, months on end, over a year and a half and some study. I found a doctor who could help with my physical affliction and it worked, finally!
There are some who are afflicted with much more pain then I have ever felt and who will surely die, to those people, who cannot find any relief from this pain and who will die shortly, I might say, by all means find a way. But I can't truly speak for another being.
There are some and I speak of certain groups of people who have been so browbeaten as a race or age group that they feel that there is no hope. If you are into statistics, I can tell you that the Native Americans, or First Nation children are among the highest suicide rates in the US. Gee I wonder why that is? Could it be that they were here in this land before anyone and then they were overcome by others and called heathens and savages and forced to speak a different language and forced to believe in something other than their religious beliefs and then to boot they were relagated to live on something called a reservation. Their lifestyle was stopped, for they could no longer roam the plains freely, and hunt for their food,as they had done down through time. They were told time after time that they were inferior, and savages that were wrong in their thinking all this time. My God, forgive our ancestors, and us for debilitating this once proud people! They are not the only ones who have been tourtured just for the mere premise of who thy are, look to the Africans, look to the Jews, and in this day and age, look to the Sudanese, only to mention a few.
When a human being is debased in the face of so called society is it any wonder why suicide seems to be the only option?
I tell you that the relinquishing of life is not the answer to your perceived misery. No matter what anyone tries to do to you to make you feel less than worthy, you must rise up and meet the challenge and tell those that put you down, to %#*# off 'cause you are not going to buy into that bull....! No one can take away your spirit! No one can take away the thing that makes you...you! Not ever. You will not allow it. You are stronger than any words. Words mean nothing when they are negative!
You are strong, you are not stupid, you will not stand for that "put down" mentality. You will rise up and fly with your strong spirit. Don't accept it when someone tries to put you down. You are better than all of that garbage! You are beautiful!!!!!!
Everyday is a new beginning, there is nothing that can stop you! There are no words that can make you feel bad. The only time you might feel bad is when your hear these words, for you will feel bad for the one who is speaking them. You will grow in compassion for these people who have verbally attacked you, for you know that they are the afflicted souls. They are afflicted with very low self esteem. One should pity them for they know not what they do!
Never give in to the desire to kill yourself, for you never know what wonders will come in your life, what joys will be yours to experience. It might just happen tomorrow, or next week or next month. Believe me, an unnatural death is not the way. Wait and see what the next chapter will hold for you. It could be magnificent! Stick around a while longer my freind, one never knows, do one?!! Yeah!!!!!!:woohoo:
I for one am glad that you are all here!
There are some who are afflicted with much more pain then I have ever felt and who will surely die, to those people, who cannot find any relief from this pain and who will die shortly, I might say, by all means find a way. But I can't truly speak for another being.
There are some and I speak of certain groups of people who have been so browbeaten as a race or age group that they feel that there is no hope. If you are into statistics, I can tell you that the Native Americans, or First Nation children are among the highest suicide rates in the US. Gee I wonder why that is? Could it be that they were here in this land before anyone and then they were overcome by others and called heathens and savages and forced to speak a different language and forced to believe in something other than their religious beliefs and then to boot they were relagated to live on something called a reservation. Their lifestyle was stopped, for they could no longer roam the plains freely, and hunt for their food,as they had done down through time. They were told time after time that they were inferior, and savages that were wrong in their thinking all this time. My God, forgive our ancestors, and us for debilitating this once proud people! They are not the only ones who have been tourtured just for the mere premise of who thy are, look to the Africans, look to the Jews, and in this day and age, look to the Sudanese, only to mention a few.
When a human being is debased in the face of so called society is it any wonder why suicide seems to be the only option?
I tell you that the relinquishing of life is not the answer to your perceived misery. No matter what anyone tries to do to you to make you feel less than worthy, you must rise up and meet the challenge and tell those that put you down, to %#*# off 'cause you are not going to buy into that bull....! No one can take away your spirit! No one can take away the thing that makes you...you! Not ever. You will not allow it. You are stronger than any words. Words mean nothing when they are negative!
You are strong, you are not stupid, you will not stand for that "put down" mentality. You will rise up and fly with your strong spirit. Don't accept it when someone tries to put you down. You are better than all of that garbage! You are beautiful!!!!!!
Everyday is a new beginning, there is nothing that can stop you! There are no words that can make you feel bad. The only time you might feel bad is when your hear these words, for you will feel bad for the one who is speaking them. You will grow in compassion for these people who have verbally attacked you, for you know that they are the afflicted souls. They are afflicted with very low self esteem. One should pity them for they know not what they do!
Never give in to the desire to kill yourself, for you never know what wonders will come in your life, what joys will be yours to experience. It might just happen tomorrow, or next week or next month. Believe me, an unnatural death is not the way. Wait and see what the next chapter will hold for you. It could be magnificent! Stick around a while longer my freind, one never knows, do one?!! Yeah!!!!!!:woohoo:
I for one am glad that you are all here!
retrorich
SUPER NOT-A-MOD
You are right, Gracie. My sincere apology to you. I should not have made that comment without further explanation. I was speaking from my own viewpoint. If I decide to commit suicide, I would not want anyone trying to persuade me from doing so, whether that person loved me or not. I especially resent society in general (and the government) for making it impossible for those wishing to take their lives to do so with minimum pain and maximum dignity through professional assistence.gracie said:
However, if you love someone whom you believe is contemplating suicide and try to prevent that by showing them love and understanding, you have every right to do so.
FREE DR. KAVORKIAN!
fromthe heart
Well-Known Member
This is my first opinion on this subject so here it is.
I feel suicide is an act of desperation and if the person who wants to die had an alternative they would choose otherwise. There are times of complete helplessness and hope is all gone...but if you just would wait for a new day you could feel different. I think it's a sad act and a Godless act. I,myself, HAVE had thoughts of "Father, I can't take it anymore;Please take me Home" or "I just want to go home to Heaven"...but I've come to lean to take my own life to me would be saying I no longer trust God to know what is best in my life NO MATTER WHAT kind of pain I may be in at that moment of desperation. God has tested me in this area and I'm still here so I guess I passed the test of that faith in His wisdom. It is so hard sometimes in life to even feel what is the use to go on...but then life is such a twist and turn road that around the next bend could be the best thing that has happened in your entire life and if you give yourself just a little time I think you see some light in what seems like a very dark time in your life.
When I was 20 I was at one of those horrible dark places...I couldn't imagine how life could hold anything of reason to go on for me and in 2 years I had the best thing in my life happen...had I killed myself I'd never have known the joy I felt in my daughter's birth ...Having her in my life changed me inside...I had a reason to go on. In 1990 I had gone off some medicine that I'd had to be on for 13 years and I lost it somehow and my husband caught me walking into the woods to hang myself....I couldn't be reasoned with...I WANTED to die!!! But in a few days when I got through the withdrawal of those meds. I couldn't believe that I wanted to do what I was trying to do. THREE days ago...my last time of wanting to die...I had a procedure to ease the pain from my back that failed. The pain was so bad that I had been without sleep for days...I sat all day and cried to God to take me home out of this agony...He said NO...I was put back on pain controlling medicine and my youngest grandson said his first word...It's been a struggle throughout my life with depression,pain and feelings of hopelessness and self worth was lacking....I would fight for life on good days so that only tells me that on those bad days (which I now call my self pity days) if I can just struggle through and not lose faith in God I will have more days of wanting life than days I don't.
When I hear about people who HAVE taken their lives and looked at the circumstances of what got them to that point...well someone could have helped them to get to a better point and give them some self worth. People generally are survivors and have a will to live and on those dark days they are in NEED of someone to be there to help them through if only to be supportive of how they are feeling inside. Suicide in it'self is WRONG...it's an act of desperation that would not have been chosen if an alternative had been offered. If someone commits suicide then they were let down by someone in their life because it says to me no one tried hard enough to help find a solution for the pain that person was in.
Not all suicides come from just this or that there are as many reasons to want to die as there are to want to live...but when you trust your life to God...you must have the faith in His judgement...it can be VERY hard at times but everyone who is alive has a purpose in the greater scheme of things that they can't see in those dark times. I can't say I know anyone who hasn't had one of those dark times and has come through it to feel they really DO have a reason to live.
Suicide in reasons of dying anyway...that's a personal deal...I don't understand why suffering in death has to be so I will not condemn anyone who is at death's door anyway wanting to just get it over with. I watched my grandmother wither away with 8 long months of cancer...she was in agony. her heart was strong so she held on longer than they expected. When she finally died she was about 60 pounds and just skin covering bone. I admire her for being so strong through it. I don't understand cancer and these devastating diseaese like it that take you slowly...but one day I know that there will be a person who is dying and science will find something and turn that dying person around into a survival story that will change history. It could be tomorrow...it could be years but I know the day will come when ONE person will start the survival story and be proud that they held on to be that person.
That's my feelings on the subject...sorry to be so long winded. Smile though because you are the most important person to someone whether you know it or not.
I feel suicide is an act of desperation and if the person who wants to die had an alternative they would choose otherwise. There are times of complete helplessness and hope is all gone...but if you just would wait for a new day you could feel different. I think it's a sad act and a Godless act. I,myself, HAVE had thoughts of "Father, I can't take it anymore;Please take me Home" or "I just want to go home to Heaven"...but I've come to lean to take my own life to me would be saying I no longer trust God to know what is best in my life NO MATTER WHAT kind of pain I may be in at that moment of desperation. God has tested me in this area and I'm still here so I guess I passed the test of that faith in His wisdom. It is so hard sometimes in life to even feel what is the use to go on...but then life is such a twist and turn road that around the next bend could be the best thing that has happened in your entire life and if you give yourself just a little time I think you see some light in what seems like a very dark time in your life.
When I was 20 I was at one of those horrible dark places...I couldn't imagine how life could hold anything of reason to go on for me and in 2 years I had the best thing in my life happen...had I killed myself I'd never have known the joy I felt in my daughter's birth ...Having her in my life changed me inside...I had a reason to go on. In 1990 I had gone off some medicine that I'd had to be on for 13 years and I lost it somehow and my husband caught me walking into the woods to hang myself....I couldn't be reasoned with...I WANTED to die!!! But in a few days when I got through the withdrawal of those meds. I couldn't believe that I wanted to do what I was trying to do. THREE days ago...my last time of wanting to die...I had a procedure to ease the pain from my back that failed. The pain was so bad that I had been without sleep for days...I sat all day and cried to God to take me home out of this agony...He said NO...I was put back on pain controlling medicine and my youngest grandson said his first word...It's been a struggle throughout my life with depression,pain and feelings of hopelessness and self worth was lacking....I would fight for life on good days so that only tells me that on those bad days (which I now call my self pity days) if I can just struggle through and not lose faith in God I will have more days of wanting life than days I don't.
When I hear about people who HAVE taken their lives and looked at the circumstances of what got them to that point...well someone could have helped them to get to a better point and give them some self worth. People generally are survivors and have a will to live and on those dark days they are in NEED of someone to be there to help them through if only to be supportive of how they are feeling inside. Suicide in it'self is WRONG...it's an act of desperation that would not have been chosen if an alternative had been offered. If someone commits suicide then they were let down by someone in their life because it says to me no one tried hard enough to help find a solution for the pain that person was in.
Not all suicides come from just this or that there are as many reasons to want to die as there are to want to live...but when you trust your life to God...you must have the faith in His judgement...it can be VERY hard at times but everyone who is alive has a purpose in the greater scheme of things that they can't see in those dark times. I can't say I know anyone who hasn't had one of those dark times and has come through it to feel they really DO have a reason to live.
Suicide in reasons of dying anyway...that's a personal deal...I don't understand why suffering in death has to be so I will not condemn anyone who is at death's door anyway wanting to just get it over with. I watched my grandmother wither away with 8 long months of cancer...she was in agony. her heart was strong so she held on longer than they expected. When she finally died she was about 60 pounds and just skin covering bone. I admire her for being so strong through it. I don't understand cancer and these devastating diseaese like it that take you slowly...but one day I know that there will be a person who is dying and science will find something and turn that dying person around into a survival story that will change history. It could be tomorrow...it could be years but I know the day will come when ONE person will start the survival story and be proud that they held on to be that person.
That's my feelings on the subject...sorry to be so long winded. Smile though because you are the most important person to someone whether you know it or not.