The movement of the earth in Qur'an

[FearGod]

The site claimed they demonstrated foreknowledge of advanced radar systems though which is comical. I have no problem with them as religious teachings. I just think that the attempts to claim them as scientific miracles is so silly it's funny.

I didn't even look to that site.

The Quran isn't a scientific text and it is not supposed to be, this is no criticism of the Quran. Having no scientific miracles does not change the message of the Quran or say anything negative about Islam. Religious texts are about moral and lifestyle guidance, that is their purpose.

It isn't scientific miracles but just facts.

If believers wish to see 'signs' in the text, then that is up to them, a few of them make reasonable sense, but as I showed, you can find similar things in other texts that make reasonable sense also. It took me literally 30 seconds to find my example. Imagine what could be found with thousands of people searching over many years.

Yes it's ones choice, i had even said that God himself said in one verse that he won't guide some of the disbelievers and i think they know themselves,they'll never believe regardless of the signs shown to them.

The thing that annoys me though is when believers try to claim that anyone who doubts these 'scientific miracles' is somehow being dishonest or closed minded. The scientific miracles hypothesis was a creation of the 1980s, and some Muslim apologists have even stopped trying to claim it as it has actually been responsible for people leaving Islam when they found the claims were overstated if not actually inaccurate. See Does the Qur’an Contain Scientific Miracles? A New Approach on how to Reconcile and Discuss Science in the Qur’an | Hamza Andreas Tzortzis

Don't confuse criticism of the hypothesis for criticism of Islam or the Quran though, the 2 things are completely unrelated.

Scientific miracles isn't the right words for it, it's only signs and facts.
Accepting Islam or leaving Islam isn't our business, we only explain and defend our views and we don't care how the others will perceive it.

 

[FearGod]

I have read enough myths, especially creation myths, to know when that your Qur'an is following the same track as these other religions, with no idea what they are talking about, when they are trying to talk about astronomy, earth science, biology, etc.

The author of the Qur'an, be he Muhammad or Allah, is about uneducated as those other religion authors and myth-makers, when it come to science or maths. They are utterly clueless.

I have read enough scriptures and myths to know that Muslims such as yourself, are so desperate to get converts, even if meant lying their faces off, to prove something what the Qur'an really don't say.

I have no doubt in my mind that you, Union and other Muslims who had posted in their thread, would go out of their way to twist passages in Qur'an.

I supposed that honesty not so great virtue in Islam, because I haven't seen honest Muslims here.

You're entitled to your own opinion.

 

[Shad]

It is not a cherry picking nor ambiguous as it has well established , clear and definitive meaning in Qur'an itself and in Arabic lexicons . We are not saying an apple is an orange , if you realized that , simply . Ironically sometime common sense is really uncommon .

It is since you are the one picking which definition applies. You ignored day, even though in other verses it uses the word days, and pick epoch. Yet others people which are qualified do not.

http://quran.com/7/54
The Quranic Arabic Corpus - Quran Dictionary

Since days is factual in error the definition changes to the vague epoch. Since sciences says otherwise you define the word to fit science as provided by the translations above. Shakir's translations is a known forgery and is plagiarized so is not credible. Common sense is one of the worst ways to validate anything, it has been continually proven wrong. So go ahead and use common sense. I will use academics which has produced results.

 

[Union]

Which is exactly the same illogical piece of crap you get from 2 Peter 3:8:

You and your Christian brothers should compare notes, because nothing in Qur'an 22:47. What it tell me Muslims read thing too literally, and that both Christian and Islamic author don't know maths or can tell time.

And more meaningless crap.

What does these verses have to do with 7:54, which had you quoted?

The GOD of Muslim and Christian is the same GOD , so why wonder if some facts within them may concur . In fact this GOD some well thousand years back already taught the time dilation of theory of relativity that you may need to learn in 2015 through Google

And where does those the billions (13.7 billion) of years come from?

You don't have answer either of them because they both rhetorical questions, because I already know that your answer come from, the so-called imaginary "ratio".

For you to have ratio, your need 2 numbers, and high school student would know that. With verse 7:54, you only get "6 days", and no other numbers, so you can't get ratio out of 7:54. It is sort of interpretation that make Muslims a laughingstock in the these science and religion forum.

You really should go back to school, and relearn basic maths, especially on ratio.

Ratio!

13.7 Billion years is the age of the universe and 4.5 Billions years is the age of the earth - that is science . 13.5/4.7~3/1
Qur'an didn't mention the age but mentioned the epochs - 6 epochs of total creation in verse 7:54 and 2 epochs are the total creation of the earth in verse 41:9 .Hence 2 numbers are there , 6/2 ~ 3/1 .

Ratio , a great wisdom !

 

[gnostic]

The GOD of Muslim and Christian is the same GOD , so why wonder if some facts within them may concur . In fact this GOD some well thousand years back already taught the time dilation of theory of relativity that you may need to learn in 2015 through Google

13.7 Billion years is the age of the universe and 4.5 Billions years is the age of the earth - that is science . 13.5/4.7~3/1
Qur'an didn't mention the age but mentioned the epochs - 6 epochs of total creation in verse 7:54 and 2 epochs are the total creation of the earth in verse 41:9 .Hence 2 numbers are there , 6/2 ~ 3/1 .

Ratio , a great wisdom !

Your ratio is nothing more than pseudo-math numerology.

You are simply using 3:1 ratio to links with certain events, by magically (dishonestly) cooking some numbers.

This is the sort of things that fortune tellers, psychics and doomsayers do. They make up imaginary associations.

Let say we use your example of using the 2 verses (7:54 and 41:9), to get your 3:1 to match the age of the universe (13.8 billion years) and the age of the earth (4.7 billions years). The precise figure of the ratio, 2.9 : 1 ratio, but it close enough to 3:1. Are you with me so far.

But let say the Earth is now 8.7 billion years old, that would mean the age of the universe 17.8 billion years old. The universe and the Earth are both now 4 billion years older. That would mean the ratio, is now 2.05 : 1 ratio.

Your 3:1 ratio is no longer viable because every time you add billion year to the universe and earth, the ration get smaller and smaller, because the ratio is 2 to 1.

For in order the Earth-universe ratio to keep in line with 3:1, then if the Earth 8.7 billion years old, then the universe has to be 26.1 billion years old. But that would be wrong.

If you add a billion years to the age of the Earth, then you have to add a billion years to the age of universe. So for example, if the the earth is now 5.7 billion years old, then the universe would be 14.8 billion years old, the ratio will be 2.596 to 1. And when the earth is 6.7 billion years old, then the universe will be only 15.8 billion years old, then the ratio is now 2.36 to 1.

Your ratio (using the Qur'an) doesn't work as everything get older.

And if you go the other way, for example, Earth is only 1 billion years old. That would mean the universe would be about 10 billion years old. The ratio will be closer to 10 to 1, not 3 to 1 as you have claimed.

Do you now understand why your ratio is utterly inane? Because it doesn't take into account as the universe and Earth get older, the ratio will change too.

Seriously, you (and FearGod, who "like" your reply), need to go back to school and relearn basic maths, especially ratio, because clearly you don't understand the concept of ratio.

 

[Union]

Your ratio is nothing more than pseudo-math numerology.

You are simply using 3:1 ratio to links with certain events, by magically (dishonestly) cooking some numbers.

This is the sort of things that fortune tellers, psychics and doomsayers do. They make up imaginary associations.

Let say we use your example of using the 2 verses (7:54 and 41:9), to get your 3:1 to match the age of the universe (13.8 billion years) and the age of the earth (4.7 billions years). The precise figure of the ratio, 2.9 : 1 ratio, but it close enough to 3:1. Are you with me so far.

But let say the Earth is now 8.7 billion years old, that would mean the age of the universe 17.8 billion years old. The universe and the Earth are both now 4 billion years older. That would mean the ratio, is now 2.05 : 1 ratio.

Your 3:1 ratio is no longer viable because every time you add billion year to the universe and earth, the ration get smaller and smaller, because the ratio is 2 to 1.

For in order the Earth-universe ratio to keep in line with 3:1, then if the Earth 8.7 billion years old, then the universe has to be 26.1 billion years old. But that would be wrong.

If you add a billion years to the age of the Earth, then you have to add a billion years to the age of universe. So for example, if the the earth is now 5.7 billion years old, then the universe would be 14.8 billion years old, the ratio will be 2.596 to 1. And when the earth is 6.7 billion years old, then the universe will be only 15.8 billion years old, then the ratio is now 2.36 to 1.

Your ratio (using the Qur'an) doesn't work as everything get older.

And if you go the other way, for example, Earth is only 1 billion years old. That would mean the universe would be about 10 billion years old. The ratio will be closer to 10 to 1, not 3 to 1 as you have claimed.

Do you now understand why your ratio is utterly inane? Because it doesn't take into account as the universe and Earth get older, the ratio will change too.

Seriously, you (and FearGod, who "like" your reply), need to go back to school and relearn basic maths, especially ratio, because clearly you don't understand the concept of ratio.

Hi Gnostic . I do believe that you are an intelligent person and one day , from deep of my heart I trust that you will turn to GOD one day realizing HIS Excellence . My best wishes for you .

Whatsoever , now I can see that you are stuck with ratio . Firstly , Qur'an was revealed in 7th Century , hence the age of the universe in Qur'an should be understood during that time and not some billion years latter and after the authorship of the Qur'an . I hope you get this simple fact .

And this 2.9:1 is tantamount to 3:1 not only by digit but also by the +/- of ages as it is 13.798±0.037 billion years and 4.54 ± 0.05 billion years .

You see , Qur'an didn't mention 6 epochs for the universe and 2 epochs for the earth just out of the blue as these are scientifically proven to be major epochs .

 

[Bunyip]

Hi Gnostic . I do believe that you are an intelligent person and one day , from deep of my heart I trust that you will turn to GOD one day realizing HIS Excellence . My best wishes for you .

Whatsoever , now I can see that you are stuck with ratio . Firstly , Qur'an was revealed in 7th Century , hence the age of the universe in Qur'an should be understood during that time and not some billion years latter and after the authorship of the Qur'an . I hope you get this simple fact .

And this 2.9:1 is tantamount to 3:1 not only by digit but also by the +/- of ages as it is 13.798±0.037 billion years and 4.54 ± 0.05 billion years .

You see , Qur'an didn't mention 6 epochs for the universe and 2 epochs for the earth just out of the blue as these are scientifically proven to be major epochs .

It doesn't mention them at all. You are just applying a lot of imagination to a little vague similarity.

 

[FearGod]

Your ratio is nothing more than pseudo-math numerology.

You are simply using 3:1 ratio to links with certain events, by magically (dishonestly) cooking some numbers.

This is the sort of things that fortune tellers, psychics and doomsayers do. They make up imaginary associations.

Let say we use your example of using the 2 verses (7:54 and 41:9), to get your 3:1 to match the age of the universe (13.8 billion years) and the age of the earth (4.7 billions years). The precise figure of the ratio, 2.9 : 1 ratio, but it close enough to 3:1. Are you with me so far.

But let say the Earth is now 8.7 billion years old, that would mean the age of the universe 17.8 billion years old. The universe and the Earth are both now 4 billion years older. That would mean the ratio, is now 2.05 : 1 ratio.

Your 3:1 ratio is no longer viable because every time you add billion year to the universe and earth, the ration get smaller and smaller, because the ratio is 2 to 1.

For in order the Earth-universe ratio to keep in line with 3:1, then if the Earth 8.7 billion years old, then the universe has to be 26.1 billion years old. But that would be wrong.

If you add a billion years to the age of the Earth, then you have to add a billion years to the age of universe. So for example, if the the earth is now 5.7 billion years old, then the universe would be 14.8 billion years old, the ratio will be 2.596 to 1. And when the earth is 6.7 billion years old, then the universe will be only 15.8 billion years old, then the ratio is now 2.36 to 1.

Your ratio (using the Qur'an) doesn't work as everything get older.

And if you go the other way, for example, Earth is only 1 billion years old. That would mean the universe would be about 10 billion years old. The ratio will be closer to 10 to 1, not 3 to 1 as you have claimed.

Do you now understand why your ratio is utterly inane? Because it doesn't take into account as the universe and Earth get older, the ratio will change too.

Seriously, you (and FearGod, who "like" your reply), need to go back to school and relearn basic maths, especially ratio, because clearly you don't understand the concept of ratio.

Actually i don't believe the verses are about the creation of the whole universe but about our solar system, one verse which confirms my view is verse (2:29) which says
((He it is Who created for you all that is in the earth, and He directed Himself to the heaven, so He made them complete seven heavens, and He knows all things.))

The verse says that when God created the earth the space (heaven) was a single entity then he made them seven heavens, but the fact is that the universe is older than earth and hence i don't agree that the seven heavens are the whole universe.

Also verses 71:15 & 71:16 confirm it (("'See ye not how God has created the seven heavens one above another,)) (("'And made the moon a light in their midst, and made the sun as a (Glorious) Lamp?))

It is impossible that the Sun and the moon belong to the whole universe but it belong to the solar system, so the 7 heavens aren't the whole universe as we know it.

 

[gnostic]

And this 2.9:1 is tantamount to 3:1 not only by digit but also by the +/- of ages as it is 13.798±0.037 billion years and 4.54 ± 0.05 billion years .

You see , Qur'an didn't mention 6 epochs for the universe and 2 epochs for the earth just out of the blue as these are scientifically proven to be major epochs .

There is no epoch in the universe, let alone 6 epochs.

You are talking crap. You are making up some imaginary epochs, without any source, other than the Qur'an, and your baseless interpretation on just 2 verses.

You speak of 6 epochs, then using some silly ratio, can comparing them with science about the Earth and the universe.

Do you even know what you are doing or saying? You are using numerology, just like a fortune tellers, astrologists, psychics, doomsdayers and the conspiracy theorists.

No one in astronomy, astrophysics or cosmology, talk of epochs, let alone 6 of them.

Can you prove scientific journals or textbook that say the universe is current on its 6th epochs?

When I ever read Muslims speak of the Qur'an with science, all I hear is barfing noises. I don't know who are worse - Muslims or the Christian creationists, in twisting their own respective scriptures to fit their agenda.

You want to make up things, then fine, go ahead, and twist passages from the Qur'an. The more you talk of it, the less credible you are sounding.

 

[gnostic]

Actually i don't believe the verses are about the creation of the whole universe but about our solar system, one verse which confirms my view is verse (2:29) which says
((He it is Who created for you all that is in the earth, and He directed Himself to the heaven, so He made them complete seven heavens, and He knows all things.))

The verse says that when God created the earth the space (heaven) was a single entity then he made them seven heavens, but the fact is that the universe is older than earth and hence i don't agree that the seven heavens are the whole universe.

Also verses 71:15 & 71:16 confirm it (("'See ye not how God has created the seven heavens one above another,)) (("'And made the moon a light in their midst, and made the sun as a (Glorious) Lamp?))

It is impossible that the Sun and the moon belong to the whole universe but it belong to the solar system, so the 7 heavens aren't the whole universe as we know it.

Never believe in the whole seven heavens, being the universe.

Islam, or more the Qur'an wasn't the first to sprout the seven-heaven hypothesis. Before Muhammad, was the books of Enoch. In the Second Book of Enoch (also common known as the Secret Book of Enoch or simply as 2 Enoch) Enoch supposedly visited the seven heavens, before meeting God, became a scribe of God, writing down everything, from creation to the prediction of the Flood, before turning home to give his book(s) to his son, before departing again.

All sort of numbers were claimed in this book. And apparently numerology was important to this book written during the Hellenistic period (3rd century to 30 BCE).

According to Islamic legend, Muhammad also visited the 7 heavens, apparently stealing the story of Enoch, except that Muhammad supposed rode a winged steed to the heavens (after visiting the "Furthest Mosque"), instead of being guided by 2 angels in the Enochic story.

And the story of Muhammad riding on animal, is not even original or unique. About 2000 years ago, the Sumerian-Akkadian have the story of Etana, the Sumerian king of Kish. He flew to heavens on the back of large eagle, whom he had saved, but there were only 3 heavens, not seven. (Source: Epic of Etana. Stephanie Dalley, Myths From Mesopotamia: Creation, The Flood, Gilgamesh, and Others, Oxford World's Classics, 1991 (revised edition 2000).)

The Qur'an (and various other texts) and Muslims are playing the number game, or more precisely numerology, just like the books of Enoch, and just like the Christian or NT Revelation. They are all fascinating to read, but it is silly if anyone take them seriously or literally, and I don't take them seriously.

 

[FearGod]

There is no epoch in the universe, let alone 6 epochs.

You are talking crap. You are making up some imaginary epochs, without any source, other than the Qur'an, and your baseless interpretation on just 2 verses.

You speak of 6 epochs, then using some silly ratio, can comparing them with science about the Earth and the universe.

Do you even know what you are doing or saying? You are using numerology, just like a fortune tellers, astrologists, psychics, doomsdayers and the conspiracy theorists.

No one in astronomy, astrophysics or cosmology, talk of epochs, let alone 6 of them.

Can you prove scientific journals or textbook that say the universe is current on its 6th epochs?

I don't talk crap as much as you did, at least i discuss religion issues because i believe that God exists and if in a case that i don't have such belief then i won't waste a second in discussing and debating something that i don't have any interest towards it, for your case it's like a batty applying for a job as a physician and which doesn't make any sense.

First it isn't your business for whom i want to give a like for whatever reason i do regardless of the reason for doing it, 2nd i didn't discuss about epochs and if i did then show me where i did otherwise it's better for you not to keep on showing yourself as if looking a fool.

When I ever read Muslims speak of the Qur'an with science, all I hear is barfing noises. I don't know who are worse - Muslims or the Christian creationists, in twisting their own respective scriptures to fit their agenda.

You want to make up things, then fine, go ahead, and twist passages from the Qur'an. The more you talk of it, the less credible you are sounding.

Finally, Islam and the quran isn't for you, you don't believe it then through it away and read some comics and enjoy your time than wasting it in something that you don't actually believe in , just my opinion.

BTW, don't worry about the agenda, people are smart enough without the need of your advice.

 

[FearGod]

Never believe in the whole seven heavens, being the universe.

Islam, or more the Qur'an wasn't the first to sprout the seven-heaven hypothesis. Before Muhammad, was the books of Enoch. In the Second Book of Enoch (also common known as the Secret Book of Enoch or simply as 2 Enoch) Enoch supposedly visited the seven heavens, before meeting God, became a scribe of God, writing down everything, from creation to the prediction of the Flood, before turning home to give his book(s) to his son, before departing again.

All sort of numbers were claimed in this book. And apparently numerology was important to this book written during the Hellenistic period (3rd century to 30 BCE).

According to Islamic legend, Muhammad also visited the 7 heavens, apparently stealing the story of Enoch, except that Muhammad supposed rode a winged steed to the heavens (after visiting the "Furthest Mosque"), instead of being guided by 2 angels in the Enochic story.

And the story of Muhammad riding on animal, is not even original or unique. About 2000 years ago, the Sumerian-Akkadian have the story of Etana, the Sumerian king of Kish. He flew to heavens on the back of large eagle, whom he had saved, but there were only 3 heavens, not seven. (Source: Epic of Etana. Stephanie Dalley, Myths From Mesopotamia: Creation, The Flood, Gilgamesh, and Others, Oxford World's Classics, 1991 (revised edition 2000).)

The Qur'an (and various other texts) and Muslims are playing the number game, or more precisely numerology, just like the books of Enoch, and just like the Christian or NT Revelation. They are all fascinating to read, but it is silly if anyone take them seriously or literally, and I don't take them seriously.

I don't believe about the story that the prophet visited the seven heavens and that is a myth and such stories were made by some atheists similar to you in the ancient times to distort religion and many idiots believed it and sadly even today they still believe such silly stories.

The quran never mentioned such crap and the prophet never saw God or even knew how God looks like.

 

[Union]

There is no epoch in the universe, let alone 6 epochs.

You are talking crap. You are making up some imaginary epochs, without any source, other than the Qur'an, and your baseless interpretation on just 2 verses.

You speak of 6 epochs, then using some silly ratio, can comparing them with science about the Earth and the universe.

Do you even know what you are doing or saying? You are using numerology, just like a fortune tellers, astrologists, psychics, doomsdayers and the conspiracy theorists.

No one in astronomy, astrophysics or cosmology, talk of epochs, let alone 6 of them.

Can you prove scientific journals or textbook that say the universe is current on its 6th epochs?

When I ever read Muslims speak of the Qur'an with science, all I hear is barfing noises. I don't know who are worse - Muslims or the Christian creationists, in twisting their own respective scriptures to fit their agenda.

You want to make up things, then fine, go ahead, and twist passages from the Qur'an. The more you talk of it, the less credible you are sounding.

CP-2156 Life In The Universe - NASA


To place the construction of all matter into perspective, consider figure 1, which summarizes the run of density and temperature throughout all time for a Big-Bang Universe. It represents the consensus of contemporary scientific thought in the broadest sense. Six major epochs are delineated, each corresponding to a major period in the history of the Universe. Specified across the bottom of this figure are the general names of the epochs, along with their time domains. Note that this plot is highly nonlinear, stretching from an incredibly small fraction of a second to the present time, 18 or so billion years after the origin of the Universe. The curves depict the average density and the average temperature of everything in the Universe at any point in time.

This figure suggests that in the beginning there was chaos. One cannot inquire about what happened at the exact moment of the Bang (precisely zero time). Some theorists argue, however, that it is possible to characterize the physical conditions at some extraordinarily small time after the Bang. For example, the currently known laws of physics specify a Universe younger than 10-23 sec to be characterized by an average density greater than 1050 gm/cm3 and an average temperature greater than 1030 K. Of course, it is virtually impossible to appreciate such youth, for 10-23 sec is the amount of time it takes light to cross a proton. Equally difficult to comprehend are the large densities and temperatures characterizing this earliest epoch. The composition of the Universe at this time was indescribable, and its dominant action unimaginable.

The second major epoch is a bit closer to our limits of comprehension, although it is still characterized by severely nonterrestrial conditions - the hadron epoch. The name is derived from the fact that the heavy elementary particles such as protons, neutrons, and mesons, which were the most abundant type of matter at the time, are collectively known as hadrons. Calculations suggest that such particles existed as free unbound entities, considering the high temperature prevalent in the Universe well within its first second of existence. The hadrons unquestionably collided and interacted with one another and with other types of elementary particles, for the density was also extreme. The dominant action at this time is presumed to be the self-annihilation of hadrons into high-energy photons, thus creating a brilliant fireball of radiation. Lacking a solid understanding of elementary particle physics, scientists presently know very little more about this mystifying period.

As the Universe continued its rapid expansion, its contents cooled. A variety of models suggest that about a millisecond after the Bang, the conditions suitable for hadron annihilation had nearly subsided, thus allowing the initially less abundant, lighter elementary particles such as electrons, neutrinos, and muons to predominate. The average density and temperature of this lepton epoch had decreased to about 1010 gm/cm3 and 1010 K. These physical conditions are still excessive by terrestrial standards, but they had diminished considerably compared to the chaotically dense and hot conditions extant a fraction of a second earlier. By the time the first second had elapsed, the leptons were self-annihilating into photons, much as had the hadrons earlier. The radiative fireball of the cosmic bomb was still being fed with new photons.

The radiation density exceeded the matter density by a large amount in these first few minutes; photons of radiation far outnumbered particles of matter. As soon as the elementary particles of matter began to coagulate, fierce radiation destroyed them. For this reason, the first three epochs are [4] often collectively referred to as the radiation era. Whatever matter existed was merely an inconspicuous precipitate suspended in a sea of dense, brilliant radiation.

LATER EPOCHS

The fourth epoch -the atom epoch -extends in time from about 100 sec to about a million years after the Bang. Midway through this epoch, the average density had decreased to about 10-10 gm/cm3, while the average temperature had fallen to about 106 K-values not terribly different from those in the atmospheres of stars today. A principal feature of the atom epoch was the gradual diminution of the original fireball, for the annihilation of hadrons and leptons had all but ceased.

Toward the beginning of the atom epoch, radiation still reigned supreme over matter, for the Universe remained flooded with photons. As the Universe expanded, however, the photon density decreased as the fourth power of the radius of the Universe, while the matter density decreased only as the third power. The early dominance of radiation thus gradually diminished. Sometime between a few minutes and a million years after the Bang, the charged elementary particles of matter were able to coagulate electromagnetically without being broken apart by radiation as quickly as they combined. This was a most important transformation in the history of the Universe. The dominance of radiation had subsided, for matter had gradually become neutralized, a physical state over which radiation has little leverage. Matter had, in a sense, overthrown the cosmic fireball. Henceforth it would dominate radiation as the principal constituent of the Universe. To denote this major turn of events, the last three epochs in figure 1 are collectively known as the matter era.

Once the matter era began, atoms appeared. The influence of radiation had grown so weak that it could no longer prohibit the joining of the leptons and hadrons that had survived annihilation. Hydrogen was the first element to form, since it required only that single electrons be electromagnetically joined to single protons. Copious amounts of hydrogen were synthesized in the early Universe, and it is thus the common ancestor of all things.

Hydrogen was not the only kind of atom formed early in the matter era. Indeed, at the start of the atom epoch, the average temperature of the Universe still exceeded the 107 K necessary to fuse two hydrogen atoms into helium via the proton-proton cycle. The Universe was cooling, but it took time for the average temperature to dip below this critical value. Consequently, some helium atoms must have been produced within the primordial fireball in the same way that they now form in the interior of stars.

[5] Elements heavier than helium, on the other hand, could not have been produced in the early Universe. The synthesis of such elements requires temperatures even greater than 107 K. It also requires lots of helium atoms, for the heavier elements are constructed from lighter ones. The basic difficulty here is that, even though helium atom production was in high gear during the start of the atom epoch, the average temperature was falling quickly. Theoretical calculations suggest that, by the time there were sufficient helium atoms to interact with one another to produce the heavier elements, the temperature had fallen below the threshold value (~108 K) required for the mutual penetration of doubly charged helium nuclei. In contrast to the rapid cooling of the early Universe, the dense interiors of stars in the present Universe are perfectly suited for the generation of hotter temperatures and thus heavier elements. The guts of stars are indeed where the heavies were created-and where they are still being created.

By the end of the atom epoch, matter was in firm control. Sometime during the fifth or galaxy epoch, gravity began to pull some of this matter together into enormous clumps. Galaxies were beginning to form. Indeed, they all must have originated long ago, for observations imply that no galaxies have formed within the past 10 billion years or so. Each galaxy contains substantial numbers of old stars, in addition to an often abundant complement of young stars. The quasars and remote galaxies must have formed in the earliest parts of this epoch.

The time scale of the last two epochs shown in figure 1 has been compressed enormously. An important and rapid series of events occurred immediately after the Bang, especially in the first few minutes that constitute the radiation era. However, once the Universe cooled sufficiently to allow atoms to form, subsequent events occurred more slowly.

By the middle of the galaxy epoch, the average density of the Universe had decreased by another factor of 10 billion, to 10-20 gm/cm3. The average temperature of the entire Universe had also diminished to a relatively cool 3000 K. The Universe was becoming thinner, colder, and darker.

Finally, there is the present stellar epoch. Scientists can say with some assurance that it has been at least 10 billion years since the Bang. In fact, the Universe is probably older than that, perhaps as old as 18 billion years, although its precise aye depends on the yet-to-be-determined change of the Hubble constant with time. The present average density is approximately 10-30 gm/cm3, the critical value above which the Universe will eventually contract and below which the Universe will expand forever. The average temperature of everything in the Universe is presently 3 K. This then is the cooled relic of the incredibly hot fireball that existed eons ago, the fossilized grandeur of a bygone era.

The dominant action of the stellar epoch is the formation of stars, intermediate in size between atoms and galaxies. Research during the past [6] several years has provided direct observational evidence that stars are actually forming within galaxies. Galaxies themselves are not forming in the present epoch, but stars within them apparently are - 18 billion years after Bang.

An interesting by-product of star formation is the associated coagulation of matter into planets, life, and intelligence.

This history of the Universe is the prevailing view among most cosmologists. All theoreticians do not agree on specific events before about 1 sec. Depending on the intricacies of the model chosen, the density and temperature during the radiation era can change by several orders of magnitude. In virtually all models, however, the Universe is regarded to have been initially very hot and dense, after which it cooled and thinned.

 

[Augustus]

This figure suggests that in the beginning there was chaos

My scientific miracle is even better now

In the beginning how the heavens and earth
Rose out of chaos:

NASA just verified that the miracle that I found after reading 10 sentences of a random text is highly accurate. Quote mining is easy, as I told you before.

(btw, there appear to have been more than 6 'epochs' hence your text talks about 6 major epochs. The number 6, and what constitutes an 'epoch' seems to rely on human subjectivity. I don't understand astrophysics, but I can count above 6 and counted more epochs than this in other sources)

 

[FearGod]

CP-2156 Life In The Universe - NASA


To place the construction of all matter into perspective, consider figure 1, which summarizes the run of density and temperature throughout all time for a Big-Bang Universe. It represents the consensus of contemporary scientific thought in the broadest sense. Six major epochs are delineated, each corresponding to a major period in the history of the Universe. Specified across the bottom of this figure are the general names of the epochs, along with their time domains. Note that this plot is highly nonlinear, stretching from an incredibly small fraction of a second to the present time, 18 or so billion years after the origin of the Universe. The curves depict the average density and the average temperature of everything in the Universe at any point in time.

This figure suggests that in the beginning there was chaos. One cannot inquire about what happened at the exact moment of the Bang (precisely zero time). Some theorists argue, however, that it is possible to characterize the physical conditions at some extraordinarily small time after the Bang. For example, the currently known laws of physics specify a Universe younger than 10-23 sec to be characterized by an average density greater than 1050 gm/cm3 and an average temperature greater than 1030 K. Of course, it is virtually impossible to appreciate such youth, for 10-23 sec is the amount of time it takes light to cross a proton. Equally difficult to comprehend are the large densities and temperatures characterizing this earliest epoch. The composition of the Universe at this time was indescribable, and its dominant action unimaginable.

The second major epoch is a bit closer to our limits of comprehension, although it is still characterized by severely nonterrestrial conditions - the hadron epoch. The name is derived from the fact that the heavy elementary particles such as protons, neutrons, and mesons, which were the most abundant type of matter at the time, are collectively known as hadrons. Calculations suggest that such particles existed as free unbound entities, considering the high temperature prevalent in the Universe well within its first second of existence. The hadrons unquestionably collided and interacted with one another and with other types of elementary particles, for the density was also extreme. The dominant action at this time is presumed to be the self-annihilation of hadrons into high-energy photons, thus creating a brilliant fireball of radiation. Lacking a solid understanding of elementary particle physics, scientists presently know very little more about this mystifying period.

As the Universe continued its rapid expansion, its contents cooled. A variety of models suggest that about a millisecond after the Bang, the conditions suitable for hadron annihilation had nearly subsided, thus allowing the initially less abundant, lighter elementary particles such as electrons, neutrinos, and muons to predominate. The average density and temperature of this lepton epoch had decreased to about 1010 gm/cm3 and 1010 K. These physical conditions are still excessive by terrestrial standards, but they had diminished considerably compared to the chaotically dense and hot conditions extant a fraction of a second earlier. By the time the first second had elapsed, the leptons were self-annihilating into photons, much as had the hadrons earlier. The radiative fireball of the cosmic bomb was still being fed with new photons.

The radiation density exceeded the matter density by a large amount in these first few minutes; photons of radiation far outnumbered particles of matter. As soon as the elementary particles of matter began to coagulate, fierce radiation destroyed them. For this reason, the first three epochs are [4] often collectively referred to as the radiation era. Whatever matter existed was merely an inconspicuous precipitate suspended in a sea of dense, brilliant radiation.

LATER EPOCHS

The fourth epoch -the atom epoch -extends in time from about 100 sec to about a million years after the Bang. Midway through this epoch, the average density had decreased to about 10-10 gm/cm3, while the average temperature had fallen to about 106 K-values not terribly different from those in the atmospheres of stars today. A principal feature of the atom epoch was the gradual diminution of the original fireball, for the annihilation of hadrons and leptons had all but ceased.

Toward the beginning of the atom epoch, radiation still reigned supreme over matter, for the Universe remained flooded with photons. As the Universe expanded, however, the photon density decreased as the fourth power of the radius of the Universe, while the matter density decreased only as the third power. The early dominance of radiation thus gradually diminished. Sometime between a few minutes and a million years after the Bang, the charged elementary particles of matter were able to coagulate electromagnetically without being broken apart by radiation as quickly as they combined. This was a most important transformation in the history of the Universe. The dominance of radiation had subsided, for matter had gradually become neutralized, a physical state over which radiation has little leverage. Matter had, in a sense, overthrown the cosmic fireball. Henceforth it would dominate radiation as the principal constituent of the Universe. To denote this major turn of events, the last three epochs in figure 1 are collectively known as the matter era.

Once the matter era began, atoms appeared. The influence of radiation had grown so weak that it could no longer prohibit the joining of the leptons and hadrons that had survived annihilation. Hydrogen was the first element to form, since it required only that single electrons be electromagnetically joined to single protons. Copious amounts of hydrogen were synthesized in the early Universe, and it is thus the common ancestor of all things.

Hydrogen was not the only kind of atom formed early in the matter era. Indeed, at the start of the atom epoch, the average temperature of the Universe still exceeded the 107 K necessary to fuse two hydrogen atoms into helium via the proton-proton cycle. The Universe was cooling, but it took time for the average temperature to dip below this critical value. Consequently, some helium atoms must have been produced within the primordial fireball in the same way that they now form in the interior of stars.

[5] Elements heavier than helium, on the other hand, could not have been produced in the early Universe. The synthesis of such elements requires temperatures even greater than 107 K. It also requires lots of helium atoms, for the heavier elements are constructed from lighter ones. The basic difficulty here is that, even though helium atom production was in high gear during the start of the atom epoch, the average temperature was falling quickly. Theoretical calculations suggest that, by the time there were sufficient helium atoms to interact with one another to produce the heavier elements, the temperature had fallen below the threshold value (~108 K) required for the mutual penetration of doubly charged helium nuclei. In contrast to the rapid cooling of the early Universe, the dense interiors of stars in the present Universe are perfectly suited for the generation of hotter temperatures and thus heavier elements. The guts of stars are indeed where the heavies were created-and where they are still being created.

By the end of the atom epoch, matter was in firm control. Sometime during the fifth or galaxy epoch, gravity began to pull some of this matter together into enormous clumps. Galaxies were beginning to form. Indeed, they all must have originated long ago, for observations imply that no galaxies have formed within the past 10 billion years or so. Each galaxy contains substantial numbers of old stars, in addition to an often abundant complement of young stars. The quasars and remote galaxies must have formed in the earliest parts of this epoch.

The time scale of the last two epochs shown in figure 1 has been compressed enormously. An important and rapid series of events occurred immediately after the Bang, especially in the first few minutes that constitute the radiation era. However, once the Universe cooled sufficiently to allow atoms to form, subsequent events occurred more slowly.

By the middle of the galaxy epoch, the average density of the Universe had decreased by another factor of 10 billion, to 10-20 gm/cm3. The average temperature of the entire Universe had also diminished to a relatively cool 3000 K. The Universe was becoming thinner, colder, and darker.

Finally, there is the present stellar epoch. Scientists can say with some assurance that it has been at least 10 billion years since the Bang. In fact, the Universe is probably older than that, perhaps as old as 18 billion years, although its precise aye depends on the yet-to-be-determined change of the Hubble constant with time. The present average density is approximately 10-30 gm/cm3, the critical value above which the Universe will eventually contract and below which the Universe will expand forever. The average temperature of everything in the Universe is presently 3 K. This then is the cooled relic of the incredibly hot fireball that existed eons ago, the fossilized grandeur of a bygone era.

The dominant action of the stellar epoch is the formation of stars, intermediate in size between atoms and galaxies. Research during the past [6] several years has provided direct observational evidence that stars are actually forming within galaxies. Galaxies themselves are not forming in the present epoch, but stars within them apparently are - 18 billion years after Bang.

An interesting by-product of star formation is the associated coagulation of matter into planets, life, and intelligence.

This history of the Universe is the prevailing view among most cosmologists. All theoreticians do not agree on specific events before about 1 sec. Depending on the intricacies of the model chosen, the density and temperature during the radiation era can change by several orders of magnitude. In virtually all models, however, the Universe is regarded to have been initially very hot and dense, after which it cooled and thinned.

According to the 6 days and the present period of time, then we are living very close to the end of time, i think we don't have to add more billions of years as gnostic did, it's already fixed from the first day of creation.

 

[Augustus]

we are living very close to the end of time.

this is a highly irrational belief though.

Most religious believers have thought this throughout history and they have all been wrong, why are you going to be the one who is correct? they all interpreted the same evidence as you and came to the same conclusion. All were wrong.

The earliest Muslims thought the hour was imminent, if not already started. As did medieval Muslims, modern Muslims.

The same with early Christians. Medieval Christians, modern christians.

etc. etc.

 

[FearGod]

this is a highly irrational belief though.

Most religious believers have thought this throughout history and they have all been wrong, why are you going to be the one who is correct? they all interpreted the same evidence as you and came to the same conclusion. All were wrong.

The earliest Muslims thought the hour was imminent, if not already started. As did medieval Muslims, modern Muslims.

The same with early Christians. Medieval Christians, modern christians.

etc. etc.

I didn't say 2020 0r 2050 or 2100

 

[Union]

According to the 6 days and the present period of time, then we are living very close to the end of time, i think we don't have to add more billions of years as gnostic did, it's already fixed from the first day of creation.

Gnostic is a naughty boy ....
Don't worry he will be alright .

 

[Union]

My scientific miracle is even better now

In the beginning how the heavens and earth
Rose out of chaos:

NASA just verified that the miracle that I found after reading 10 sentences of a random text is highly accurate. Quote mining is easy, as I told you before.

(btw, there appear to have been more than 6 'epochs' hence your text talks about 6 major epochs. The number 6, and what constitutes an 'epoch' seems to rely on human subjectivity. I don't understand astrophysics, but I can count above 6 and counted more epochs than this in other sources)

6 major epochs got some sub-sections for sure . You may can take Milton as a prophet and create your own religion ' PARADISE LOST' ( HELL ACHIEVED)

 

[FearGod]

Gnostic is a naughty boy ....
Don't worry he will be alright .

I know that for so long.
Some i had added to my ignore list from the first day but i appreciate gnostic for his inputs even though he's a naughty boy.