The Peace Thread

[Estro Felino]

I put this thread into the Political debates section because I wanted to ask people: why don't people desire peace?
Peace is so beautiful. It's a state of mind; it's a spiritual derivation from Love.

Why are people obsessed with the Us vs Them mentality? We are good, they are bad.
That's absolutely horrific.

Peace is about hope for a better future, where people are happy. We are all good. There are no bad people a priori.

Please, express your stance on peace. That we have taken for granted, for so long.

 

[Heyo]

I put this thread into the Politics thread because I wanted to ask people: why don't people desire peace?
Peace is so beautiful. It's a state of mind; it's a spiritual derivation from Love.

Why are people obsessed with the Us vs Them mentality? We are good, they are bad.
That's absolutely horrific.

It's fear. In our evolutionary past, the arrival of a new tribe could mean that they carry diseases or that that they may compete for scarce resources. That's why we fear the unknown.
Next is that some people profit from war and they use fear to drive the angsty into it.

Societies that have eliminated or reduced existential fear are usually less belligerent. Most countries in Europe have a functioning social net, stable government and stable economies. People are less fearful here and more peaceful.
People in the US are probably the most fearful among the industrialised world. That's why they are also the most belligerent.

Take away people's fear and they start to love to live in peace.

 

[Estro Felino]

It's fear. In our evolutionary past, the arrival of new tribe could mean that they carry diseases or that that they may compete for scarce resources. That's why we fear the unknown.
Next is that some people profit from war and they use fear to drive the angsty into it.

Societies that have eliminated or reduced existential fear are usually less belligerent. Most countries in Europe have a functioning social net, stable government and stable economies. People are less fearful here and more peaceful.
People in the US are probably the most fearful among the industrialised world. That's why they are also the most belligerent.

Take away people's fear and they start to love to live in peace.

I was thinking: does the conflict in Ukraine have any meaning?
It doesn't.
It's Russians vs Ukrainians. Fighting an useless, meaningless, self-destructive war. Two nations that speak almost the same language. They are almost identical cultures.
They should be allies. And yet they fight against one another.
They say peace with the same word. Mir.
It's heartbreaking that this word doesn't bring them together.

 

[MikeF]

Why are people obsessed with the Us vs Them mentality?

I would suggest that we are genetically programed to have that mentality. We can condition and socialize ourselves in ways that help mitigate this programmed behavior, but it will always be there under the surface and always present in subsequent generations unless there is a change in our collective genome.

 

[bobhikes]

My opinion is that it is ego. For us to continue living we had to be built to strive for more. We would have died out pretty quickly if our goal was to live in peace. The problem becomes what more means to us.

 

[ChristineM]

I was thinking: does the conflict in Ukraine have any meaning?

It has meaning to Putin, ego means so much to him

It has meaning to Zelenskyy, protecting his back garden from invaders.

And there is your answer to the OP, ego and nationalism are certainly huge motivators for war

 

[Estro Felino]

My opinion is that it is ego. For us to continue living we had to be built to strive for more. We would have died out pretty quickly if our goal was to live in peace. The problem becomes what more means to us.

I understand your point; once someone said: it's struggle that keeps us alive.
Goethe wrote a work of literature called Faust and revolves around this concept.

But in my Christian perspective, peace is something that is attainable, and does keep us alive.
Spiritually alive.

I don't care about dying. I have never feared death. Because I know what's in the afterlife.

 

[bobhikes]

I understand your point; once someone said: it's struggle that keeps us alive.
Goethe wrote a work of literature called Faust and revolves around this concept.

But in my Christian perspective, peace is something that is attainable, and does keep us alive.
Spiritually alive.

I don't care about dying. I have never feared death. Because I know what's in the afterlife.

As a learned ex Christian, I understand the perspective and the goal, but I don't see it attainable in the present, but only in the afterlife as taught by religion and experiences. The Bible and New Testament teach that this world is for trials. If you pass the trails God will reward you with a beautiful peaceful experience. A study of human nature indicates that this world is about overcoming challenges with an afterlife of absolute peace.

As I reject an afterlife, I still have no fear of dying. Not because I seek the afterlife but because I tire of the challenges of life.

 

[Kfox]

I put this thread into the Political debates section because I wanted to ask people: why don't people desire peace?
Peace is so beautiful. It's a state of mind; it's a spiritual derivation from Love.

Why are people obsessed with the Us vs Them mentality? We are good, they are bad.
That's absolutely horrific.

Peace is about hope for a better future, where people are happy. We are all good. There are no bad people a priori.

Please, express your stance on peace. That we have taken for granted, for so long.

I think it would be a mistake to assume because people fight, they don't want peace. Like it or not, evil does exist, and sometimes good people see evil actions and they feel a moral obligation to stop it.

 

[Estro Felino]

I think it would be a mistake to assume because people fight, they don't want peace. Like it or not, evil does exist, and sometimes good people see evil actions and they feel a moral obligation to stop it.

Yes, and religion plays a role in that.
My God tells me that justice is something only God can do.
We cannot replace God. We are not God.

The only thing we can do is to try to dissuade people from waging wars, through messages of peace.

 

[metis]

As British anthropologist Desmond Morris once said, we humans are "naked apes" that share the vast majority of chimp's genes and behavior. They & we can be very warlike but then also very compassionate.

 

[icehorse]

Why are people obsessed with the Us vs Them mentality? We are good, they are bad.
That's absolutely horrific.

I think the reality is that we're all constantly bombarded with "us vs. them" propaganda from our "leaders" who are all being bribed by oligarchs. War and conflict are profitable, and power is intoxicating.

We the people MUST start realizing how powerful propaganda is and take steps to resist it!

 

[Estro Felino]

I think the reality is that we're all constantly bombarded with "us vs. them" propaganda from our "leaders" who are all being bribed by oligarchs. War and conflict are profitable, and power is intoxicating.

We the people MUST start realizing how powerful propaganda is and take steps to resist it!

Divide et impera. Latin motto.

That is, the elites divide the commoners according to a binary scheme, and then they rule over the two categories who kill one another.

 

[Kfox]

Yes, and religion plays a role in that.
My God tells me that justice is something only God can do.
We cannot replace God. We are not God.

Yeah; but you gotta admit; God has a long history of allowing evil people to dominate the good. For some people, waiting on God to fix it isn't good enough, we need to fix it ourselves.

 

[Estro Felino]

Yeah; but you gotta admit; God has a long history of allowing evil people to dominate the good. For some people, waiting on God to fix it isn't good enough, we need to fix it ourselves.

God doesn't have the power to stop people's free will.

 

[Kfox]

God doesn't have the power to stop people's free will.

So you agree with me?

 

[Estro Felino]

So you agree with me?

Yes, but through peace we can achieve peace.
Through war we get war.

 

[Kfox]

Yes, but through peace we can achieve peace.
Through war we get war.

Things don't always work out that way in the real world. Peace didn't prevent monsters like Hitler, Stalin, Mao, or Amin from committing the atrocities they committed.