The concept of superstition

[Epic Beard Man]

Did you know that we can artificially induce such OOBE in the lab? They tend to happen when the signals between different parts of the brain get out of sync.

But yes, it is a wonderful boot hough about a century old.

Sure. I'm also aware if a surgeon opens my skull up they can tap in centers of my brain where I can experience things based on areas of my brain. It does not discount the independent experiences of the millions of people.

 

[viole]

Sure. In my own personal belief God can appear to any human or creature in this universe as anything for the comfort of their mind. I suppose it would be cruel in the sense for God to appear like a Xenomorph considering Xenomorphs are not common in Hindu beliefs. BTW this is a xenomorph:

View attachment 26934

So, it could be that what you experienced was, in fact, Kali in disguise. Or Bob.

Correct?

Ciao

- viole

 

[Audie]

In Islam all superstitions are strictly forbitten.

But it is very difficult for the human mind to be absolutely devoid of superstitions.

Looked from the point of view of an atheist, even atheist who swears there is no God has superstitions on some level.

Can one draw a clear line between faith in God and superstition?

Does your religion condemn superstitions? Feel free to quote scriptures.

That is funny. All superstitions except Islam are forbidden.

An atheist who "swears" there is no god is not
suuperstitious. He is a idiot.

 

[Audie]

Why?

Lets try a simple example: "This check really-really will not bounce".

 

[Audie]

No.

From my perspective, most belief in God is superstition.

All belief except for what you believe, or what?

 

[Remté]

Irrelevant. Such is not a belief about the supernatural. Can you give *any* belief in the supernatural that isn't 'extremely credulous'?

Extremely credulous is a highly subjective term.

 

[Audie]

Extremely credulous is a highly subjective term.

So give us an example of an objective or even merely
vaguely credulous belief in any "supernatural"
thing or event.

From my opinion, once you are credulous to believe
in gods and supernatural, you've gone over the
edge into yes, extreme credulity. Because,
similarly imo, that is what it takes. Serious,
deep, and rather brainless credulity.

 

[Revoltingest]

In Islam all superstitions are strictly forbitten.

"Forbitten"?

That would mean that Islam forbids Islam.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

How is it superstition?

Because god-believers often approach God with the same attitude as the practices that we all agree are superstitious.

What's the difference between praying to God for protection and wearing a talisman to ward off evil? Or between praying for good fortune and rubbing a rabbit's foot? Or reflexively saying "peace be upon him" when you say the name of Muhammad and reflexively throwing spilled salt over your shoulder? Nothing but the choice of props, AFAICT.

 

[Erebus]

In Islam all superstitions are strictly forbitten.

But it is very difficult for the human mind to be absolutely devoid of superstitions.

Looked from the point of view of an atheist, even atheist who swears there is no God has superstitions on some level.

Can one draw a clear line between faith in God and superstition?

Does your religion condemn superstitions? Feel free to quote scriptures.

Superstition can be a tricky concept to unpack. This is compounded by the fact that from what I know of Islam, there tend to be subtle variations in meaning that don't necessarily match common understandings among non-Muslims. It may be that due to cultural/translation differences, the Muslim concept of superstition is different to my own.

So, with that caveat out of the way I'll tackle this as best I can.

In its most general sense, superstition refers to a belief in the supernatural. Most (though not all) god concepts can be regarded as in some way supernatural and therefore would also be superstitious. An example of non-superstitious god belief here might be certain forms of pantheism.

Another way of interpreting superstition is as magical thinking. "If I walk under this ladder, my lottery ticket won't win any money." Or as it relates to deity perhaps something along the lines of, "If I say my prayers, good things will happen to me." In this context, slightly fewer god concepts would be superstitious in nature as you've added the requirement that a god is (or is at least perceived to be) interventionist as well as supernatural. An example of non-superstitious god belief here might be certain forms of deism.

In either case, belief in a god doesn't always equate to superstition. However, there are an awful lot of god concepts that would, to some degree, be superstitious.

 

[Revoltingest]

If one or a few people do something, it is a superstition. If many people do it, it is a religious ritual.

Belief in a deity is a type of superstition similar in many ways to belief in gnomes or unicorns. There is just as much evidence for them all as far as I can see.

This is analogous to my discerning between "cult" & "religion".
The former becomes the latter upon reaching a certain threshold
of members acquired & real estate owned.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

All belief except for what you believe, or what?

It isn't about what I believe. If a theist doesn't pray to their god - or perform other rituals or incantations - for changes to the world, I probably wouldn't consider them as engaging in superstition.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Another way of interpreting superstition is as magical thinking. "If I walk under this ladder, my lottery ticket won't win any money." Or as it relates to deity perhaps something along the lines of, "If I say my prayers, good things will happen to me."

Or "if I say a blessing after I say the name of the prophet, God will bless me ten times in return."

 

[Willamena]

Why is the burden of proof on the one making the positive existence claim? Because it is far too easy to make wild claims that can neither be proved nor disproved. I may claim there are invisible elves in my kitchen. That doesn't mean I should be taken seriously unless you can *prove* there are none. The burden is on *me* to show they exist, not on your to show they do not.

There is no [fill in thing here] is a positive existence claim. It posits a world without a [fill in thing here] in it. That said, we are not obliged to provide proof of, or even indulge, statements that engage imaginary, fictional, absurd, or mythic characters, or characters whose existence is uncertain. That's where the burden gets lifted: on the nature of the beast, not on denying the nature of the beast.

Edit: The opposite of positive, in the context of burden of proof, which deals with truth values, is normative, not negative. It's the statement of fact that bears the burden. The statement on which no truth value can stick is the normative.

 

[Quintessence]

The term "superstitious" isn't part of my vocabulary for much the same reason why "idolatry" isn't part of my vocabulary. Both are pejorative terms used to describe other people's cultural traditions that some other party finds disagreeable in some way... frequently misunderstanding the underlying cultural phenomena in the process. So-called "superstitions" are part of the myth* making process which in turn is an important component of cultural traditions and rituals. In general if you think something is "superstition" you aren't looking hard enough for the underlying reasons behind it - the tales are always grounded in folk wisdom or cultural values somewhere. To be fair, those underlying reasons sometimes get lost to history and we just don't know what wisdom the story was meant to convey. We keep them alive because tradition has value in of itself to many of us, even if the original reason for adopting the story no longer holds true.

*As a reminder, "myth" in the context of discussing religion does not mean falsehood. It means a sacred story intended to convey important truths or lessons valued in a culture. They are typically presented in a literary fashion rich with symbolism and allegory.

 

[Willamena]

The Atheism people have no positive facts to prove that "there is no God".
Do they, please?
Regards

That "there is no God" is the pertinent fact. Facts are believed. How would it represent a superstitious belief?

 

[Erebus]

Or "if I say a blessing after I say the name of the prophet, God will bless me ten times in return."

Precisely.

 

[Audie]

It isn't about what I believe. If a theist doesn't pray to their god - or perform other rituals or incantations - for changes to the world, I probably wouldn't consider them as engaging in superstition.

Sorry-ah,I meant 'you" in general, not you in particular.

 

[Audie]

Because god-believers often approach God with the same attitude as the practices that we all agree are superstitious.

What's the difference between praying to God for protection and wearing a talisman to ward off evil? Or between praying for good fortune and rubbing a rabbit's foot? Or reflexively saying "peace be upon him" when you say the name of Muhammad and reflexively throwing spilled salt over your shoulder? Nothing but the choice of props, AFAICT.

Seriously! How is it NOT superstition?

 

[Sanzbir]

I realized that I developed my own superstition and ritual in my work place.

As a background, I was hired after a lot of people left the IT department, a combination of quitting, firings, and a death. Part of my job involved deploying new internal web sites to the server. The problem: No one alive knew how to exactly do this given the settings on the server and network.

So through a long two days of trial and error and tweaking settings and values, I ended up with a document titled "HOW TO DEPLOY A NEW WEBSITE" that listed a series of steps in order to successfully deploy a given internal website. I have followed these exact steps religiously for four years now in my job whenever deploying a new site comes up.

Now... the thing is I've come to suspect that some of these steps are unnecessary. Maybe even half of the steps listed are unnecessary for deploy. But: It works. So I follow the ritual when it comes up. The time investment of doing experimentation to figure out what is strictly necessary and what is strictly not is not worth my time, since deploying a new internal web site is something that happens maybe once every 3 or 4 months, and I've gotten so adept at doing the steps in the ritual order that it only takes me 30 minutes to perform the correct superstitious ritual in order to run a new deploy.

I've come to suspect that things like this is how superstition and ritual is born. It works, so let's continue to do it. Do we need to do all of this?? No, but it works. So let's keep at it.