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'The Message'

bmtsandwich

New Member
I was thinking about this religious debate I have been having with myself and I think I came up with an idea that is... interesting...

I was thinking that it is possible that the bible has been taken to 'literally,' meaning that the book itself was not intended to be perceived as literal as it has been. What if the book was written, indeed, by a super-natural being who intended to leave us with a piece of knowledge that would shape and inspire millions, like it has, and the way it was suppose to shape and inspire us has been overlooked, maybe even to the point of no return. I'll take a few events, that I can remember from The Bible, and interpret them how I see it.

First, let us evaluate the relationship and existence of God and the Devil. We will, first, break it down to see each beings(ideas?) characteristics.

God - Omnipotent, Omniscient, Caring, Loving, Good Intentioned. Basically, everything that has to do with being 'good'

Devil - Deceiving, Ill-Tempered, Sadistic. Basically, everything that has to do with being 'evil'

Now, when you look at both characteristics that I have mentioned for God and The Devil you see that the capability for Humans to obtain such characteristics are not far from reach, if not already reachable. What if God is a representation of the capabilities of Human beings if they were to follow a righteous and noble life (whatever that may be) and ignore a life that involved the aforementioned characteristics of the Devil, our evil half? And, what if the Devil is a representation of a Humans capability if they were to ignore a life that involved the aforementioned characteristics of God, our better half?

Meaning, that we are all composed of the capabilities of both ideas and characteristics, but it is up to us to decide which lifestyle we choose to lead. Which, inevitably will lead us to Heaven, which is Human characteristics that involve peace and understanding with everything, or to Hell, which is Human characteristics that involves violence, deceit, and, ultimately, our Judgment Day, total destruction of our selves because of our chosen actions. Now, reaching Heaven, or Hell, isn't as literal as it has been mentioned before, but Heaven or Hell on Earth in which we create for ourselves to live in. People keep blaming "God" for what has been happening on the world, but in reality God has nothing to do with it. It isn't because we have chosen to take "God" out of our schools or day-to-day lives, but it is because we have ignored so many precautions to so many problems. For instance, Global Hunger is due to over-population which is a problem created by Humans. Loved ones dying in an accident such as: plane, car, train crashes; who is to blame? Not God. We have built these systems with our own visions and inspirations, and since we have built these systems of travel they are, inevitably, doomed to our imperfections. Someone dying by a gun, it was not God who pulled the trigger, or put you into the place of the bullets path, it was ourselves who doomed one another by creating its existence. OK, so enough of this example, lets move onto another one.

Resurrection of Jesus Christ after his crucification - Apparently, the son of God, was sent down to Earth in order to make the ultimate sacrifice, to save us from our sins, Death. In which, he later resurrected three days after his death.

Now, it seems to me, that the very idea of a sinless being created by God was an idea of the perfect existence; an existence without sins. Now, it may be possible that there was a person named Jesus who did die for an idea that he believed, an existence without sin and forgiveness to all who have sinned. It seems to me that the very act upon his death and resurrection is the death of his idea, which later became resurrected through his followers in order to try and create such a perfect world.

Good prevails Evil - God, good, banished The Devil, bad, from Heaven into his own dwelling.

Ultimately, Evil can not exist without another Evil or Good being. If Evil is left to himself his satisfaction and way of life is gone because he has no one to deceit, no one to hurt, and nothing to rule, unless you count himself which would eventually result into pushing that lone Evil into a state of mental distress. Whereas, it is possible for Good to live with, and without, any other being because they have the knowledge and acceptance of everything around them and an understanding of what lies ahead.

These are the few ideas that I thought of while contemplating myself. Some of it may seem dis configured, but I think that the very principle that The Bible, or any book, is usually not skin-deep. I ask to you to take the time and translate possible meanings, or instructions, if you will, about events that have conspired in any religious book. I think 'The Message' it is trying to share is actual life problems and solutions in a context that we would best understand it, at the time, and maybe even still today. What if, we ourselves, created such a system that we thought would create a happier and better world, but, through our darker side, The Devil, has been discolored and lost throughout time. The question is: Is it to late to restore its true vision and save us from ourselves?

There is a God in each and everyone of us, but where lies God lies The Devil. The battle between Good and Evil not only lies in the conflicts before us, but also the conflicts in our minds.

P.S. I am not religious, nor atheist. I am just a mere observer in the events and stories played in front of me.

I would appreciate if I got feed-back with my ideas. Anything would be appreciated.
 

joeboonda

Well-Known Member
fantôme profane;902644 said:
Yes, they start to think. It’s Heresy!:eek:

Ephesians 4

14That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; 15But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
 

MaddLlama

Obstructor of justice
BIBLE- #1 book on the best seller list!

Really? Amazon.com says that Harry Potter #7 is the #1 seller right now, with another YA fantasy book as second. I don't see the Bible on the amazon top 100, or on the New York Times bestseller list anywhere. Where are you getting your information from? There isn't even a version of the Bible on the top 20 best seller list at Christianbook.com.
 

Guitar's Cry

Disciple of Pan
I would appreciate if I got feed-back with my ideas. Anything would be appreciated.

Your ideas are certainly interesting! By looking deeper into the symbolism of the Bible, you gain more than just the literal interpretation can give.

Keep looking deeper! There is much to discover...:)
 

Guitar's Cry

Disciple of Pan
Ephesians 4

14That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; 15But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:


"The carpenter;
I hear you through the symphonic voices of nature,
The purity I could never doubt.
They tell me to lie on the grass
And observe my savior,
The one crucified to the chirping of the birds." - "The Carpenter," by Nightwish.
 

Vissarion

New Member
Well, when a book orders you explicitly to kill your disobedient child, I am not sure how much wiggleroom you have to read that too "literally".
 

logician

Well-Known Member
What's sin to one person may not be to another, the idea of someone dying for our sins is basically illogical and barbaric.
 

Angelfire

Member
I was thinking about this religious debate I have been having with myself and I think I came up with an idea that is... interesting...

I was thinking that it is possible that the bible has been taken to 'literally,' meaning that the book itself was not intended to be perceived as literal as it has been. What if the book was written, indeed, by a super-natural being who intended to leave us with a piece of knowledge that would shape and inspire millions, like it has, and the way it was suppose to shape and inspire us has been overlooked, maybe even to the point of no return. I'll take a few events, that I can remember from The Bible, and interpret them how I see it.

First, let us evaluate the relationship and existence of God and the Devil. We will, first, break it down to see each beings(ideas?) characteristics.

God - Omnipotent, Omniscient, Caring, Loving, Good Intentioned. Basically, everything that has to do with being 'good'

Devil - Deceiving, Ill-Tempered, Sadistic. Basically, everything that has to do with being 'evil'

Now, when you look at both characteristics that I have mentioned for God and The Devil you see that the capability for Humans to obtain such characteristics are not far from reach, if not already reachable. What if God is a representation of the capabilities of Human beings if they were to follow a righteous and noble life (whatever that may be) and ignore a life that involved the aforementioned characteristics of the Devil, our evil half? And, what if the Devil is a representation of a Humans capability if they were to ignore a life that involved the aforementioned characteristics of God, our better half?

Meaning, that we are all composed of the capabilities of both ideas and characteristics, but it is up to us to decide which lifestyle we choose to lead. Which, inevitably will lead us to Heaven, which is Human characteristics that involve peace and understanding with everything, or to Hell, which is Human characteristics that involves violence, deceit, and, ultimately, our Judgment Day, total destruction of our selves because of our chosen actions. Now, reaching Heaven, or Hell, isn't as literal as it has been mentioned before, but Heaven or Hell on Earth in which we create for ourselves to live in. People keep blaming "God" for what has been happening on the world, but in reality God has nothing to do with it. It isn't because we have chosen to take "God" out of our schools or day-to-day lives, but it is because we have ignored so many precautions to so many problems. For instance, Global Hunger is due to over-population which is a problem created by Humans. Loved ones dying in an accident such as: plane, car, train crashes; who is to blame? Not God. We have built these systems with our own visions and inspirations, and since we have built these systems of travel they are, inevitably, doomed to our imperfections. Someone dying by a gun, it was not God who pulled the trigger, or put you into the place of the bullets path, it was ourselves who doomed one another by creating its existence. OK, so enough of this example, lets move onto another one.

Resurrection of Jesus Christ after his crucification - Apparently, the son of God, was sent down to Earth in order to make the ultimate sacrifice, to save us from our sins, Death. In which, he later resurrected three days after his death.

Now, it seems to me, that the very idea of a sinless being created by God was an idea of the perfect existence; an existence without sins. Now, it may be possible that there was a person named Jesus who did die for an idea that he believed, an existence without sin and forgiveness to all who have sinned. It seems to me that the very act upon his death and resurrection is the death of his idea, which later became resurrected through his followers in order to try and create such a perfect world.

Good prevails Evil - God, good, banished The Devil, bad, from Heaven into his own dwelling.

Ultimately, Evil can not exist without another Evil or Good being. If Evil is left to himself his satisfaction and way of life is gone because he has no one to deceit, no one to hurt, and nothing to rule, unless you count himself which would eventually result into pushing that lone Evil into a state of mental distress. Whereas, it is possible for Good to live with, and without, any other being because they have the knowledge and acceptance of everything around them and an understanding of what lies ahead.

These are the few ideas that I thought of while contemplating myself. Some of it may seem dis configured, but I think that the very principle that The Bible, or any book, is usually not skin-deep. I ask to you to take the time and translate possible meanings, or instructions, if you will, about events that have conspired in any religious book. I think 'The Message' it is trying to share is actual life problems and solutions in a context that we would best understand it, at the time, and maybe even still today. What if, we ourselves, created such a system that we thought would create a happier and better world, but, through our darker side, The Devil, has been discolored and lost throughout time. The question is: Is it to late to restore its true vision and save us from ourselves?

There is a God in each and everyone of us, but where lies God lies The Devil. The battle between Good and Evil not only lies in the conflicts before us, but also the conflicts in our minds.

P.S. I am not religious, nor atheist. I am just a mere observer in the events and stories played in front of me.

I would appreciate if I got feed-back with my ideas. Anything would be appreciated.





Good thinking 99.

I found a lot of logic in your post. Try this for size, God and no devil, or put another way, God and not God, remembering always that God is omnipresent.






peace
 

sojourner

Annoyingly Progressive Since 2006
I was thinking about this religious debate I have been having with myself and I think I came up with an idea that is... interesting...

I was thinking that it is possible that the bible has been taken to 'literally,' meaning that the book itself was not intended to be perceived as literal as it has been. What if the book was written, indeed, by a super-natural being who intended to leave us with a piece of knowledge that would shape and inspire millions, like it has, and the way it was suppose to shape and inspire us has been overlooked, maybe even to the point of no return. I'll take a few events, that I can remember from The Bible, and interpret them how I see it.

First, let us evaluate the relationship and existence of God and the Devil. We will, first, break it down to see each beings(ideas?) characteristics.

God - Omnipotent, Omniscient, Caring, Loving, Good Intentioned. Basically, everything that has to do with being 'good'

Devil - Deceiving, Ill-Tempered, Sadistic. Basically, everything that has to do with being 'evil'

Now, when you look at both characteristics that I have mentioned for God and The Devil you see that the capability for Humans to obtain such characteristics are not far from reach, if not already reachable. What if God is a representation of the capabilities of Human beings if they were to follow a righteous and noble life (whatever that may be) and ignore a life that involved the aforementioned characteristics of the Devil, our evil half? And, what if the Devil is a representation of a Humans capability if they were to ignore a life that involved the aforementioned characteristics of God, our better half?

Meaning, that we are all composed of the capabilities of both ideas and characteristics, but it is up to us to decide which lifestyle we choose to lead. Which, inevitably will lead us to Heaven, which is Human characteristics that involve peace and understanding with everything, or to Hell, which is Human characteristics that involves violence, deceit, and, ultimately, our Judgment Day, total destruction of our selves because of our chosen actions. Now, reaching Heaven, or Hell, isn't as literal as it has been mentioned before, but Heaven or Hell on Earth in which we create for ourselves to live in. People keep blaming "God" for what has been happening on the world, but in reality God has nothing to do with it. It isn't because we have chosen to take "God" out of our schools or day-to-day lives, but it is because we have ignored so many precautions to so many problems. For instance, Global Hunger is due to over-population which is a problem created by Humans. Loved ones dying in an accident such as: plane, car, train crashes; who is to blame? Not God. We have built these systems with our own visions and inspirations, and since we have built these systems of travel they are, inevitably, doomed to our imperfections. Someone dying by a gun, it was not God who pulled the trigger, or put you into the place of the bullets path, it was ourselves who doomed one another by creating its existence. OK, so enough of this example, lets move onto another one.

Resurrection of Jesus Christ after his crucification - Apparently, the son of God, was sent down to Earth in order to make the ultimate sacrifice, to save us from our sins, Death. In which, he later resurrected three days after his death.

Now, it seems to me, that the very idea of a sinless being created by God was an idea of the perfect existence; an existence without sins. Now, it may be possible that there was a person named Jesus who did die for an idea that he believed, an existence without sin and forgiveness to all who have sinned. It seems to me that the very act upon his death and resurrection is the death of his idea, which later became resurrected through his followers in order to try and create such a perfect world.

Good prevails Evil - God, good, banished The Devil, bad, from Heaven into his own dwelling.

Ultimately, Evil can not exist without another Evil or Good being. If Evil is left to himself his satisfaction and way of life is gone because he has no one to deceit, no one to hurt, and nothing to rule, unless you count himself which would eventually result into pushing that lone Evil into a state of mental distress. Whereas, it is possible for Good to live with, and without, any other being because they have the knowledge and acceptance of everything around them and an understanding of what lies ahead.

These are the few ideas that I thought of while contemplating myself. Some of it may seem dis configured, but I think that the very principle that The Bible, or any book, is usually not skin-deep. I ask to you to take the time and translate possible meanings, or instructions, if you will, about events that have conspired in any religious book. I think 'The Message' it is trying to share is actual life problems and solutions in a context that we would best understand it, at the time, and maybe even still today. What if, we ourselves, created such a system that we thought would create a happier and better world, but, through our darker side, The Devil, has been discolored and lost throughout time. The question is: Is it to late to restore its true vision and save us from ourselves?

There is a God in each and everyone of us, but where lies God lies The Devil. The battle between Good and Evil not only lies in the conflicts before us, but also the conflicts in our minds.

P.S. I am not religious, nor atheist. I am just a mere observer in the events and stories played in front of me.

I would appreciate if I got feed-back with my ideas. Anything would be appreciated.
Your idea is both dualistic and humanistic. Both run contrary to Biblical theology. The impetus to do good lies not within us, but within God who inspires us through the Spirit. Good does not exist alongside evil, but dispels evil completely.
 
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