The real Messiah!!!

[Poisonshady313]

as that does not fulfill the requirement that the Messiah be the son of God.

There is no such requirement. It is pure foolishness to suggest otherwise.

 

[Blackdog22]

No and neither did Jesus! Only those with eyes that see know the true meaning of the words!

Okay, David here is your chance. Here is the verse and you must have the true meaning of this verse for you are the..... messiah.....

Here is the passage.....


Immediately Jesus made the disciples get into the boat and go on ahead of him to the other side, while he dismissed the crowd. 23 After he had dismissed them, he went up on a mountainside by himself to pray. Later that night, he was there alone, 24 and the boat was already a considerable distance from land, buffeted by the waves because the wind was against it. 25 Shortly before dawn Jesus went out to them, walking on the lake. 26 When the disciples saw him walking on the lake, they were terrified. “It’s a ghost,” they said, and cried out in fear.
27 But Jesus immediately said to them: “Take courage! It is I. Don’t be afraid.”
28 “Lord, if it’s you,” Peter replied, “tell me to come to you on the water.”
29 “Come,” he said.
Then Peter got down out of the boat, walked on the water and came toward Jesus. 30 But when he saw the wind, he was afraid and, beginning to sink, cried out, “Lord, save me!”
31 Immediately Jesus reached out his hand and caught him. “You of little faith,” he said, “why did you doubt?”
32 And when they climbed into the boat, the wind died down. 33 Then those who were in the boat worshiped him, saying, “Truly you are the Son of God.”







For normal human beings this means that Jesus walked on water. So please, with your holy powers, explain what this verse means to all of us too blind to see.

 

[Pegg]

There is no such requirement. It is pure foolishness to suggest otherwise.

the messiah was always going to come from a virgin
Isaiah 7:14 Therefore Jehovah himself will give YOU men a sign: Look! The maiden herself will actually become pregnant, and she is giving birth to a son

With no human father, the messiah can only be a son of God.

 

[Jacksnyte]

Okay, David here is your chance. Here is the verse and you must have the true meaning of this verse for you are the..... messiah.....

Here is the passage.....


Immediately Jesus made the disciples get into the boat and go on ahead of him to the other side, while he dismissed the crowd. 23 After he had dismissed them, he went up on a mountainside by himself to pray. Later that night, he was there alone, 24 and the boat was already a considerable distance from land, buffeted by the waves because the wind was against it. 25 Shortly before dawn Jesus went out to them, walking on the lake. 26 When the disciples saw him walking on the lake, they were terrified. “It’s a ghost,” they said, and cried out in fear.
27 But Jesus immediately said to them: “Take courage! It is I. Don’t be afraid.”
28 “Lord, if it’s you,” Peter replied, “tell me to come to you on the water.”
29 “Come,” he said.
Then Peter got down out of the boat, walked on the water and came toward Jesus. 30 But when he saw the wind, he was afraid and, beginning to sink, cried out, “Lord, save me!”
31 Immediately Jesus reached out his hand and caught him. “You of little faith,” he said, “why did you doubt?”
32 And when they climbed into the boat, the wind died down. 33 Then those who were in the boat worshiped him, saying, “Truly you are the Son of God.”







For normal human beings this means that Jesus walked on water. So please, with your holy powers, explain what this verse means to all of us too blind to see.

This is a miracle story. One of many like it from many different faiths. This is not what the Jewish Messiah was supposed to be at all, and is proof of nothing.

 

[HiddenDjinn]

the messiah was always going to come from a virgin
Isaiah 7:14 Therefore Jehovah himself will give YOU men a sign: Look! The maiden herself will actually become pregnant, and she is giving birth to a son

With no human father, the messiah can only be a son of God.

Um...Even the Catholic Church is now fixing that mistranslation. That verse neither mentions a virgin birth(the word in Hebrew means "young woman", not virgin) nor a coming Moshiach(It's referring to a sign that a king was about to fall).

 

[Jacksnyte]

the messiah was always going to come from a virgin
Isaiah 7:14 Therefore Jehovah himself will give YOU men a sign: Look! The maiden herself will actually become pregnant, and she is giving birth to a son

With no human father, the messiah can only be a son of God.

Have you looked at the geneaologies of Jesus? The messiah was supposed to be of the house of David. Joseph was of the house of David, but Jesus was not, as Joseph was not his father! The "born of a virgin" idea is due to a misinterperetation of the word meaning basically "young woman", and the epithet "son of god" was commonly used by Hebrews self-referentially.

 

[David69]

Okay, David here is your chance. Here is the verse and you must have the true meaning of this verse for you are the..... messiah.....

Here is the passage.....


Immediately Jesus made the disciples get into the boat and go on ahead of him to the other side, while he dismissed the crowd. 23 After he had dismissed them, he went up on a mountainside by himself to pray. Later that night, he was there alone, 24 and the boat was already a considerable distance from land, buffeted by the waves because the wind was against it. 25 Shortly before dawn Jesus went out to them, walking on the lake. 26 When the disciples saw him walking on the lake, they were terrified. “It’s a ghost,” they said, and cried out in fear.
27 But Jesus immediately said to them: “Take courage! It is I. Don’t be afraid.”
28 “Lord, if it’s you,” Peter replied, “tell me to come to you on the water.”
29 “Come,” he said.
Then Peter got down out of the boat, walked on the water and came toward Jesus. 30 But when he saw the wind, he was afraid and, beginning to sink, cried out, “Lord, save me!”
31 Immediately Jesus reached out his hand and caught him. “You of little faith,” he said, “why did you doubt?”
32 And when they climbed into the boat, the wind died down. 33 Then those who were in the boat worshiped him, saying, “Truly you are the Son of God.”







For normal human beings this means that Jesus walked on water. So please, with your holy powers, explain what this verse means to all of us too blind to see.

Its to do with Peters deniel of jesus :yes: Jesus took Peter to be re born with him on earth and if it takes a life time Peter will see the light. My brother is peter and he is a fisherman but although he does go out catching fish, fisher of men means something completely different.

Anyway you troll, You had your chance m8 and are very nasty so as I have allready sugested, go do one or al turn the tables m8, now scurry off!!!

 

[David69]

This is a miracle story. One of many like it from many different faiths. This is not what the Jewish Messiah was supposed to be at all, and is proof of nothing.

and there was no myricles, Christians took words literally as they were meant to, true meaning kept for those with eyes to see. There are many hidden secrets!

 

[David69]

Have you looked at the geneaologies of Jesus? The messiah was supposed to be of the house of David. Joseph was of the house of David, but Jesus was not, as Joseph was not his father! The "born of a virgin" idea is due to a misinterperetation of the word meaning basically "young woman", and the epithet "son of god" was commonly used by Hebrews self-referentially.

Who knows the true lineage!!!

 

[Poisonshady313]

the messiah was always going to come from a virgin
Isaiah 7:14 Therefore Jehovah himself will give YOU men a sign: Look! The maiden herself will actually become pregnant, and she is giving birth to a son

With no human father, the messiah can only be a son of God.

First off, if you read Isaiah 7, you might learn that they weren't talking about a prophecy of something to happen after an untold number of generations, but it was something that could be expected to happen (and did happen) in the lifetime of the person to whom it was spoken... which was approx 700 years before the life and times of Jesus.

Then there's the bit that Yosi already mentioned.

Then there's the fact that the Messiah is scheduled to be a "son of David". A descendant. Which, in the ways of keeping track of such things was in those days and continues to be in Jewish circles, was from father to son.

To suggest that the Messiah requires a virgin birth is absolute nonsense.

 

[David69]

First off, if you read Isaiah 7, you might learn that they weren't talking about a prophecy of something to happen after an untold number of generations, but it was something that could be expected to happen (and did happen) in the lifetime of the person to whom it was spoken... which was approx 700 years before the life and times of Jesus.

Then there's the bit that Yosi already mentioned.

Then there's the fact that the Messiah is scheduled to be a "son of David". A descendant. Which, in the ways of keeping track of such things was in those days and continues to be in Jewish circles, was from father to son.

To suggest that the Messiah requires a virgin birth is absolute nonsense.

I agree. Personally I beleive joseph to be yeshuas father.
Urrrm PS, Many jews fled and mixed with gentiles so theres a good chance mashiach is a gentile! Look at post # 147 you avoided it! alot of jews beleive different to your racist veiw

 

[Pegg]

Um...Even the Catholic Church is now fixing that mistranslation. That verse neither mentions a virgin birth(the word in Hebrew means "young woman", not virgin) nor a coming Moshiach(It's referring to a sign that a king was about to fall).

its the greek septuagint version of the hebrew scriptures that translates the hebrew word 'al‧mah' as 'virgin'

You likely know that the Septuagint was translated by 70 jewish scholars. So even if the hebrew word 'al‧mah is not now considered to mean virgin, it certainly was back then in the 2nd century bce.

And while the prophecy of Isaiah had an initial fulfillment, it is also reasonable to conclude that it would have further fulfillment. Isaiah said “Behold, I and the children whom Jehovah hath given me are for signs and for wonders in Israel from Jehovah of hosts, who dwelleth in Mount Zion.” (Isaiah 8:18, AS) But nothing much happened except that King Ahaz was removed from his throne.
The name Emmanual, who was born from a 'maiden/young woman', meant 'With us is God' so surely something more significant was to come. In Gods own time, the true significance was revealed in Matthews gospel account

“All this actually came about for that to be fulfilled which was spoken by Jehovah through his prophet, saying, ‘Look! the virgin will become pregnant and will give birth to a son, and they will call his name “Immanuel”,’ which means, when translated, ‘With us is God.’” Matthew 1:22, 23

 

[Blackdog22]

Its to do with Peters deniel of jesus :yes: Jesus took Peter to be re born with him on earth and if it takes a life time Peter will see the light. My brother is peter and he is a fisherman but although he does go out catching fish, fisher of men means something completely different.

Anyway you troll, You had your chance m8 and are very nasty so as I have allready sugested, go do one or al turn the tables m8, now scurry off!!!

Lol, first of all it clearly says that Peter met Jesus in the water. So if its anything its a story about Peters doubt, but that still doesn't address what "walking on water" means to you. If it doesn't mean "walking on water" then what does it mean oh great one?

Anyways, your obviously completely gone so please continue for my amusement.

 

[Rakhel]

its the greek septuagint version of the hebrew scriptures that translates the hebrew word 'al‧mah' as 'virgin'

You likely know that the Septuagint was translated by 70 jewish scholars. So even if the hebrew word 'al‧mah is not now considered to mean virgin, it certainly was back then in the 2nd century bce.

While it may be true that there were 70 Jewish scholars who supplied translations for the Greek, they did not translate Isaiah. They only translated the books of Moses.

And while the prophecy of Isaiah had an initial fulfillment, it is also reasonable to conclude that it would have further fulfillment. Isaiah said “Behold, I and the children whom Jehovah hath given me are for signs and for wonders in Israel from Jehovah of hosts, who dwelleth in Mount Zion.” (Isaiah 8:18, AS) But nothing much happened except that King Ahaz was removed from his throne.
The name Emmanual, who was born from a 'maiden/young woman', meant 'With us is God' so surely something more significant was to come. In Gods own time, the true significance was revealed in Matthews gospel account

Those children you speak of are Isaiah's kids. The young maiden was Isaiah's daughter.
there is no prophesy there. His daughter was pregnant at the time he spoke this verse.

 

[HiddenDjinn]

And while the prophecy of Isaiah had an initial fulfillment, it is also reasonable to conclude that it would have further fulfillment.

Ah, the concept of multiple fulfillment of individual prophecies. That concept never existed in Jewish thought, be it contemporary or ancient. It's primarily used by Polytheistic Idolaters to justify attempts at replacement theology as they attempt to proselytize to us.

Examples of Polytheistic Idolaters: Hindus, Christians, Norse, Greeks, Romans, etc.

 

[Pegg]

While it may be true that there were 70 Jewish scholars who supplied translations for the Greek, they did not translate Isaiah. They only translated the books of Moses.

that being the case, there was a uniformity among the jews of that time then because Genesis 24:43 is translated as virgin in the septuagint.
"here I am stationed at a fountain of water. What must occur is that the maiden
coming out to draw water to whom I shall actually say: “Please, let me drink a little water from your jar,”
The Septuagint translates this hebrew word ha‧‛al‧mah′ as par‧the′nos meaning 'virgin'
So it really was the jews of those centuries who gave the meaning of “virgin” to the Hebrew word ‘al‧mah′ at Isaiah 7:14. The truth is that the word can mean either maiden or virgin or young woman.

 

[HiddenDjinn]

that being the case, there was a uniformity among the jews of that time then because Genesis 24:43 is translated as virgin in the septuagint.
"here I am stationed at a fountain of water. What must occur is that the maiden
coming out to draw water to whom I shall actually say: “Please, let me drink a little water from your jar,”
The Septuagint translates this hebrew word ha‧‛al‧mah′ as par‧the′nos meaning 'virgin'
So it really was the jews of those centuries who gave the meaning of “virgin” to the Hebrew word ‘al‧mah′ at Isaiah 7:14. The truth is that the word can mean either maiden or virgin or young woman.

At the same time, one cannot truly infer that almah referred to a virgin each time. Maybe yes in some cases, maybe no in others. One needs another text to interpret that, as most of the Torah. None of it can be clearly interpreted without another text.

Further, the word is not Almah, but HaAlmah, meaning a specific maiden, which, in the Stone Edition, translates as maiden, not virgin.

 

[HiddenDjinn]

Now for a real idea as to who the Messiah is, I refer you to Isaiah 42:1-8:
1. Behold My servant, I will support him, My chosen one, whom My soul desires; I have placed My spirit upon him, he shall promulgate justice to the nations. א. 2. He shall neither cry nor shall he raise [his voice]; and he shall not make his voice heard outside. ב. 3. A breaking reed he shall not break; and a flickering flaxen wick he shall not quench; with truth shall he execute justice. ג. 4. Neither shall he weaken nor shall he be broken, until he establishes justice in the land, and for his instruction, islands shall long. ד. 5. So said God the Lord, the Creator of the heavens and the One Who stretched them out, Who spread out the earth and what springs forth from it, Who gave a soul to the people upon it and a spirit to those who walk thereon. ה. 6. I am the Lord; I called you with righteousness and I will strengthen your hand; and I formed you, and I made you for a people's covenant, for a light to nations. ו. 7. To open blind eyes, to bring prisoners out of a dungeon, those who sit in darkness out of a prison. ז. 8. I am the Lord, that is My Name; and My glory I will not give to another, nor My praise to the graven images.From the Chabad-Lubavitch in Cyberspace Library
It makes it clear that HaShem isn't going to share the glory with any demi-god of any sort, and implies that the Messiah isn't just one person. It's an entire nation.

 

[smoothcriminal12]

Let's be honest. You haven't fulfilled any of the Messianic prophecies. You're not from the line of David, since you're not Jewish. You have not united the world. You have not brought peace. No weapons of war have been destroyed. People still hate Israel. Do you really, honestly believe that you're the Messiah when you haven't even fulfilled one Messianic prophecy?

 

[Poisonshady313]

that being the case, there was a uniformity among the jews of that time then because Genesis 24:43 is translated as virgin in the septuagint.
"here I am stationed at a fountain of water. What must occur is that the maiden
coming out to draw water to whom I shall actually say: “Please, let me drink a little water from your jar,”
The Septuagint translates this hebrew word ha‧‛al‧mah′ as par‧the′nos meaning 'virgin'
So it really was the jews of those centuries who gave the meaning of “virgin” to the Hebrew word ‘al‧mah′ at Isaiah 7:14. The truth is that the word can mean either maiden or virgin or young woman.

The word "parthenos" was also, in Genesis 34, used to refer to a young woman who was most certainly NOT a virgin. It spoke of Dinah, Jacob's daughter... referring to her as a maiden after she had been raped by Shechem. She was no longer a virgin, yet the word parthenos was used.


Also,
Proverbs 30:18-20
There are three that are beyond me and a fourth that I do not know; the way of an eagle in the heavens; the way of a snake upon a rock; the way of a ship in the heart of the sea; and the way of a man with a young woman. Such is the way of the adulterous woman: She eats and wipes her mouth and says, "I have done no wrong.


The way of a man with a young woman, called "almah"... obviously a young woman, obviously not a virgin.