The Original Intent of Thanksgiving

[Sir Joseph]

While most Americans enjoy a day off work, family gatherings, and a turkey dinner feast, I'd remind everyone that Thanksgiving was celebrated as a Christian holiday for many years before degenerating into the secular one we see today. Here's just a few words from the nation's first Proclamation for a Public Day of Thanksgiving and Prayer, October 3, 1789, by George Washington:

“Whereas it is the duty of all nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey his will, to be grateful for his benefits, and humbly to implore his protection and favor - and whereas both Houses of Congress have by their joint Committee requested me to recommend to the People of the United States a day of public thanksgiving and prayer to be observed by acknowledging with grateful hearts the many signal favors of Almighty God ...

Now therefore I do recommend and assign Thursday the 26th day of November next to be devoted by the People of these States to the service of that great and glorious Being, who is the beneficent Author of all the good that was, that is, or that will be - That we may then all unite in rendering unto him our sincere and humble thanks - for his kind care and protection of the People of this Country previous to their becoming a Nation - for the signal and manifold mercies, and the favorable interpositions of his Providence ...

and, in general, for all the great and various favors which He has been pleased to confer upon us. And also that we may then unite in most humbly offering our prayers and supplications to the great Lord and Ruler of Nations, and beseech him to pardon our national and other transgressions ...to promote the knowledge and practice of true religion and virtue ...”

No separation of church and state there. Might I suggest that when enjoying the day and giving thanks for your blessings, be sure to credit and honor the right one responsible for those blessings.

 

[Twilight Hue]

While most Americans enjoy a day off work, family gatherings, and a turkey dinner feast, I'd remind everyone that Thanksgiving was celebrated as a Christian holiday for many years before degenerating into the secular one we see today. Here's just a few words from the nation's first Proclamation for a Public Day of Thanksgiving and Prayer, October 3, 1789, by George Washington:

“Whereas it is the duty of all nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey his will, to be grateful for his benefits, and humbly to implore his protection and favor - and whereas both Houses of Congress have by their joint Committee requested me to recommend to the People of the United States a day of public thanksgiving and prayer to be observed by acknowledging with grateful hearts the many signal favors of Almighty God ...

Now therefore I do recommend and assign Thursday the 26th day of November next to be devoted by the People of these States to the service of that great and glorious Being, who is the beneficent Author of all the good that was, that is, or that will be - That we may then all unite in rendering unto him our sincere and humble thanks - for his kind care and protection of the People of this Country previous to their becoming a Nation - for the signal and manifold mercies, and the favorable interpositions of his Providence ...

and, in general, for all the great and various favors which He has been pleased to confer upon us. And also that we may then unite in most humbly offering our prayers and supplications to the great Lord and Ruler of Nations, and beseech him to pardon our national and other transgressions ...to promote the knowledge and practice of true religion and virtue ...”

No separation of church and state there. Might I suggest that when enjoying the day and giving thanks for your blessings, be sure to credit and honor the right one responsible for those blessings.

The right one to atribute Thanksgiving would be Squanto 1585-1622 who had taught the Pilgrims to survive.

Squanto

Squanto (c. 1585-1622 CE), catching eels. Image from page 68 of

www.worldhistory.org

To which after a successful crop and much game the Harvest feast was celebrated with the colonists and the first thanksgiving dinner came to pass.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

While most Americans enjoy a day off work, family gatherings, and a turkey dinner feast, I'd remind everyone that Thanksgiving was celebrated as a Christian holiday for many years before degenerating into the secular one we see today.

You no doubt mean that wondrous Christian principle

Render unto God that which is God's​

and unto the indigenous peoples, ...​

it didn't go well.

 

[ChristineM]

I'd remind everyone that Thanksgiving was celebrated as a Christian holiday

I'm not American but this is not what i was taught in history.

It is belied that the first Thanksgiving was celebrated in 1621 to give thanks for harvest. It was shared by the English colonists of Plymouth and the Wampanoag people who taught the settlers how to grow corn and fish.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I'm not American but this is not what i was taught in history.

It is belied that the first Thanksgiving was celebrated in 1621 to give thanks for harvest. It was shared by the English colonists of Plymouth and the Wampanoag people who taught the settlers how to grow corn and fish.

Google the Smithsonian:

The Myths of the Thanksgiving Story and the Lasting Damage They Imbue​

Note, for example ...

What are the most poignant inaccuracies in this story?

One is that history doesn’t begin for Native people until Europeans arrive. People had been in the Americas for least 12,000 years and according to some Native traditions, since the beginning of time. And having history start with the English is a way of dismissing all that. The second is that the arrival of the Mayflower is some kind of first-contact episode. It’s not. Wampanoags had a century of contact with Europeans–it was bloody and it involved slave raiding by Europeans. At least two and maybe more Wampanoags, when the Pilgrims arrived, spoke English, had already been to Europe and back and knew the very organizers of the Pilgrims’ venture.

Most poignantly, using a shared dinner as a symbol for colonialism really has it backward. No question about it, Wampanoag leader Ousamequin reached out to the English at Plymouth and wanted an alliance with them. But it’s not because he was innately friendly. It’s because his people have been decimated by an epidemic disease, and Ousamequin sees the English as an opportunity to fend off his tribal rebels. That’s not the stuff of Thanksgiving pageants. The Thanksgiving myth doesn’t address the deterioration of this relationship culminating in one of the most horrific colonial Indian wars on record, King Philip’s War, and also doesn’t address Wampanoag survival and adaptation over the centuries, which is why they’re still here, despite the odds.​

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

Thanksgiving was celebrated as a Christian holiday for many years before degenerating into the secular one we see today.

Happy Thanksgiving, all.

Perhaps you would agree that Thanksgiving isn't religious holiday any more for most, which is a good thing in my opinion. The modern form of the holiday is more inclusive than a religious holiday. One is always free to worship his god quietly and understand the holiday in religious terms while the irreligious sharing a table with him can enjoy the gathering and meal without prayers and religious references.

I find religious celebrations where I live, which is in Mexico, elevating. The major Christian holidays are still Christian.

Their Easter has no colored eggs or bunnies. They have an actor playing Jesus dragging a cross while being flogged on Good Friday, followed by a simulated crucifixion (these recreations are called passion plays). Easter day is spent at the parish church:

It's preceded a week earlier by a Palm Sunday procession of Jesus marching into Jerusalem sing actual palm fronds. I've marched in one of those myself holding a braided palm frond:

Their Christmas has no Santa or tinsel or tree. It has mangers, magi, and baby Jesus. Here's a pregnant Mary traveling with her husband in search of a place to have her baby (these recreations are called posadas; a posada is an inn). They reenact the couple being turned away at a few doors before being welcomed into a prearranged "manger" or inn, at which time those kids following break open a pinata:

Their version of Halloween, though not a religious holiday for most English-speaking people and west Europeans, is a religious holiday celebrated on November 1-2 here called Dia de Muertos, where shrines are built to honor the memory of the deceased and Catrinas (women skeletons) are abundant:

The Mexicans have no equivalent to Thanksgiving.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Perhaps you would agree that Thanksgiving isn't religious holiday any more for most, which is a good thing in my opinion.

As opposed to when?

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

While most Americans enjoy a day off work, family gatherings, and a turkey dinner feast, I'd remind everyone that Thanksgiving was celebrated as a Christian holiday for many years before degenerating into the secular one we see today. Here's just a few words from the nation's first Proclamation for a Public Day of Thanksgiving and Prayer, October 3, 1789, by George Washington:

“Whereas it is the duty of all nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey his will, to be grateful for his benefits, and humbly to implore his protection and favor - and whereas both Houses of Congress have by their joint Committee requested me to recommend to the People of the United States a day of public thanksgiving and prayer to be observed by acknowledging with grateful hearts the many signal favors of Almighty God ...

Now therefore I do recommend and assign Thursday the 26th day of November next to be devoted by the People of these States to the service of that great and glorious Being, who is the beneficent Author of all the good that was, that is, or that will be - That we may then all unite in rendering unto him our sincere and humble thanks - for his kind care and protection of the People of this Country previous to their becoming a Nation - for the signal and manifold mercies, and the favorable interpositions of his Providence ...

and, in general, for all the great and various favors which He has been pleased to confer upon us. And also that we may then unite in most humbly offering our prayers and supplications to the great Lord and Ruler of Nations, and beseech him to pardon our national and other transgressions ...to promote the knowledge and practice of true religion and virtue ...”

No separation of church and state there. Might I suggest that when enjoying the day and giving thanks for your blessings, be sure to credit and honor the right one responsible for those blessings.

Also, George Washington, a Christian, expressed his personal disdain for Native Americans.

“The immediate objectives are the total destruction and devastation of their settlements and the capture of as many prisoners of every age and sex as possible. It will be essential to ruin their crops in the ground and prevent their planting more.” (Nice Day for a Genocide: Shocking Quotes on Indians By US Leaders).

 

[wellwisher]

I'm not American but this is not what i was taught in history.

It is belied that the first Thanksgiving was celebrated in 1621 to give thanks for harvest. It was shared by the English colonists of Plymouth and the Wampanoag people who taught the settlers how to grow corn and fish.

The real story of Thanksgiving begins with the first summer in Plymouth. The Colony was set up to run like a Socialist commune, where the fruit of everyone's labor was combined and distributed to everyone, equally. The problem this created, was the older boys and younger men, did not do they share of the work, since they realize they could eat and not work, base on the socialists model; social safety hammock.

Plymouth is near the ocean and has nice beaches, so the young men enjoyed exploring and swimming instead of working. When the fall came, their food stockpiles were not up to snuff. That winter took a lot of the older people due to sickness.

The following spring, they decided to change from a socialist commune and allow some free market capitalism. They had a quota, but everyone was allowed to keep any extra food they produced, to sell or trade. This motivated the young men, and everyone, such that by the fall, they had so much extra food, that they had a huge feast; First Thanksgiving.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Also, George Washington, a Christian, expressed his personal disdain for Native Americans.

(I suspect that this post has devolved into some counterproductive trivia game.)

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

The real story of Thanksgiving begins with the first summer in Plymouth. The Colony was set up to run like a Socialist commune, where the fruit of everyone's labor was combined and distributed to everyone, equally.

Source?

 

[wellwisher]

Source?

This is based on the Journal of William Bradford who was the Governor at the time of the Pilgrims

“The story of the Pilgrims begins in the early part of the seventeenth century (that’s the 1600s ). The Church of England under King James I was persecuting anyone and everyone who did not recognize its absolute civil and spiritual authority.” The first Pilgrims were Christian rebels, folks. “Those who challenged [King James’] ecclesiastical authority and those who believed strongly in freedom of worship were hunted down, imprisoned, and sometimes executed for their beliefs” in England in the 1600s.

“A group of separatists,” Christians who didn’t want to buy into the Church of England or live under the rule of King James, “first fled to Holland and established a community” of themselves there. “After eleven years, about forty of them” having heard about this New World Christopher Columbus had discovered, decided to go. Forty of them “agreed to make a perilous journey to the New World, where [they knew] they would certainly face hardships, but” the reason they did it was so they “could live and worship God according to the dictates of their own consciences” and beliefs.

“On August 1, 1620, the Mayflower set sail. It carried a total of 102 passengers, including forty Pilgrims,” now known as Pilgrims, “led by William Bradford. On the journey, Bradford set up an agreement, a contract, that established” how they would live once they got there. The contract set forth “just and equal laws for all members of the new community, irrespective of their religious beliefs,” or political beliefs. “Where did the revolutionary ideas expressed in the Mayflower Compact come from? From the Bible.

The Pilgrims were a “devoutly religious people completely steeped in the lessons of the Old and New Testaments. They looked to the ancient Israelites for their example. And, because of the biblical precedents set forth in Scripture, they never doubted that their experiment would work.” They believed in God. They believed they were in the hands of God. As you know, “this was no pleasure cruise, friends. The journey” to the New World on the tiny, by today’s standards, sailing ship. It was long, it was arduous.

There was sickness, there was seasickness, it was wet. It was the opposite of anything you think of today as a cruise today on the open ocean. When they “landed in New England in November, they found, according to Bradford’s detailed journal, a cold, barren, desolate wilderness. There were no friends to greet them, he wrote. There were no houses to shelter them. There were no inns where they could refresh themselves.” There was nothing.

[T]he sacrifice they had made for freedom was just beginning. During the first winter, half the Pilgrims — including Bradford’s own wife — died of either starvation, sickness or exposure.” They endured that first winter. “When spring finally came,” they had, by that time, met the indigenous people, the Indians, and indeed the “Indians taught the settlers how to plant corn, fish for cod and skin beavers” and other animals “for coats.” But there wasn’t any prosperity. “[T]hey did not yet prosper!” They were still dependent. They were still confused. They were still in a new place, essentially alone among likeminded people.

“This is important to understand because this is where modern American history lessons often end. Thanksgiving is actually explained in some textbooks as a holiday for which the Pilgrims gave thanks to the Indians for saving their lives, rather than what it really was. That happened, don’t misunderstand. That all happened, but that’s not — according to William Bradford’s journal — what they ultimately gave thanks for. “Here is the part that has been omitted: The original contract” that they made on the Mayflower as they were traveling to the New World…

They actually had to enter into that contract “with their merchant-sponsors in London,” because they had no money on their own. The needed sponsor. They found merchants in London to sponsor them. The merchants in London were making an investment, and as such, the Pilgrims agreed that “everything they produced to go into a common store,” or bank, common account, “and each member of the community was entitled to one common share” in this bank. Out of this, the merchants would be repaid until they were paid off.

“All of the land they cleared and the houses they built belong to the community as well.” Everything belonged to everybody and everybody had one share in it. They were going to distribute it equally.” That was considered to be the epitome of fairness, sharing the hardship burdens and everything like that. “Nobody owned anything. It was a commune, folks. It was the forerunner to the communes we saw in the ’60s and ’70s out in California,” and other parts of the country, “and it was complete with organic vegetables, by the way.

“Bradford, who had become the new governor of the colony, recognized that” it wasn’t working. It “was as costly and destructive…” His own journals chronicle the reasons it didn’t work. “Bradford assigned a plot of land” to fix this “to each family to work and manage,” as their own. He got rid of the whole commune structure and “assigned a plot of land to each family to work and manage,” and whatever they made, however much they made, was theirs. They could sell it, they could share it, they could keep it, whatever they wanted to do.

What really happened is they “turned loose” the power of a free market after enduring months and months of hardship — first on the Mayflower and then getting settled and then the failure of the common account from which everybody got the same share. There was no incentive for anybody to do anything. And as is human nature, some of the Pilgrims were a bunch of lazy twerps, and others busted their rear ends. But it didn’t matter because even the people that weren’t very industrious got the same as everyone else. Bradford wrote about how this just wasn’t working.

“What Bradford and his community found,” and I’m going to use basically his own words, “was that the most creative and industrious people had no incentive to work any harder than anyone else… [W]hile most of the rest of the world has been experimenting with socialism for well over a hundred years — trying to refine it, perfect it, and re-invent it — the Pilgrims decided early on,” William Bradford decided, “to scrap it permanently,” because it brought out the worst in human nature, it emphasized laziness, it created resentment.

Because in every group of people you’ve got your self-starters you’ve got your hard workers and your industrious people, and you’ve got your lazy twerps and so forth, and there was no difference at the end of the day. The resentment sprang up on both sides. So Bradford wrote about this. “‘For this community [so far as it was] was found to breed much confusion and discontent, and retard much employment that would have been to their benefit and comfort.

“For young men that were most able and fit for labor and service did repine that they should spend their time and strength to work for other men’s wives and children without any recompense,'” without any payment, “‘that was thought injustice.’ Why should you work for other people when you can’t work for yourself? What’s the point? … The Pilgrims found that people could not be expected to do their best work without incentive.

“So what did Bradford’s community try next? They unharnessed the power of good old free enterprise by invoking the undergirding capitalistic principle of private property. Every family was assigned its own plot of land to work and permitted to market its own crops and products. And what was the result? ‘This had very good success,’ wrote Bradford, ‘for it made all hands [everybody] industrious, so as much more corn was planted than otherwise would have been.’

“Is it possible that supply-side economics could have existed before the 1980s. … In no time, the Pilgrims found they had more food than they could eat themselves. Now, this is where it gets really good, folks, if you’re laboring under the misconception that I was, as I was taught in school. So they set up trading posts and exchanged goods with the Indians. The profits allowed them to pay off their debts to the merchants in London.

“And the success and prosperity of the Plymouth settlement attracted more Europeans and began what came to be known as the ‘Great Puritan Migration.'” The word of the success of the free enterprise Plymouth Colony spread like wildfire and that began the great migration. Everybody wanted a part of it. There was no mass slaughtering of the Indians. There was no wiping out of the indigenous people, and eventually — in William Bradford’s own journal — unleashing the industriousness of all hands ended up producing more than they could ever need themselves.

So trading post began selling and exchanging things with the Indians — and the Indians, by the way, were very helpful. Puritan kids had relationships with the children of the Native Americans that they found. This killing the indigenous people stuff, they’re talking about much, much, much, much later. It has nothing to do with the first thanksgiving.

The first Thanksgiving was William Bradford and Plymouth Colony thanking God for their blessings. That’s the first Thanksgiving. Nothing wrong with being grateful to the Indians; don’t misunderstand. But the true meaning of Thanksgiving — and this is what George Washington recognized in his first Thanksgiving proclamation.

This was the transcript from the Late Rush Limbaugh's talk show program, on Thanksgiving day.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

This is based on the Journal of William Bradford who was the Governor at the time of the Pilgrims

Source, preferably with some reference to "socialism," and please stop confusing verbosity with responsiveness.

 

[Stevicus]

I'm not American but this is not what i was taught in history.

It is belied that the first Thanksgiving was celebrated in 1621 to give thanks for harvest. It was shared by the English colonists of Plymouth and the Wampanoag people who taught the settlers how to grow corn and fish.

I was taught that at first, although as I learned a bit more about it, I realized a lot of it was a myth.

Thanksgiving (United States) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

But similar fall harvest celebrations can probably be found in many cultures.

 

[Viker]

be sure to credit and honor the right one responsible for those blessings

Okay.

Thank you Gitche Manitou, Atira, Ga-lv-la-ti c-hi, U-ne-la-nv-hi, Yéi, Wakan Tanka and so many other names! Praise to you! Blessings for all!


(Various Native American names for God/Goddess)

 

[wellwisher]

Source, preferably with some reference to "socialism," and please stop confusing verbosity with responsiveness.

Read the journal of William Bradford.
Of Plymouth Plantation by William Bradford - History of Massachusetts Blog

The journal is 270 pages and I summarized it to maybe 2 pages.

“What Bradford and his community found,” and I’m going to use basically his own words, “was that the most creative and industrious people had no incentive to work any harder than anyone else… [W]hile most of the rest of the world has been experimenting with socialism for well over a hundred years — trying to refine it, perfect it, and re-invent it — the Pilgrims decided early on,” William Bradford decided, “to scrap it permanently,” because it brought out the worst in human nature, it emphasized laziness, it created resentment.

 

[Spice]

The first documented American Thanksgiving was in 1619 at Barkley Plantation in Virginia. . . up river on the James from Jamestown. This was for the safe arrival of a late arriving supply ship.

If we're going to fantasy and mythologize history into great Christian events, let's do it well!

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

While most Americans enjoy a day off work, family gatherings, and a turkey dinner feast, I'd remind everyone that Thanksgiving was celebrated as a Christian holiday for many years before degenerating into the secular one we see today. Here's just a few words from the nation's first Proclamation for a Public Day of Thanksgiving and Prayer, October 3, 1789, by George Washington:

“Whereas it is the duty of all nations to acknowledge the providence of Almighty God, to obey his will, to be grateful for his benefits, and humbly to implore his protection and favor - and whereas both Houses of Congress have by their joint Committee requested me to recommend to the People of the United States a day of public thanksgiving and prayer to be observed by acknowledging with grateful hearts the many signal favors of Almighty God ...

Now therefore I do recommend and assign Thursday the 26th day of November next to be devoted by the People of these States to the service of that great and glorious Being, who is the beneficent Author of all the good that was, that is, or that will be - That we may then all unite in rendering unto him our sincere and humble thanks - for his kind care and protection of the People of this Country previous to their becoming a Nation - for the signal and manifold mercies, and the favorable interpositions of his Providence ...

and, in general, for all the great and various favors which He has been pleased to confer upon us. And also that we may then unite in most humbly offering our prayers and supplications to the great Lord and Ruler of Nations, and beseech him to pardon our national and other transgressions ...to promote the knowledge and practice of true religion and virtue ...”

No separation of church and state there. Might I suggest that when enjoying the day and giving thanks for your blessings, be sure to credit and honor the right one responsible for those blessings.

And in a few weeks when you put up a christmass tree, don't forget to celebrate the winter solstice symbolizing the regaining of strength by the sun god.

 

[Revoltingest]

While most Americans enjoy a day off work, family gatherings, and a turkey dinner feast, I'd remind everyone that Thanksgiving was celebrated as a Christian holiday for many years before degenerating into the secular one we see today.

"Degenerating"?
Nay.
Progressing to a holiday for all, not just Christians.

 

[Revoltingest]

Source, preferably with some reference to "socialism," and please stop confusing verbosity with responsiveness.

Socialism Failed Miserably For The Pilgrims, Just Like It Does Everywhere

Today's democratic socialists like to claim real socialism has never been tried in America, but they're wrong. The Pilgrims did try it — and it failed.

thefederalist.com

In addition to flirting with socialism (before that word
existed), some colonists also tried wage & price controls
Those worked poorly also.

Price Controls and Economic Literacy: Colonial Edition - Econlib

As you may know, the American Revolution swiftly led to hyperinflation and price controls. From Rothbard’s Conceived in Liberty, vol. 4: By the end of 1775, Congress had already increased the nation’s money supply by 50 percent in less than a year, and state paper issues had already begun in...

www.econlib.org