The Firmament that the Bible Describes is Real

[Soandso]

"The shot is safe and effective" was a joke. -- But we can argue about that in the vaccine section.
If you want proof that the scientific community has been corrupted, the existence of the firmament is great proof.

So as a hospital worker it was mandatory for me to get the vaccine and the boosters. I went with Moderna. The people who were hot the hardest were the unvaccinated, from what I saw. It didn't mean that vaccinated people wouldn't get sick, because they still would, but if people were old or had health issues and weren't vaccinated in the hospital... It was a rough ride for them. There were a few times when the ICU was filled almost entirely with intubated people, and the vast majority of them weren't vaccinated. I will never forget that

 

[ChristineM]

The FDA has a lot of power in controlling what the "consensus" says. just look at the whole COVID mess.

I knew people who died of the whole covid mess because they took notice of idiots rather than expert's

 

[Soandso]

I knew people who died of the whole covid mess because they took notice of idiots rather than expert's

Me too, including family

 

[HonestJoe]

@HonestJoe how the seasons on the flat earth work because of the firmament.

The Seasons video seems to ignore the fact that the seasons in the Southern hemisphere are the opposite way around to the Northern hemisphere. Another major issue would be the distance between the Sun and any point on the Earth being illuminated would change massively, yet the Sun appears pretty much the same size to us from anywhere in the world at any time of year. Most significantly, it also doesn't even try to explain how or why the Sun is able to move in such varying directions and velocities.

I'm not entirely sure what the Day/Night video is meant to be saying at all. The fact that shining a light on to the top of a glass dome has a similar pattern of light doesn't support the idea of a close light above a flat Earth.

The Celestial Refraction video is similarly vague, highlighting the effect of a dome lens but making zero attempt to relate that to anything in the real world. It isn't evidence of anything.

Yet again, the approach is the same; A scatter-gun of individual claims, ideas and concepts focusing on a single aspect alone but without any clear and definitive hypothesis for them to apply to. One of the videos starts with a old flat Earth map but where are the modern versions, fully measured and scaled like all of the globe Earth maps we have (you wouldn't even have the complication of needing projections)? Where are the calculations to determining exactly what the Sun is in relation to the Earth throughout the year? Where are the hypotheses about what the Sun is made of and why it moves in the way it does? Also, though you chose to include this in a thread about the Firmament, nothing in any of those videos make any formal reference to it, or attempt to explain what it is or how it influences the observations.

Without those detailed scientific models and calculations, your claims can't be properly tested. It's almost as if you don't want them to be.

 

[Mock Turtle]

I don't have permits to travel to freely explore there and don't have the millions of dollars required to get the permits.
Flights are also restricted due to the Antarctic Treaty and as you pointed out airliners make a bunch of excuses not to go there.

I might have missed a comment, but you presumably don't accept the reason as to why access to the Antarctic is so strict - so as ensure it doesn't get polluted like so much else? So another conspiracy theory to add to your list.

 

[ChristineM]

Me too, including family

And still idiots mock the precautions advised

 

[Soandso]

And still idiots mock the precautions advised

Well the problem is that most folks just treated it like a cold or a flu. In the beginning it's not so bad, but there's always a day that comes where it hits like a ton of bricks. If you are healthy, you could usually weather it just fine - albeit sometimes with loss of smell/taste or shortness of breath, but if you weren't healthy or struggled with other things like asthma it got a lot worse

 

[ChristineM]

Well the problem is that most folks just treated it like a cold or a flu. In the beginning it's not so bad, but there's always a day that comes where it hits like a ton of bricks. If you are healthy, you could usually weather it just fine - albeit sometimes with loss of smell/taste or shortness of breath, but if you weren't healthy or struggled with other things like asthma it got a lot worse

Yup, unfortunately not everyone is 100% healthy.

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

I have a Bachelors degree in science by the way from Dixie State University - now known as Utah Tech University.

But you don't trust science, and your degree is in art.

Here is a peer reviewed journal article from the Journal of College Science Teaching. http://www2.lv.psu.edu/jxm57/pdf/POV-Sept06.pdf
This is very much a mainstream view and with that being the case, they admit there is no proof the earth is a globe.

Peer reviewed journal article? You're misrepresenting something again through omission. It's not science. It's basically a magazine article. And I suspect you linked to it to imply that science shouldn't be trusted.

Feel free to try and refute the evidence I presented in the OP.

What evidence? Those links to videos? TL;DW. Summarize your claims in each. That's as much time as I'm willing to give you. I've seen some of your argument here and on your flat earth thread, which is further disincentive to look at those videos. I already know that you are wrong about the earth, so you need to provide an incentive to watch one of those videos. Your science is reminiscent of Hovind's:

If you want proof that the scientific community has been corrupted, the existence of the firmament is great proof. You can't have air pressure next to a vacuum without a container.

You should understand that comments like this irreversibly disqualify you as a trustworthy source for science. You might consider that unfair and closed-minded, but the spherical shape of the earth is settled science. You might consider that unfair as well, since you have little respect for academia, but that's the way it is when you promote a demonstrably false belief. The creationists post unfalsifiable beliefs about gods, but you've posted a falsifiable and falsified belief.

There's a term in the philosophy of argumentation called ethos. It refers to the meta-messages a speaker or writer sends his audience in addition to the explicit meaning of his argument, such as does he seem knowledgeable, does he seem sincere, does he seem credible, does he seem trustworthy, does he seem competent, does he show good judgment, does he seem to have a hidden agenda, is he more interested in convincing with impartial argument or persuading with emotive language or specious argumentation, and the like.

I don't sense a hidden agenda. You're promoting biblical cosmology. But your methods have been a little shady as I discussed. You probably disagree, but you misrepresented the paper you linked to in my estimation, you've misrepresented the scientific community, and though you published your diploma, one has to read it to know that your bachelors in science was not in any science.

But the most damning is the errors of science. If you don't know that the earth is a sphere and that there is no dome over it, you have nothing to say on the subject worth serious consideration. You don't understand how gravity can keep an atmosphere on a moon or a planet with a magnetic field to deflect the solar wind.

You can't have air pressure next to a vacuum without a container.

Are you suggesting that Venus is in a container? Cassini orbited the Saturn and found no firmament holding its atmosphere onto the planet. It then dropped a probe onto Titan, a moon with an atmosphere, and it penetrated no container.

If you are refering to mainstream academia, I think it is provably and legitimately corrupted.

Everybody at odds with science says something similar, including creationists, climate deniers, and vaccine deniers. Is it safe to assume that you never took a Covid vaccine?

Do you agree with me that the FDA is corrupt? How about the CIA and FBI? The World Health Organization?

Irrelevant to what the scientific community is doing. This is also a common trope for demeaning science - calling what government and industry does with science also science.

"The hardest part about understanding scientific theories and hypotheses seems to be this: a hypothesis is never proven correct, nor is a theory ever proven to be true. Words like prove, correct, and true should be removed from our vocabulary completely and immediately"

And I presume that this is quoted for the same reason - to imply that scientific facts, laws, and theories shouldn't accepted. After all, science can't prove a thing, so it shouldn't be highly regarded.

"The shot is safe and effective" was a joke.

More attempts to diminish science. The vaccines saved lives, and were safer than acquiring Covid-19. Safe is a relative term. I know two people with severe vaccine reactions that laid them up for days to weeks, both still alive, and hundreds who got it also still alive, as well as two who refused and are dead.

Compare the morbidity and mortality of the two cohorts. Here's the tale of a kindred spirit, who also doesn't trust science: Tonya Wise, 51, Woodbine, MD, Anti-vaxxer, Dead from COVID This appeared on her Facebook page last summer. She's also a Christian and Trump supporter, and now dead of Covid.

 

[Soandso]

Yup, unfortunately not everyone is 100% healthy.

Thankfully those days over. We went from having entire units dedicated to COVID patients to only having a handful of patients total. During the height of covid the ICU, CCU, post-op, and pre-op floors were completely dedicated to housing COVID patients. Every so often we'd have an outbreak that would shut down entire floors, too. Bad days

I feel most people have already moved on and don't want to think about it. Like I said, though, I'll never forget that till the day I die

 

[ChristineM]

Thankfully those days over. We went from having entire units dedicated to COVID patients to only having a handful of patients total. During the height of covid the ICU, CCU, post-op, and pre-op floors were completely dedicated to housing COVID patients. Every so often we'd have an outbreak that would shut down entire floors, too. Bad days

I feel most people have already moved on and don't want to think about it. Like I said, though, I'll never forget that till the day I die

So you were at the sharp end. I admit such bravery.

 

[F1fan]

Hey, it is mainstream academia that declares its own stupidity.
http://www2.lv.psu.edu/jxm57/pdf/POV-Sept06.pdf

View attachment 79863

View attachment 79862

"The shot is safe and effective" was a joke. -- But we can argue about that in the vaccine section.
If you want proof that the scientific community has been corrupted, the existence of the firmament is great proof.
You can't have air pressure next to a vacuum without a container.

So scientists can’t prove anything but flat earthers can?

 

[Soandso]

So you were at the sharp end. I admit such bravery.

Well ours is the largest/best equipped hospital west of Seattle, so everyone west of Seattle comes to us for the more serious stuff. From the stories I'd heard, Seattle and Tacoma's hospitals had been hit harder than we had. Population density was a huge factor in those days

 

[Flat Earth Kyle]

So scientists can’t prove anything but flat earthers can?

I don't speak on behalf of all flat earthers, but unlike mainstream academia, I have no problem declaring, "My cat eats food" is a provably true statement!

 

[Flat Earth Kyle]

View attachment 79866View attachment 79868

Do you realize those are anti-vax memes?

 

[Flat Earth Kyle]

. You might consider that unfair as well, since you have little respect for academia, but that's the way it is when you promote a demonstrably false belief. The creationists post unfalsifiable beliefs about gods, but you've posted a falsifiable and falsified belief.

"Some cats eat food" is a provable unfalsifiable fact. Karl Popper was wrong.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I don't speak on behalf of all flat earthers, but unlike mainstream academia, I have no problem declaring, "My cat eats food" is a provably true statement!

Okay, how do you prove it? You might want to define what you mean by "prove" Depending upon the definition that you want to use scientists may have "proved" the Globe Earth.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Do you realize those are anti-vax memes?

That was sort of the point.

 

[F1fan]

I don't speak on behalf of all flat earthers, but unlike mainstream academia, I have no problem declaring, "My cat eats food" is a provably true statement!

It’s also proven that your cat eats food on a planet. But you reject this fact because you want to interpret an ancient text literally.

And did you see my post where I made the point that Einstein not only accepted the fact of gravity, but that his theory of relativity depends exclusively on gravity being real.

 

[Flat Earth Kyle]

Hey

It’s also proven that your cat eats food on a planet. But you reject this fact because you want to interpret an ancient text literally.

And did you see my post where I made the point that Einstein not only accepted the fact of gravity, but that his theory of relativity depends exclusively on gravity being real.

Hey, look at that, with your use of the word proven you reject mainstream academia. Welcome to the club!