Tennessee bans lots of Drag Shows and gender-affirming care for kids

[fantome profane]

XX or XY?

i see someone trying to explain that it is not all black and white, and your response is to ask if it is black or white.

 

[Brian2]

That doesn't take into account any variations. It's why Republicans sound so damn stupid and ignorant because they think it can simple be summed up as XX is female and XY is male but Nature itself has never held that position or conformed to that belief. It's an erroneous human assumption.

It's just a way to speak about the biological sexual identity of someone. It's more than a human assumption to say that is someone is biologically a female then they are female biologically and the best way for society to go in indentification of that person is to call them female, even if later in life they might decide that they prefer to be male and to identify as male or that they have changed their mind and want to be again identified as female.
Our biological sexual identity is not a matter of what we think we are or what we would like to be.

 

[Kenny]

i see someone trying to explain that it is not all black and white, and your response is to ask if it is black or white.

What part of empirical and verifiable scientific evidence did you have difficulty with?

 

[Brian2]

How is sex, when done consensually and responsibly, "evil"? Because ancient goat herders arbitrarily decided it was?

So it's a matter of what is considered morally wrong, and that changes and has changed in the past couple of generations.
I'm sure you would agree.

 

[fantome profane]

These are LITTLE kids. The issue is not should they learn about these lifestyles. It's when, and how. And that is not for the drag queens or the church or some grandstanding governor to decide. I'm fine with the drag queens offering this experience. I think it's quite nice of them, in fact. But it should be understood that any parent that would not want their child to experience this would be respectfully free to forgo it. And as far as I know, that is the case.

And any parent who does want this experience for their child should be allowed, and that is what this bill bans. That is one of the many things that disgusts me. When they defend these kind of bills in terms of parental rights, they are in reality taking away parental rights. And making the lives of children that much more dull and grey. And that in itself is a tragedy. And as bad as that is there were be worse things to come.

 

[fantome profane]

What part of empirical and verifiable scientific evidence did you have difficulty with?

None

 

[Shadow Wolf]

It's just a way to speak about the biological sexual identity of someone. It's more than a human assumption to say that is someone is biologically a female then they are female biologically and the best way for society to go in indentification of that person is to call them female, even if later in life they might decide that they prefer to be male and to identify as male or that they have changed their mind and want to be again identified as female.
Our biological sexual identity is not a matter of what we think we are or what we would like to be.

Our biological sexual identity, many times that is not XX is girl and XY is boy. For starters there's way more variation than those two, and it doesn't matter. We still say boy or girl and people don't flip out despite the mismatch.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

What part of empirical and verifiable scientific evidence did you have difficulty with?

Things that are also scientifically verifiable:
Gender and sex are two distinct categories.

The latter having to do with a spectrum of gonadal and chromosomal traits that run the gamut of typically male, typically female, and intersex.

The former of which having to do with sociological and psychological identities which may or may not line up with sex characteristics. With intersex women or trans women often having XY chromosomes and visa versa for intersex men and trans men. As well as nonbinary that don't meet the psychological or sociological profile for man or woman.

You will not find any credible medical or research institution which says your sex determines your gender or visaversa. Nor is it reasonable to say we determine mam and woman in everyday life based on chromosomes as most of us have never been phenotyped. (In fact most universities have banned them because all too often students found out their chromosomal makeup didn't match their gonadal presentation. In other words, they were intersex.)

 

[Kenny]

Things that are also scientifically verifiable:
Gender and sex are two distinct categories.

i find no empirical and verifiable evidence for your position. If you are right, how many genders are there? And do you have scientific proof that they exist? (more than just someone who says it is real) I mean really empirical and verifiable and not just in the mind.

 

[Orbit]

XX or XY?

XXY or X0 is how that happens. It occurs in 1.5% of births, which amounts to a lot of intersexed people in a country of over 300 million.

 

[Orbit]

i find no empirical and verifiable evidence for your position. If you are right, how many genders are there? And do you have scientific proof that they exist? (more than just someone who says it is real) I mean really empirical and verifiable and not just in the mind.

Sex refers to biology. Gender refers to the meanings, roles, and expectations that society assigns to people of a certain sex.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

i find no empirical and verifiable evidence for your position. If you are right, how many genders are there? And do you have scientific proof that they exist? (more than just someone who says it is real) I mean really empirical and verifiable and not just in the mind.

You say "just in the mind" as if psychology doesn't specifically deal with what's in the mind. Do you also assert that depression doesn't exist because it's "just in the mind"?

Sex–gender distinction - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Causes of gender incongruence - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Brain Sex in Transgender Women Is Shifted towards Gender Identity - PMC

Transgender people report discomfort with their birth sex and a strong identification with the opposite sex. The current study was designed to shed further light on the question of whether the brains of transgender people resemble their birth sex or ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Sex and gender: Meanings, definition, identity, and expression

Sex and gender are different. Sex is assigned at birth, while gender is how a person identifies. Gender encompasses a broad spectrum. Learn more here.

www.medicalnewstoday.com

Is There Something Unique about the Transgender Brain?

Imaging studies and other research suggest that there is a biological basis for transgender identity

www.scientificamerican.com

Neurobiology of gender identity and sexual orientation - PMC

Sexual identity and sexual orientation are independent components of a person’s sexual identity. These dimensions are most often in harmony with each other and with an individual’s genital sex, although not always. The present review discusses the ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Stevicus]

For some reason, I'm not getting alerts for this thread, even though it's one of my watched threads. I posted about it in the software feedback thread.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

i find no empirical and verifiable evidence for your position.

Be honest, did you even look?

 

[Left Coast]

XXY or X0 is how that happens. It occurs in 1.5% of births, which amounts to a lot of intersexed people in a country of over 300 million.

The only statistic I can find right now on specifically chromosomal anomalies varying from XX or XY says that it's 1/1,666 births, ie 0.06%.

How common is intersex? | Intersex Society of North America

To answer this question in an uncontroversial way, you’d have to first get everyone to agree on what counts as intersex —and also to agree on what should count as strictly male or strictly female. That’s hard to do. How small does a penis have to be before it counts as intersex? Do you count...

isna.org

The higher number of 1.7% of births includes a wide range of other conditions.

Though I'm not sure how any of this discussion about rates is relevant to whether we should allow public drag shows.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

You say "just in the mind"

I don't get how that phrase has survived. We know enough today to know both that is literally true for the brain amd we can't just change things amd snap out of things, and things just being in the mind doesn't make the joy or suffering any less real.

 

[Father Heathen]

So it's a matter of what is considered morally wrong, and that changes and has changed in the past couple of generations.
I'm sure you would agree.

As we gain knowledge and understanding, the more developed our sense of morality becomes, yes.
It's why slavery was ended, women gained the right to vote, etc.
Unless you consider such progress evil as well.

 

[Brian2]

As we gain knowledge and understanding, the more developed our sense of morality becomes, yes.

No.

 

[Father Heathen]

I don't get how that phrase has survived. We know enough today to know both that is literally true for the brain amd we can't just change things amd snap out of things, and things just being in the mind doesn't make the joy or suffering any less real.

I wonder if they would be willing to tell a veteran with PTSD that it's not real, to stop faking, or just snap out off it.

 

[Father Heathen]

No.

So you're suggesting that ignorance is more virtuous than knowledge?