The "Self"

[1137]

I was asked while guest speaking today what I think about "I". Does it exist? Can we lose the concept being part of western culture? Should we? What do I think of Decartes' "I think therefore I am"?

I do believe in the Self, that I am an individual who's connected to the external universe but also unique in it. I was asked where the Self is, which is a solid question. One person there - a friend of mine - talked about an individual he knows who refers to himself as " we", meaning all the atoms, cells, limbs, etc that make him. The fact that this is what creates "us" creates a difficult problem for a person who is far more physicalist than spiritualist. My answer was that the "Self" is a nonphysical, soul-like "entity" that is created by the physical, but in a way is separate. It cannot survive death because once the phsycial body stops functioning in the way that creates "us", the self dies with it.

What is your position on the Self? Does it exist at all? If so, how do you address the unlikely hood of the soul's existence? Or how do you address our ever changing physical form? If not, what creates the illusion of Self? Can we eliminate it? Is it even bad?

 

[Sunstone]

The self imagines itself in control of itself. However, experiments in neuroscience have shown that people decide to act before they become aware of having decided to act. In other words, the hand reaches for the apple before the self is aware of having decided to reach for the apple. Basically, the self is just a commentator on events, a commentator that takes all the credit for events it does not actually cause.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I believe in an eternal soul/consciousness/spirit/essence. That's the True Self, to me.

 

[1137]

The self imagines itself in control of itself. However, experiments in neuroscience have shown that people decide to act before they become aware of having decided to act. In other words, the hand reaches for the apple before the self is aware of having decided to reach for the apple. Basically, the self is just a commentator on events, a commentator that takes all the credit for events it does not actually cause.

Unless the self can include the sub/unconscious.

 

[1137]

I believe in an eternal soul/consciousness/spirit/essence. That's the True Self, to me.

Descriptive, thank you! Haha

 

[Quintessence]

I understand that "self/individual" does not exist without "other/environment," and is inexorably part of the Weave.

 

[Willamena]

"Self" is a thought, the result of concretizing (making a permanence of) the faculty of consciousness.

 

[1137]

I understand that "self/individual" does not exist without "other/environment," and is inexorably part of the Weave.

But does that mean the Self doesn't exists or simply that it isn't isolated?

 

[Quintessence]

But does that mean the Self doesn't exists or simply that it isn't isolated?

I'm having some difficulty coming up with the verbiage I'm looking for here.

I think I will say that I see all of reality as the Weave - a grand interconnected tapestry of individuals/selves. The threads (individuals/selves) most certainly exist, and the threads are never isolated. There's a bit more to it than that, but the metaphor starts to fall apart a tad when we move too far beyond this here.

 

[Iti oj]

Unless the self can include the sub/unconscious.

I think it does.

 

[Penumbra]

I have consciousness. I'm aware of my senses, but am not aware of nonlocal information, unless somehow brought to my senses. The consciousness feels continuous, probably due to memories. I don't know the details of how it works, nor does anyone seem to. I know certain limitations about it, like how it can be altered or shut off, what physical things apparently need to exist for it to exist, and how people that were once conscious can die and apparently no longer be conscious in any recognizable or communicative form.

I've seen other people claim that they're one with the universe and all that, that their self is the universe or that they are selfless, but they've not demonstrated any nonlocal information to me, so from what I can tell, their consciousness is also limited to their body and their senses.

 

[Sunstone]

Unless the self can include the sub/unconscious.

I suppose that would depend on a number of things.

 

[1137]

I suppose that would depend on a number of things.

May I have some examples?

 

[1137]

I'm having some difficulty coming up with the verbiage I'm looking for here.

I think I will say that I see all of reality as the Weave - a grand interconnected tapestry of individuals/selves. The threads (individuals/selves) most certainly exist, and the threads are never isolated. There's a bit more to it than that, but the metaphor starts to fall apart a tad when we move too far beyond this here.

It's good enough I believe I see (and agree with) your point. Thank you for sharing.

 

[Sunstone]

May I have some examples?

Well, for instance, the MRI scans that showed that areas of the brain not associated with consciousness were responsible for decision-making might have also shown that those areas were not associated with sub-consciousness. Again, it would be depend on what you meant by "sub-consciousness". And so forth.

 

[1137]

Well, for instance, the MRI scans that showed that areas of the brain not associated with consciousness were responsible for decision-making might have also shown that those areas were not associated with sub-consciousness. Again, it would be depend on what you meant by "sub-consciousness". And so forth.

Ah, I see where you are coming from. Thank you for sharing.

 

[roger1440]

I was asked while guest speaking today what I think about "I". Does it exist? Can we lose the concept being part of western culture? Should we? What do I think of Decartes' "I think therefore I am"?

I do believe in the Self, that I am an individual who's connected to the external universe but also unique in it. I was asked where the Self is, which is a solid question. One person there - a friend of mine - talked about an individual he knows who refers to himself as " we", meaning all the atoms, cells, limbs, etc that make him. The fact that this is what creates "us" creates a difficult problem for a person who is far more physicalist than spiritualist. My answer was that the "Self" is a nonphysical, soul-like "entity" that is created by the physical, but in a way is separate. It cannot survive death because once the phsycial body stops functioning in the way that creates "us", the self dies with it.

What is your position on the Self? Does it exist at all? If so, how do you address the unlikely hood of the soul's existence? Or how do you address our ever changing physical form? If not, what creates the illusion of Self? Can we eliminate it? Is it even bad?

What we refer to as “I” or “self” is no more than a focal point or a central point of attention. Remove the focal point and one experiences all at the same time. The so called “self” creates division. The word “individual” comes from the root “divide”. Divide means to separate. Look at a picture of a crowd. When you stand back and look at the picture as a whole you see a group of people. When you focus your attention on one person you see a single person with the remaining people wrapped around the individual person. Now we have division or separation.

I find it interesting our English word religion literality means to “reunite” or “rejoin”. The word yoga means “union” or “to yoke”.

 

[1137]

What we refer to as “I” or “self” is no more than a focal point or a central point of attention. Remove the focal point and one experiences all at the same time. The so called “self” creates division. The word “individual” comes from the root “divide”. Divide means to separate. Look at a picture of a crowd. When you stand back and look at the picture as a whole you see a group of people. When you focus your attention on one person you see a single person with the remaining people wrapped around the individual person. Now we have division or separation.

I find it interesting our English word religion literality means to “reunite” or “rejoin”. The word yoga means “union” or “to yoke”.

Thank you for sharing.

 

[Tumah]

For now, I think the self begins at the stage of the primal will. The degree of drive that I have to acquire in proportion to my drive to do good and the degree of that need etc. among all the other drives, is different from person to person.

I think that is where one person separates from the next.

 

[Prophet]

I was asked while guest speaking today what I think about "I". Does it exist? Can we lose the concept being part of western culture? Should we? What do I think of Decartes' "I think therefore I am"?

"I think therefore I am" is close. "I am aware therefore I am" is closer. "I am" might be perfect. Which is applicable is dependent upon how close to perfect your version of "I" is. See yourself reflected in every pair of eyes and the concept of "I" does the opposite of what it did before, making you bigger than yourself, connecting you in perfect empathy instead of imprisoning you in your body and separating you from from others.