Terminology: the case for stopping using the word "religion" with no qualification.

[Father]

So it's about power then? Still doesn't add up. The word cult has too many modern negative connotations. I doubt all adherents will be willing to be labelled a "cult" simply for being Wiccan or something. Maybe some will have no issue, but it's still unhelpful. To call this a cult and that a religion when in all outward appearances both operate almost identically.
It's like labelling a Sedan a car but a Nissan something else based on nothing but sales figures.

if we have to categorize and label based on it. how about a cult has to have more than 1million followers to be a religion? or some number.

 

[SomeRandom]

if we have to categorize and label based on it. how about a cult has to have more than 1million followers to be a religion? or some number.

I dunno. Seems a bit arbitrary and the divide too inane.

 

[SomeRandom]

does not really matter if they themselves label themselves a cult. some consider no other faith but they're the true faith and all other's followers of false idols.
so they can label themselves what ever they want this is about everyone else.
furthermore, both do operate similarly. but what other than power to rank them by? there Gods are false unless provable so by power and influence is the only probable way

Perhaps. But proof of God's power is in the eye of the beholder.

 

[Father]

Perhaps. But proof of God's power is in the eye of the beholder.

yeah well for the sane and rational we will just organize by who has the most power, if we based it on who has most credibility or logic we would just be left with atheists agnostics and deists and maybe the ancient aliens guy

 

[LuisDantas]

And, it's also used to denote "a pursuit or interest to which someone ascribes supreme importance." (Source: Dictionary.com)
Personally, I usually take it to refer with some kind of organized theistic or deistic belief with a set of dogmas. Buddhism qualifies only because of it's long standing as a religion---its grandfathered in. So, in my estimation Scientology, as I understand it, although legally regarded as a religion, fails to qualify.

.

The trouble that I see with such a categorization is that it relies far too much on far too fragile and vague a concept.

Deities and even the supernatural as such as simply way too personal to sustain any consensual understanding of a concept such as "religion".

It is no coincidence that the Abrahamics keep doubting the sincerity of each other, since they try to take god-concepts so seriously. That is ultimately abusing those concepts, and it shows.

 

[Kemosloby]

You left out football.

 

[LuisDantas]

You left out football.

That would be ancient Aztec religion, would it not?

The Sacred Aztec Ball Game

 

[Kemosloby]

That would be ancient Aztec religion, would it not?

The Sacred Aztec Ball Game

No football is Abrahamic, Can't eat pig but you can throw ones skin around for fun.

 

[LuisDantas]

Excuse me?

 

[SomeRandom]

yeah well for the sane and rational we will just organize by who has the most power, if we based it on who has most credibility or logic we would just be left with atheists agnostics and deists and maybe the ancient aliens guy

I didn't say anything about credibility or logic. I said that proof is in the eye of the beholder.
Besides who decides on what quantifies as enough power to be a religion? Hinduism in India has a lot of influence. Islam has power in multiple countries, secularism is stumping the power Christianity used to have in the West.

 

[Father]

I didn't say anything about credibility or logic. I said that proof is in the eye of the beholder.
Besides who decides on what quantifies as enough power to be a religion? Hinduism in India has a lot of influence. Islam has power in multiple countries, secularism is stumping the power Christianity used to have in the West.

I said how about more than 1million followers qualifies as a religion. in the united states anyway you have to have a certain number

 

[SomeRandom]

I said how about more than 1million followers qualifies as a religion. in the united states anyway you have to have a certain number

Well I'm not American so I don't know. America is not the world, terminology should be useful and somewhat universal.
Cult today is usually associated with creepy.....well cults. It has changed so it's probably provlematic to label small religious movements as cults simply for being unpopular.

 

[Father]

Well I'm not American so I don't know. America is not the world, terminology should be useful and somewhat universal.
Cult today is usually associated with creepy.....well cults. It has changed so it's probably provlematic to label small religious movements as cults simply for being unpopular.

well there all cults. its just when a cult gets enough followers they get mad when you call it a cult

 

[proudpagan]

Do you feel that there is still a clear or consensual meaning for "religion"

Dharma is the eternal law of the cosmos, inherent in the very nature of things. There is no proper equivalent of Sanskrit word Dharma. There is difference between a religion a program and a sect.

 

[atanu]

Right now I feel that far too much of the effort spent in good will discussions is wasted because the word may well have lost its meaning due to a lot of abuse in various forms.

Depending on the person and perhaps on the context, "religion" is variously understood to be a virtual synonym for any of these other words and ideas, among others:

• Dogma
• Christianity
• Populist politics
• Theism / Belief in God
• Belief in an afterlife
• Social gatherings for prayer and worship

Many a thread has stalled without quite discussing its subject matter simply because people mean different things by "religion".

Do you feel that there is still a clear or consensual meaning for "religion"? If so, what can be done to lessen this confusion?

You always raise important points.

You are for long associated with this ‘Religiousforums’. So, what is your take? Under what context you continue to participate? Your view on the matter should be important for this thread.

 

[atanu]

Personally for me this definition works.

Religion is any cultural system of designated behaviors and practices, world views, texts, sanctified places, ethics, or organizations, that relate humanity to the supernatural or transcendental.
Religion - Wikipedia
........

So, adding one or more context/s to the term to define the scope and boundaries may help. Or it may not help, since nature of mental thoughts and the words thereof is to diversify all the time.

 

[SomeRandom]

well there all cults. its just when a cult gets enough followers they get mad when you call it a cult

Lol
I don't know if many groups like the title "cult" these days. I think Jokestown spoiled it for everyone

 

[Rye_P]

"In our 'beloved' country, religion can simply translated as Islam, Buddhist, Hindu, Christian, Catholic, and Confucius. Else will be refer to belief, no matter what. It's the only six recognized religion in our country" >> It create a havoc between me and beloved prof. It's stupid and make no sense, but still it's a legal base for our understanding of religion.

However our dictionary define religion as "a system that regulates the order of faith (belief) and worship of God Almighty and the rules related to the interaction of man and man and the environment". I do think they need to revised this definition in term of "God Almighty" and the amount of follower.

 

[HonestJoe]

Right now I feel that far too much of the effort spent in good will discussions is wasted because the word may well have lost its meaning due to a lot of abuse in various forms.

That’s true of pretty much any word though. Serious or important discussions always require mutually recognised context and full clarification or qualification of concepts.

 

[LuisDantas]

That’s true of pretty much any word though. Serious or important discussions always require mutually recognised context and full clarification or qualification of concepts.

True enough. But except perhaps internally in specific subsets, that is a remarkable difficult challenge for this word, "religion".