The goodness of God

[Meesheltx]

I know its rather broad and vague, but I believe in goodness.
I could not believe in the Christian God or any other that i have found described, because to me, they do not exhibit "goodness." I will only talk about the Christian God because that is the only subject I feel informed enough to talk about. There are parts of the old testament...especially in dueteronomy (please don't pay attention to my spelling!), that really show how immoral God is. I know, I know, "Things changed in the new testament..." but it was still the same God that said/did those things. So, is goodness just whatever God says? If you answer yes, then I would be very confused, because what is "right and good" is naturally so. What is good should not be that way just because it was decided. If somebody could explain to me how a belief in pure goodness could co-exist with the existence of the Christian God, I would greatly apprciate it.
...I hope all of that came out like I was wanting...

I'm new to this forum...so please understand if i'm not using the typical format for this kind of thing!

 

[michel]

Hi Meesheltx,

Nice to meet you! I don't remember welcoming you to the forum, so I will do so now.

I hope you enjoy yourself here.

As concerns your post, It is rather coincidental that I have a thread running :-
Religious Education / Debate / Religious Debates / General Religious Debates I need some help, please
http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20834

Which addresses much the same point as yours - I feel we are experiencing much the same confusion..............

And You are using the right format! - don't be scared to ask - anything you don't understand, just ask.

 

[Quiddity]

Let me give it a shot:

1. He's really, really different than we are-a point stressed in Scripture (Num. 23:19, 1 Sam 15:29, Is 55:9).
2. Because God is so different, he uses accommodated language to help us understand what he is like.
3. Scripture language about God tends to be anthropomorphic; that is, it speaks of God as if he were human.

Lets start there and let me know your thoughts.

~Victor

 

[Kowalski]

God has no goodness as thought of in human terms, because god is not human, God has only indifference towards all living enteties, this is because God is not there for the good deluded folks who believe god is. God acts only through the laws of physics, because god is the laws themsleves.

God is everywhere and nowhere.

Cheers

K

 

[Kowalski]

Let me give it a shot:

1. He's really, really different than we are-a point stressed in Scripture (Num. 23:19, 1 Sam 15:29, Is 55:9).
2. Because God is so different, he uses accommodated language to help us understand what he is like.
3. Scripture language about God tends to be anthropomorphic; that is, it speaks of God as if he were human.

Lets start there and let me know your thoughts.

~Victor

Here's a thought, who do you think made all that stuff up ?

K

 

[michel]

Here's a thought, who do you think made all that stuff up ?

K

Kowalski, Are you sure you are not related to Einstein ? ...........

 

[Meesheltx]

Thanks for the welcome!

First of all, if God created us, he knows our level of intelligence and what we can and can't understand...and how we would most likely perceive things that were written...so I am assuming that the bible was written to be perceived in the most logical way according to us.

To me, perfection means flawlessness. But wouldn't you consider anger, jealousy, wrath, rage, etc. to all be negative things? How could an aboslutely perfect being encompass these traits? If that is the way to explain him as human...imagine how much more magnified and terrible those traits are at the godly level.

Also, how could it ever be okay to hurt children? (Psalm 137:9)
How could it be okay to kill people for having sex before marriage, or for being "stubborn and rebellious" Since when is it justifiable to kill somebody for not believe in your god and even trying to convert others to his belief. ...All of these examples are found indueteronomy along with many other examples of things that seem to me to be immoral no matter what the society or time was like.

 

[Quiddity]

Here's a thought, who do you think made all that stuff up ?

K

All what stuff?

~Victor

 

[Kowalski]

Kowalski, Are you sure you are not related to Einstein ? ...........

It's a possiblity, but only a spiritual one

Cheers

K

 

[Kowalski]

All what stuff?

~Victor

All that stuff you quoted from the Bible

K

 

[Faint]

Thanks for the welcome!

First of all, if God created us, he knows our level of intelligence and what we can and can't understand...and how we would most likely perceive things that were written...so I am assuming that the bible was written to be perceived in the most logical way according to us.

To me, perfection means flawlessness. But wouldn't you consider anger, jealousy, wrath, rage, etc. to all be negative things? How could an aboslutely perfect being encompass these traits? If that is the way to explain him as human...imagine how much more magnified and terrible those traits are at the godly level.

Also, how could it ever be okay to hurt children? (Psalm 137:9)
How could it be okay to kill people for having sex before marriage, or for being "stubborn and rebellious" Since when is it justifiable to kill somebody for not believe in your god and even trying to convert others to his belief. ...All of these examples are found indueteronomy along with many other examples of things that seem to me to be immoral no matter what the society or time was like.

Meesh, good points. I agree. Based on what is written in the Bible, I don't think it would be so far-fetched to assume that God is leaning more towards evil--not goodness.

 

[Dentonz]

Thanks for the welcome!


To me, perfection means flawlessness. But wouldn't you consider anger, jealousy, wrath, rage, etc. to all be negative things? How could an aboslutely perfect being encompass these traits? If that is the way to explain him as human...imagine how much more magnified and terrible those traits are at the godly level.

God is a just and holy God. Study the meanings of just and holy and that my help you to understand. God is God, we are man. That is where faith comes in. If we had the capacity to understand it all, then we would be God.

And hey faint. I'm not following you around buddy. I just thought I'd put my two cents worth in here too.

 

[Meesheltx]

I was hoping for a better explanation then the age-old "we can't understand because we are mere humans" ...I believe that God knows what we can and cannot understand...if he is how you say he is, wouldn't he know that and explain things in the bible in such a way that would not make him look more evil then good? I don't know...maybe i'm starting to talk a little crazy and unclear...i am awfully tired
goodnight everyone

 

[Aqualung]

I was hoping for a better explanation then the age-old "we can't understand because we are mere humans" ...I believe that God knows what we can and cannot understand...if he is how you say he is, wouldn't he know that and explain things in the bible in such a way that would not make him look more evil then good? I don't know...maybe i'm starting to talk a little crazy and unclear...i am awfully tired
goodnight everyone

There was actually a thread started a while ago about this, in which I put some real answers. I'll revive it, and then if you read it and have more questions I'll answer them

 

[Aqualung]

It's called "can the christian god be all moral, or even at all moral" and it's in religious debates.