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The Failed Messiah Crusades

Trailblazer

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
EtuMalku said:
I can tell you this, any religious faith that does not accept homosexuality, transgenderism, and oppresses women cannot possibly be THE religion.
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Why do you think that THE religion would accept homosexuality as lawful? Do you also think it should accept sex out of wedlock? God reveals Laws for a reason.
 
EtuMalku

EtuMalku

Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
Trailblazer said:
Why do you think that THE religion would accept homosexuality as lawful? Do you also think it should accept sex out of wedlock? God reveals Laws for a reason.
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Of course It should. This is not 100 A.D. Why would there be something wrong with same sex marriage, or unmarried sex? That is prehistoric thinking.
 
crossfire

crossfire

LHP Mercuræn Feminist Heretic Bully ☿
Premium Member
EtuMalku said:
I think not. There are no messiahs on the Left Hand Path.
I really can't comment much on your faith, as it is too new and I haven't studied it enough.
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I would certainly recommend looking into it.
 
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Trailblazer

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
EtuMalku said:
Of course It should. This is not 100 A.D. Why would there be something wrong with same sex marriage, or unmarried sex? That is prehistoric thinking.
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Why do you think it is prehistoric thinking, because you don't like the idea that sex should be regulated? The damage that unregulated sex does to society is clearly apparent - abortion, adultery, broken families, venereal diseases.

“The proper use of the sex instinct is the natural right of every individual, and it is precisely for this very purpose that the institution of marriage has been established. The Bahá'ís do not believe in the suppression of the sex impulse but in its regulation and control.” Lights of Guidance (second part): A Bahá'í Reference File, pp. 364-365

The following law is from Bahá'u'lláh's Book of Laws.

“The Bahá’í teachings on sexual morality centre on marriage and the family as the bedrock of the whole structure of human society and are designed to protect and strengthen that divine institution. Bahá’í law thus restricts permissible sexual intercourse to that between a man and the woman to whom he is married.” The Kitáb-i-Aqdas, p. 223
 
RestlessSoul

RestlessSoul

Well-Known Member
EtuMalku said:
I tend to believe facts rather than stories.
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But you started this thread with a story, or series of stories; which you then interpreted, in a manner supportive of a theory or belief. This is exactly what all religious people do, and all historians come to that.

Happy Christmas btw.
 
firedragon

firedragon

Veteran Member
RestlessSoul said:
This is exactly what all religious people do, and all historians come to that.
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Thats a fallacy of hasty generalisation. Bigotry. I think you should instead try to educate yourself more about what you are talking about. I know you won't, but prior to making generalisations like that, it is a better approach.
 
C

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
EtuMalku said:
By the first century A.D., the Jews were looking for strong, magnetic leaders who could deliver them from the wrath of the Roman Empire. The Essenes developed the idea of a messiah figure that would provide this. Several Jewish leaders were set to take over after the death of the Jewish King Herod, who primarily worked for the Romans. To qualify as a messiah, someone needed to be from the bloodline of King David. None of the descendants of King David and their misled disciples succeeded, and most were killed.

While these messiah figures drew support from the claim they descended from King David, wherein Judaic tradition did this claim that Davidic pedigree was necessary to become a Messiah come from? When King David ruled Israel (circa 10th century B.C.E.), the conviction arose that his progeny would “rule forever, not only over Israel but also over all the nations”.

One that stands out is a former slave of King Herod by the name of Simon of Perea. Simon was the first heretical Jew who managed to convince a large portion of the Jews that he was the King of Jews and Jehova's Messiah. When the Roman Empire caught wind of this they dispatched military units to put an end to this claim. They would eventually corner and behead Simon in 4 B.C.

Anthronges was another deified Messiah who waged a serious war against the Roman Empire and also lost. Next came Yeshua the Nazarene. Proclaiming himself king of the Jews, Yeshua was eventually hunted down and crucified. Oddly enough, Yeshua was far from a warrior, would never be able to lead men in battle or control the logistics of a military campaign. Had King David met Yeshua, he would have been greatly disappointed with the gentle ideas of this self-proclaimed messiah.

New Testament scholar, Bart Ehrman, eloquently stated:
"To call Jesus the messiah was for most Jews completely ludicrous. Jesus was not the powerful leader of the Jews. He was a weak and powerless nobody—executed in the most humiliating and painful way devised by the Romans, the ones with the real power.”

After Yeshua there came a dozen other Messianic campaigns, none of which are publicized by the Abrahamic faith, and all of which ultimately failed. Theudas in 58 C.E., Menachem ben Judah ben Hezekiah, Simon ben Kosevah, Moses of Crete, Abu Isa, Al-Ra'i" ("the shepherd of the flock of his people"), Saüra the Syrian, to name a few.

Ultimately, there has never been a true Jewish messiah because they all failed in their missions and were killed by the Romans. Yeshua (Jesus) failed as a messiah and stood in a long line of failed messiahs.
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Old Testament messianic prophecies quoted in the New Testament - Wikipedia

https://www.quora.com/How-many-year...-it-became-a-reality-just-as-he-said-it-would

You claim that the Essenes, in the first century, created the prediction of a Messiah to free Jews from Romans. Yet, the prediction of a Messiah predates that event, according to the Quora source, above, but doesn't predate it according to the Wikipedia source, above.

The dates of Messianic predictions is just as muddled as the issues at hand.

What Old Testament Prophecies Predicted Jesus?

Old Testament references referred to the Messiah as the "annointed one." (source above).

If a qualification to be a Messiah is to be the "king of the Jews" and the qualification to be "king of the Jews" is to be of the bloodline of King Herod (or that particular King Herod), then you might say that the Messiah would have to be of the bloodline of the tribe of David. However, isn't it possible that the king of the Jews could be of a different tribe? Or, isn't it possible that the Messiah isn't the king of the Jews? Some texts say that Jesus was the king of the Jews, but Jews, today, beg to differ. While it might be that Jesus was a rabbi (or not), that doesn't make him the king of the Jews.

Kings usually descend from male blood lines. Jesus is Jewish, on mom's side, and perhaps Jewish on dad's side, as well (that is, God was his father). Yet, God doesn't appear to be a direct descendant of the tribe of David. Does this disqualify Jesus to be the King of the Jews?

Magnetic personality? Hmm...might explain walking on water, and Moses parting the Red Sea with his brother Aaron's staff. Salt water could become magnetic due to an induced current, just as an aluminum ring could become magnetic by electromagnetic induction, though typically aluminum is not generally thought of as a magnetic material.
 
C

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
EtuMalku said:
Ego, in and of itself is the balance between Id (reptilian/animal/instinctual) and Superego (inflated, megalomania, delusion of grandeur). A balanced, contained Ego is desired. Where the Ego can fail is when it is not Individuated. It then becomes the reflection of our false-self and not our True-Self, and becomes a projection of our compulsions and our shadows. The Western Left Hand Path is not to give up on or surrender the Ego, also not to overly focus on Ego, but to synchronize, synthesize, and expand Ego to reflect our Greater Self.
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Thank goodness psychology is a pseudoscience.
 
C

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
Conscious thoughts said:
To become one with God, one has to let go of the Ego/self and all attachments one holds to this physical world, in my understanding
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Perhaps God is one with His children, and we have to not be one with ourselves to emulate and understand Him? That is, we must think of others, not ourselves.
 
C

Clara Tea

Well-Known Member
firedragon said:
Thats a fallacy of hasty generalisation. Bigotry. I think you should instead try to educate yourself more about what you are talking about. I know you won't, but prior to making generalisations like that, it is a better approach.
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I think that even a liar may speak the truth on occasion. I also believe that when science, religion, philosophy, and psychology all agree, perhaps they are all right. Some theists believe that science is the enemy of religion. Sure, it refutes a lot of beliefs (age of the Shroud of Turin is wrong to have been Jesus's), but science also confirms much.
 
RestlessSoul

RestlessSoul

Well-Known Member
firedragon said:
Thats a fallacy of hasty generalisation. Bigotry. I think you should instead try to educate yourself more about what you are talking about. I know you won't, but prior to making generalisations like that, it is a better approach.
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No need to get offended. Perhaps you have misunderstood; perhaps I didn’t express myself clearly enough. I’ll try again;

Interpreting narratives, is a method by which religious people and historians extrapolate meaning from ancient texts. It’s at the core of what they do, though of course religious scholars and secular historians have different methodologies. Still, they find meaning in stories.

Just as we all search for meaning, in the stories we tell ourselves about the world and our place in it.
 
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