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The Right to Privacy -- Funny

Evangelicalhumanist

"Truth" isn't a thing...
Premium Member
So, in the recently leaked first draft of SCOTUS' decision likely to overturn Roe v Wade, Chief Justice Roberts has let it be known that it is simply outrageous, unconscionable, unforgivable that the Court's right to privacy has been compromised and will be hunted down and punished.....all over a document that denies that same right to privacy to ordinary folks, who don't happen to hold high office, and don't need to be addressed as "Your Honor."

Gotta love it!
 
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Ponder This

Well-Known Member
So, in the recently leaked first draft of SCOTUS' decision likely to overturn Roe v Wade, Chief Justice Roberts has let it be known that it is simply outrageous, unconscionable, unforgivable that the Court's right to privacy has been compromised and will be hunted down and punished.....all over a document that denies that same right to privacy to ordinary folks, who don't happen to hold high office, and don't need to be addressed as "Your Honor."

Gotta love it!

Are you suggesting that the court's ruling will disallow people from thinking about abortion or forming private opinions about abortion or organizing their thoughts prior to publically announcing them?
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
So, in the recently leaked first draft of SCOTUS' decision likely to overturn Roe v Wade, Chief Justice Roberts has let it be known that it is simply outrageous, unconscionable, unforgivable that the Court's right to privacy has been compromised and will be hunted down and punished.....all over a document that denies that same right to privacy to ordinary folks, who don't happen to hold high office, and don't need to be addressed as "Your Honor."

Gotta love it!

Since I'm into Nixon clips, this is a scene where he goes into a whole rant about leaks. It's a real hoot.

 

Clizby Wampuscat

Well-Known Member
So, in the recently leaked first draft of SCOTUS' decision likely to overturn Roe v Wade, Chief Justice Roberts has let it be known that it is simply outrageous, unconscionable, unforgivable that the Court's right to privacy has been compromised and will be hunted down and punished.....all over a document that denies that same right to privacy to ordinary folks, who don't happen to hold high office, and don't need to be addressed as "Your Honor."

Gotta love it!
you realize this is not what the decision says or means. All it does is give the states the freedom to decide if this right to privacy should extend to abortion. The court is essentially saying it is none of our business. Your beef is not with the Supreme Court but with each state’s legislature that says it does not extend to abortion. This decision if it is real does not take away any right to privacy.

btw, there is no absolute right to privacy. You cannot commit crimes and claim you did it in private.
 

Estro Felino

Believer in free will
Premium Member
I think that since health is a public matter...it is publicly relevant if we find out that in 2019, for the 59% of abortions, women in their 20s (21-29 year old women) were accounted.
This is really worrying.
https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news/slideshows/states-with-the-highest-abortion-rates

It means it does not deal with inevitable circumstances.
It deals with unwanted pregnancies due to very unhealthy lifestyles, which women in their 20s have.
It does not deal with minors. It deals with women who go to college or who already work, and who are not responsible enough to use contraception.

I guess all those movies advertising "friendship eith benefits" and similar, are to blame
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
irony.gif
 

esmith

Veteran Member
I assume that everyone knows that it is against the law to attempt to attempt to influence a judge or justice by picketing, well obviously not.
Of course this would mean that it would have to be enforced and it appears that this administration can't seem to follow the law.
See: 18 U.S.C. § 1507
 

Evangelicalhumanist

"Truth" isn't a thing...
Premium Member
Are you suggesting that the court's ruling will disallow people from thinking about abortion or forming private opinions about abortion or organizing their thoughts prior to publically announcing them?
No, I am suggesting that part of the justification for scrapping Roe is that the Constitution does not guarantee any right to privacy.
 

Clizby Wampuscat

Well-Known Member
No, I am suggesting that part of the justification for scrapping Roe is that the Constitution does not guarantee any right to privacy.
In the document that was leaked it specifically says that this ruling only pertains to the right of privacy as it relates to abortion, not an overall right to privacy.
 

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
So, in the recently leaked first draft of SCOTUS' decision likely to overturn Roe v Wade, Chief Justice Roberts has let it be known that it is simply outrageous, unconscionable, unforgivable that the Court's right to privacy has been compromised and will be hunted down and punished.....all over a document that denies that same right to privacy to ordinary folks, who don't happen to hold high office, and don't need to be addressed as "Your Honor."

Gotta love it!
My thoughts, exactly.
 

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
Do you think it is good for the court or our country to have this leaked? It is not a final decision or opinion. Do you support this leak?
I really couldn't care less. As far as I can tell, it's not a crime.
The implications of the ruling are the most important thing to focus on, imo.
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
you realize this is not what the decision says or means. All it does is give the states the freedom to decide if this right to privacy should extend to abortion.
It does more than that. There are 17 states where abortion will be banned immediately. And another 6 where it will be banned shortly afterwards. The Roe decision is a national application of a right. Why is it good enough for a state but not for a nation? Maybe counties will want to ban abortion. Maybe a town will want to ban abortion. Maybe individuals will claim their own right for an abortion in a red state that has banned it because individual rights is what they deem important over the state.

The court is essentially saying it is none of our business. Your beef is not with the Supreme Court but with each state’s legislature that says it does not extend to abortion. This decision if it is real does not take away any right to privacy.
The beef is with the religious/political extremists in the USA who engineered the presidency to nominate SC nominees as engineered by the far right think tank the Federalists. McConnell joined the conspiracy against citizens by denying Obama a nominee for 11 months. This hypocrisy was extended by McConnell allowing a vote on Barrett just 40 days before an election.

What is our business is why Alito, Kavenaugh, and Gorsuch said in confirmation hearings and private interviews with senators that Roe was settled law and they wouldn't challenge it. Yet now they are on record voting to overturn the decision. This was all engineered fraud and corruption.

Whoever leaked the draft it is a direct reason over the abortion issue, whether for or against it. Be ware that republicans are on the record saying they are for banning abortion nationwide, and even banning contraception. This is all motivated by religious claims to morality, not political service to citizens. This means Christian extremists are imposing their demands onto any woman in the USA.

btw, there is no absolute right to privacy. You cannot commit crimes and claim you did it in private.
That is not what the right to privacy means in the context of abortion rights. If you break laws there is no right to privacy since there are victims. You can refuse to incriminate yourself, however.[/quote][/quote]
 
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Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
No, I am suggesting that part of the justification for scrapping Roe is that the Constitution does not guarantee any right to privacy.
It's reasonable to see abortion rights as not based
in the right to privacy. It's also reasonable for SCOTUS
to want their rough drafts kept secret.
The problem here isn't even remotely any hypocrisy.
It's these fundies who don't value bodily autonomy
as much as I say they should.
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
I assume that everyone knows that it is against the law to attempt to attempt to influence a judge or justice by picketing, well obviously not.
Of course this would mean that it would have to be enforced and it appears that this administration can't seem to follow the law.
See: 18 U.S.C. § 1507
Prove a protest is trying to influence a judge. Protesting the RESULTS of what judges did, or are doing, is a constitutional right. Heck, even the Jan 6 insurrectionists were allowed to protest a valid election result. They just took it too far into criminal activity.

There is some speculation that the leaker could be Jeeanie Thomas, Clarence Thomas' wife. The reason she would have done this is because of one or more of the initial supporters of overturning Roe might have changed their mind. The release of the draft would lock in all 5 conservatives who voted to overturn. This WOULD be influence, and Jeanie Thomas, off the leaker, could face criminal charges of the law you cite.
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
No, I am suggesting that part of the justification for scrapping Roe is that the Constitution does not guarantee any right to privacy.
I would think the right would protect privacy rights since they are hostile to the broad authority of the state, including law enforcement.

As I have seen reported by legal analysts the right to privacy provision covers many other SC decisions, namely gay marriage rights. It calls into question the legal philosophy of originalists in a world and society that is evolving. There are amendments for a reason and this was a suitable solution for marginalized groups before the current state of political division, mostly caused by the religious right. The political right will refuse to cooperate with the political left out of the bad faith competitive nature that has evolved since Gingrich's leadership.

Alito seems dead set to reverse broad liberties that the religious right hates. He is using his position to make that happens for all of America. He has SC justices cooperating with him, as they were selected for this engineered Supreme Court for this set of activism.

What we don't know is how much damage this decision can cause, like falling dominoes in a nation that is not united and not functioning with a similar set of moral and social priorities.
 

Clizby Wampuscat

Well-Known Member
It does more than that. There are 17 states where abortion will be banned immediately. And another 6 where it will be banned shortly afterwards. The Roe decision is a national application of a right. Why is it good enough for a state but not for a nation? Maybe counties will want to ban abortion. Maybe a town will want to ban abortion. Maybe individuals will claim their own right for an abortion in a red state that has banned it because individual rights is what they deem important over the state.
It lets each state decide. This is the correct interpretation of the constitution. There is no right to an abortion in the constitution so it is left up to the states. The court is not at all banning abortions in the US. If this decision becomes official, abortion will still be legal in the US, just not everywhere. Just like marijuana.


The beef is with the religious/political extremists in the USA who engineered the presidency to nominate SC nominees as engineered by the far right think tank the Federalists. McConnell joined the conspiracy against citizens by denying Obama a nominee for 11 months. This hypocrisy was extended by McConnell allowing a vote on Barrett just 40 days before an election.
No laws were broken. The dems would have done the same thing if they could have.

What is our business is why Alito, Kavenaugh, and Gorsuch said in confirmation hearings and private interviews with senators that Roe was settled law and they wouldn't challenge it. Yet now they are on record voting to overturn the decision. This was all engineered fraud and corruption.
Claims that need to be proven. read this:

What Gorsuch, Kavanaugh and Barrett Said About Roe at Confirmation Hearings - FactCheck.org

Where did they claim they would never revisit the case? They said it was precedent and never said they would not hear a case or reconsider the outcome. Plessy v Ferguson was settled law for over 50 years. Should the separate but equal doctrine not have been revisited and overturned? Precedent does not mean can a case can never be overturned with better law.

Whoever leaked the draft it is a direct reason over the abortion issue, whether for or against it. Be ware that republicans are on the record saying they are for banning abortion nationwide, and even banning contraception. This is all motivated by religious claims to morality, not political service to citizens. This means Christian extremists are imposing their demands onto any woman in the USA.
I am for a nationwide abortion ban but not contraception ban. I am not religious. Do you really think abortions will be illegal in California or New York, Chicago, Minneapolis etc. I do not think it is extreme to protect a right to life, I do think it is extreme to fight for the right to end a potential life. If they impose anything it is through the democratic process. People vote for them, take it up with the people that vote for them.

That is not what the right to privacy means in the context of abortion rights. If you break laws there is no right to privacy since there are victims. You can refuse to incriminate yourself, however.
Here is the issue. I think there is a victim in abortion, you don't.
 

Clizby Wampuscat

Well-Known Member
I really couldn't care less. As far as I can tell, it's not a crime.
The implications of the ruling are the most important thing to focus on, imo.
I disagree. If all draft decisions or communication between justices are made public they can be harassed and intimidated as we are seeing and the court is compromised. It may not be a crime to leak the information, it is a crime to intimidate judges. Do you support the protests at the justices homes?
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
It lets each state decide. This is the correct interpretation of the constitution. There is no right to an abortion in the constitution so it is left up to the states. The court is not at all banning abortions in the US. If this decision becomes official, abortion will still be legal in the US, just not everywhere. Just like marijuana.
Why is it best for one state to allow abortion and pot, but a neighboring state to ban them?


No laws were broken. The dems would have done the same thing if they could have.
Do you have evidence?

Claims that need to be proven. read this:

What Gorsuch, Kavanaugh and Barrett Said About Roe at Confirmation Hearings - FactCheck.org

Where did they claim they would never revisit the case? They said it was precedent and never said they would not hear a case or reconsider the outcome. Plessy v Ferguson was settled law for over 50 years. Should the separate but equal doctrine not have been revisited and overturned? Precedent does not mean can a case can never be overturned with better law.
I watched much of the Kav and Barrett hearings, and was not impressed by the many deflections. My concern is what Collins and Murkowski have stated, that both feel lied to and decided in their discussions with these nominees. We all knew why trump's three nominees were picked, and that fruit is bearing out as evidenced by the leaked opinion.

I am for a nationwide abortion ban but not contraception ban. I am not religious.
But you are following a religious moral argument. This argument causes many practical problems that anti-abortion people ignore.

Do you really think abortions will be illegal in California or New York, Chicago, Minneapolis etc. I do not think it is extreme to protect a right to life, I do think it is extreme to fight for the right to end a potential life. If they impose anything it is through the democratic process. People vote for them, take it up with the people that vote for them.
Many states are seeing an uptick on abortion services, and they are struggling to manage the clients, denying many of them due to the demand. Plus since these citizens have services available elsewhere why force them to travel? Many poor can;'t afford it, nor can they afford more children. How is that practical or moral? Why don't you advocates offer solutions to these hardships? Could it be you have no solutions and will choose to ignore these problems until it becomes a threat to life and the wellbeing of the babies that were forced to be born? Where is your morality now?

This illustrates why moral absolutes fail. Until you anti-abortion advocates can explain how to take care of the influx of unwanted children you don't have a moral solution, you're just trading one moral dilemma for another. And your chosen moral dilemma is a religious one that you have adopted as an atheist. That's an intellectual dilemma to confound your moral dilemma. Now you just need to figure out what to do with unwanted children, and where the money will come from. Do that and then your morality can be resolved. If you can't, you're stuck with a religious moral position that will cause more harm.

Here is the issue. I think there is a victim in abortion, you don't.
And that belief on your part is religious. You just don't seem aware of how you picked this belief up.

Let me ask you this, do you think it immoral to abort pregnant feral cats? If not, why not? What makes humans a special species in your view?
 
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