Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
YamiB. said:Do you think that having Under God in the pledge violates the first ammendment of the US Consitution? Do you think it should be taken out?
I think it is a clear referal to the Abrahamic religions as they are really the religions that use God. Not to mention the fact that it was pushed in by the Knights of Columbus.SPLogan said:"Under God" does not discriminate against any particular religion (except for maybe Atheism, but most Atheists do not even consider Atheism a religion).
"Under God" basically stands in opposition to "under human tyranny." In the United States, we pledge that we are one nation that is not under human tyranny. We are rather "under God." In my opinion, that is merely a theistic stance and does not carry any real government imposed religious doctrine. It just means that authority does not finally rest in mere human opinion.
YamiB. said:I'm sure a topic has already been done on this. But I haven't seen one specificly for it recently.
Do you think that having Under God in the pledge violates the first ammendment of the US Consitution? Do you think it should be taken out?
Booko said:I'm a traditionalist.
I say we keep the pledge the way our Founding Fathers gave it to us.
Only if somebody is forced to say it, or not allowed to put in their own word or phrase instead of that.YamiB. said:I'm sure a topic has already been done on this. But I haven't seen one specificly for it recently.
Do you think that having Under God in the pledge violates the first ammendment of the US Consitution? Do you think it should be taken out?
:biglaugh:Booko said:I'm a traditionalist.
I say we keep the pledge the way our Founding Fathers gave it to us.
PetShopBoy88 said:Only if somebody is forced to say it, or not allowed to put in their own word or phrase instead of that.
Sure, why not? Last time I looked, however, the Pledge of Allegiance was essentially just "tradition". It's not like it's an "official" document of the United States Government or something.YamiB. said:Why should it be that the offical version has this non-inclusive phrase. Shouldn't it be that if somebody really wants to have Under God in there they can just add it?
PetShopBoy88 said:Sure, why not? Last time I looked, however, the Pledge of Allegiance was essentially just "tradition". It's not like it's an "official" document of the United States Government or something.
Yes, that's true.YamiB. said:Well it does have some government involvement as it was Congress that added the Under God part in the 50s.
SPLogan said:"Under God" does not discriminate against any particular religion (except for maybe Atheism, but most Atheists do not even consider Atheism a religion).
PetShopBoy88 said:Sure, why not? Last time I looked, however, the Pledge of Allegiance was essentially just "tradition". It's not like it's an "official" document of the United States Government or something.
YamiB. said:Well it does have some government involvement as it was Congress that added the Under God part in the 50s.
I never was, and I've never met anyone who was.Booko said:Yeah, but kids are "officially" forced to say it in schools.
Yes. And quakers do because they don't believe in making promises or pledges, and many other people do because it's just plain wrong.That's a problem with some groups. Don't JWs have a problem with it, because they don't believe in pledging allegiance to anything but God?
Jehovah's Witnesses will not say the pledge. They consider it idolatrous to pledge allegiance either to the flag or to the Republic. I agree with them about that, and I also think that nationalism and patriotism are strange and divisive ideas. All people are our brothers and sisters, even if some of them were born on the other side of an imaginary line; our homeland is not defined as the areas that pay taxes to the same people we do.Booko said:That's a problem with some groups. Don't JWs have a problem with it, because they don't believe in pledging allegiance to anything but God? They will obey the gov't, but their allegiance is not there. May would know for sure.
PetShopBoy88 said:I never was, and I've never met anyone who was.
MidnightBlue said:I agree with them about that, and I also think that nationalism and patriotism are strange and divisive ideas.
Rather than restoring the pledge to its pre-1954 form, why not just drop it altogether?
Sometimes it seems to me that everything that's labeled patriotism is really jingoism. I think I've lived in South Carolina too long.Booko said:Oh, I think patriotism is a fine idea. The problem is that what's labeled patriotism is so often jingoism.
I know; that's why I fruballed you for it.Booko said:That's why I said what I did in my initial post in this thread.