The space was smoke

[Subduction Zone]

Won't happen. These very Quran science miracles are repeated over and over by the same users. One will be posted. Objections and criticism to the claim will be ignored. The thread will die. A few months later the same subject in the a new thread will pop up by the same users as if nothing happened.

Christians do the same. And far too often both put those who correct them on ignore.

 

[ecco]

Parts of it look like smoke, a lot of it doesn't.

41:11 doesn't say anything about "looks like smoke". It specifically says "while it was smoke". It was never smoke.

That is the word available before 1500 years ago "smoke", if I said to you liquid, do I mean water?

It still wasn't smoke.

But I see gnostic has already covered that with you. I'll bow out.

 

[ChristineM]

Christians do the same. And far too often both put those who correct them on ignore.

If these people refuse education in the name of god magic they are welcome to their ignorance.

 

[FearGod]

Researchers mentioning the exact word "smoke" for new image.

Light from darkness: Brilliant stars emerging from dusty stellar nursery

An evocative new image from the European Southern Observatory shows a dark cloud where new stars are forming, along with a cluster of brilliant stars that have already emerged from their dusty stellar nursery.

On the left of this new image there is a dark column resembling a cloud of smoke. To the right shines a small group of brilliant stars. At first glance these two features could not be more different, but they are in fact closely linked. The cloud contains huge amounts of cool cosmic dust and is a nursery where new stars are being born. It is likely that the Sun formed in a similar star formation region more than four billion years ago.

Light from darkness: Brilliant stars emerging from dusty stellar nursery

 

[gnostic]

We understand that heavier elements were due to the explosion of a star, that means the solar
nebula contains some heavier elements from a dead star, agree

Yes.

Nebula are cloud of gases (hydrogen and helium, mostly, but also trace amount of oxygen and carbon, but no smoke) and larger debris.

But again, no smoke. You still can not comprehend not all cloud of gases are not smoke. And you still refused to learn that smoke mostly exist as carbon monoxide, a gas that don’t exist naturally in space.

There are no “smoke” in space!​

 

[gnostic]

Won't happen. These very Quran science miracles are repeated over and over by the same users. One will be posted. Objections and criticism to the claim will be ignored. The thread will die. A few months later the same subject in the a new thread will pop up by the same users as if nothing happened.

Also keep in mind how these ideas form a key part of their faith. Abandoning the miracle claims as wrong would undermine their faith in Islam. After all it changes what appears to be scientific facts into guesses that are wrong. So either God is wrong thus not God or the Quran is a patchwork of guesses no better than you guessing about something.

This is why Muslims have made no scientific discoveries in the last 6 or 7 centuries.

Instead of continuing to make progress in science and technology during and after the Late Middle Ages and the Renaissance, they had let wars consume them, and by the 19th century, you have Muslim philosophers hardening of the good old days, 7th century.

And it gotten worse in the 20th century. By the last few decades, instead of learning from today’s science and technology, some of these Muslims are quoting the passages from Qur’an for these so-called scientific miracles, in which they their own scriptures out-of-context, by twisting the words to mean something else.

YouTube Muslim televangelist Zakir Naik has become the leading role model for backward Muslims. Thankfully, not all Muslims considered Naik as champion of science.

Naik’s Islamic Research Foundation has become like the pseudoscience Discovery Institute that advocate Intelligent Design.

 

[Mohsen]

Researchers mentioning the exact word "smoke" for new image.

Light from darkness: Brilliant stars emerging from dusty stellar nursery

An evocative new image from the European Southern Observatory shows a dark cloud where new stars are forming, along with a cluster of brilliant stars that have already emerged from their dusty stellar nursery.

On the left of this new image there is a dark column resembling a cloud of smoke. To the right shines a small group of brilliant stars. At first glance these two features could not be more different, but they are in fact closely linked. The cloud contains huge amounts of cool cosmic dust and is a nursery where new stars are being born. It is likely that the Sun formed in a similar star formation region more than four billion years ago.

Light from darkness: Brilliant stars emerging from dusty stellar nursery

Very good post! It’s a shame atheists lack the ability to reason “usage of terms” from ancient sources! smoke is accurately describing the fogginess of the elements which made up the composition of what existed as gaseous matter before the cause behind the Big Bang expanded it! And made it form into what we now know as the universe!!! The gaseous matter itself was not categorised into a periodic table in those ancient times for the ancient ones to surmise these were elements and so, the usage of the term/word “smoke” is befitting in “description”.

Thank you for sharing such a wonderful article!

 

[gnostic]

Very good post! It’s a shame atheists lack the ability to reason “usage of terms” from ancient sources! smoke is accurately describing the fogginess of the elements which made up the composition of what existed as gaseous matter before the cause behind the Big Bang expanded it!

Another person who don’t understand what “smoke” is.

Smoke is a very specific type of gas, mainly due to BURNING of carbon-based material and one of the essential ingredients for combustion (burning) - oxygen.

Smoke has a chemical compounds of carbon monoxide and hydrogen cyanide. These compounds don’t naturally exist in space.

There are no carbon monoxide in space, hence there is no smoke in space!​

And in space there are not much of carbon or of oxygen.

The most abundant element in the universe is hydrogen; helium being the second most abundant element.

It is what stars are mostly made of.

Our sun is a 3rd or 4th generations stars, made from previous dead stars. Hence, it is a classified as a Population I star, meaning it has some heavier elements (metallicity) in the core of the star, elements heavier than helium.

Population III have no elements heavier than helium, hence no metallicity. These are the first generation of stars to exist in the universe’s timeline. As far as I can tell, Population III stars don’t exist, unless they have become ancient white dwarf stars.

Most white dwarf stars are Population II or Population I stars.

But back to my point about the sun.

The sun still currently have 74.9% of hydrogen and 23.8% of helium. This leave only 1.7% mass of heavier elements (about 1% of oxygen, carbon 0.3%, and iron 0.2%.

If you understand Stellar Nucleosynthesis, you would know that when the sun’s core is hot enough, it will convert and fuse hydrogen nuclei into a single helium; it require fusion of 6 hydrogen protons to convert into a helium atom with 2 protons and 2 neutrons.

To understand what I mean by Stellar Nucleosynthesis, look at how proton-to-proton fusion, to create new helium atom:

(Image source: proton-proton chain reaction, Wikipedia)

Illustration shows a simplest process of stellar nucleosynthesis, to convert hydrogen nuclei into a single helium nuclei.

But in order for the sun to produce more new carbon or oxygen atoms, the sun has to run out of hydrogen atoms to fuse, and start fusing helium nuclei into oxygen or carbon nuclei. And when the sun start to fuse helium, the sun will become larger in size and hotter, swallowing the planet Mercury in the process, turning yellow dwarf star into a red giant star, and when that start to happen, you will know the sun will begin to die.

That’s the only way for the sun to make more carbon and oxygen.

Our sun won’t turn into a red giant in another 4 (or even 5) billion years from now.

Any way, FearGod is wrong about the smoke in space. There are no smoke in space.

Do google or wiki on “smoke”, and you will see that smoke is a chemical compound of carbon monoxide.

 

[FearGod]

Yes.

Nebula are cloud of gases (hydrogen and helium, mostly, but also trace amount of oxygen and carbon, but no smoke) and larger debris.

But again, no smoke. You still can not comprehend not all cloud of gases are not smoke. And you still refused to learn that smoke mostly exist as carbon monoxide, a gas that don’t exist naturally in space.

There are no “smoke” in space!​

YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY WRONG

You can't really comprehend that there are different types of smokes depending on material
and it may contain several gases and chemicals.

Smoke is a collection of tiny solid, liquid and gas particles. Although smoke can contain hundreds of different chemicals and fumes, visible smoke is mostly carbon (soot), tar, oils and ash.
What is smoke?

Where there's smoke, there's fire -- even in outer space. A new infrared image from NASA's Spitzer Space Telescope shows a burning hot galaxy whose fiery stars appear to be blowing out giant billows of smoky dust.

The galaxy, called Messier 82, or the "Cigar galaxy," was previously known to host a hotbed of young, massive stars. The new Spitzer image reveals, for the first time, the "smoke" surrounding those stellar fires.
Galaxy on Fire! NASA's Spitzer Reveals Stellar Smoke - NASA Spitzer Space Telescope

I think that you should teach the Nasa scientists that smoke doesn't exist in outer space

 

[FearGod]

This is why Muslims have made no scientific discoveries in the last 6 or 7 centuries.

Instead of continuing to make progress in science and technology during and after the Late Middle Ages and the Renaissance, they had let wars consume them, and by the 19th century, you have Muslim philosophers hardening of the good old days, 7th century.

And it gotten worse in the 20th century. By the last few decades, instead of learning from today’s science and technology, some of these Muslims are quoting the passages from Qur’an for these so-called scientific miracles, in which they their own scriptures out-of-context, by twisting the words to mean something else.

YouTube Muslim televangelist Zakir Naik has become the leading role model for backward Muslims. Thankfully, not all Muslims considered Naik as champion of science.

Naik’s Islamic Research Foundation has become like the pseudoscience Discovery Institute that advocate Intelligent Design.

There's no relation between investigating the quran and science progress.

We have the quran from the 7th century and we have to investigate it to find if it contains any error.

I find that describing how the atmosphere looks like at the time of creating the earth to be amazing.

For those who decided that God doesn't exist won't actually have any interest to investigate the truth
and I believe those are the losers and will just live their short life on earth similar to any animal.

 

[Mohsen]

Another person who don’t understand what “smoke” is.

.​

You’re wrong. Again.

I already explained. The scientists themselvss have referred to it as “like smoke” so there you go!

You don’t have to accept it but don’t go taking the “holier than thou” attitude over the experts in science who claim it was “like smoke”. They left us their real names while you are anonymous here! Argument from authority is something which you should respect, especially when your argument from anonymity is hardly worth consideration ​

 

[ChristineM]

Very good post! It’s a shame atheists lack the ability to reason “usage of terms” from ancient sources! smoke is accurately describing the fogginess of the elements which made up the composition of what existed as gaseous matter before the cause behind the Big Bang expanded it! And made it form into what we now know as the universe!!! The gaseous matter itself was not categorised into a periodic table in those ancient times for the ancient ones to surmise these were elements and so, the usage of the term/word “smoke” is befitting in “description”.

Thank you for sharing such a wonderful article!

Are you saying you know what was before the bb? Wow, you should publish and become a famous cosmologist.

Ancient times? Like over 13,700,000,000 years before people? Wow.

 

[ChristineM]

This thread is crazy, to think that people actually believe this nonsense is beyond belief.

There appears to be a total and deliberate lack of comprehension regarding conditions in the early universe, composition of suns and their production of elements, the stages of accretion of galaxies and solar systems and the passage of time.

Some don't understand so call it smoke like because it says so in an ancient book.

 

[FearGod]

SCIENTISTS SAY

On the left of this new image there is a dark column resembling a cloud of smoke. To the right shines a small group of brilliant stars. At first glance these two features could not be more different, but they are in fact closely linked. The cloud contains huge amounts of cool cosmic dust and is a nursery where new stars are being born. It is likely that the Sun formed in a similar star formation region more than four billion years ago.

Light from darkness: Brilliant stars emerging from dusty stellar nursery

 

[exchemist]

SCIENTISTS SAY

On the left of this new image there is a dark column resembling a cloud of smoke. To the right shines a small group of brilliant stars. At first glance these two features could not be more different, but they are in fact closely linked. The cloud contains huge amounts of cool cosmic dust and is a nursery where new stars are being born. It is likely that the Sun formed in a similar star formation region more than four billion years ago.

Light from darkness: Brilliant stars emerging from dusty stellar nursery

Well, I am delighted that you have now settled, apparently, on what interpretation to place on the Quran verse mentioning smoke.

You claim it refers to the coalescence of our solar system, including the Earth, from gas and dust, right? I can live with that interpretation.

I take it therefore that we are now all agreed that this Quran verse says nothing about the origin of the universe, for the reasons we have gone through on this thread. Correct?

I presume Mohsen is also in accord with this.

 

[gnostic]

I already explained. The scientists themselvss have referred to it as “like smoke” so there you go!

And you don't understand English.

The word "like" are not "is" or "was".

If I say you "run fast like a cheetah", does that mean you are a "cheetah" or that you can run as fast a cheetah?

The answer would be "no" to both.

"Like" is a comparison of two or more different things, but it doesn't mean they are the same things.

Saying it "look like smoke" doesn't mean is actually smoke. You really do need to go back to school, and learn English.

 

[FearGod]

Well, I am delighted that you have now settled, apparently, on what interpretation to place on the Quran verse mentioning smoke.

You claim it refers to the coalescence of our solar system, including the Earth, from gas and dust, right? I can live with that interpretation.

I take therefore that we are now all agreed that this Quran verse says nothing about the origin of the universe, for the reasons we have gone through on this thread. Correct?

I presume Mohsen is also in accord with this.

Forget about me and Mohsen you losers and see what the verse itself says

Then He directed Himself to the heaven while it was smoke and said to it and to the earth, "Come [into being], willingly or by compulsion." They said, "We have come willingly."(41:11)

Do you understand from the verse that it speaks about the origin of the universe while earth was already created?

 

[FearGod]

And you don't understand English.

The word "like" are not "is" or "was".

If I say you "run fast like a cheetah", does that mean you are a "cheetah" or that you can run as fast a cheetah?

The answer would be "no" to both.

"Like" is a comparison of two or more different things, but it doesn't mean they are the same things.

Saying it "look like smoke" doesn't mean is actually smoke. You really do need to go back to school, and learn English.

And the scientists said it was a cloud of smoke, should we believe you or them,
How many times should I repeat it so you losers can understand.

SCIENTISTS SAY

On the left of this new image there is a dark column resembling a cloud of smoke. To the right shines a small group of brilliant stars. At first glance these two features could not be more different, but they are in fact closely linked. The cloud contains huge amounts of cool cosmic dust and is a nursery where new stars are being born. It is likely that the Sun formed in a similar star formation region more than four billion years ago.

Light from darkness: Brilliant stars emerging from dusty stellar nursery

 

[Godobeyer]

What facts would these be, please? How does the image of smoke tell us anything useful about the presumed origin of the cosmos?

What we think (and it remains a rather speculative model) is that at the start there was radiation that progressively

What facts would these be, please? How does the image of smoke tell us anything useful about the presumed origin of the cosmos?

What we think (and it remains a rather speculative model) is that at the start there was radiation that progressively condensed into a plasma of sub-atomic particles and radiation, which had expanded and cooled enough for matter and radiation to separate, so that space could be become transparent to radiation, about 380,000yrs after the start. According to this model there was no "gas" until this point. Plasma is not gas.

The image of "smoke" does not suggest to me anything about radiation, or expansion, or condensation. Or gas, for that matter. So not very helpful at all, in terms of scientific facts or theories.

I think we would all do far better to treat the Bible and the Quran as literary works containing messages for humanity that may be divinely inspired, and not as science textbooks. That was never their purpose. Trying to force them into that role is bound to show up their serious shortcomings at fulfilling it.

I was talking about Arabic linguistic,word gas was not used in that era/age.

smoke is probably closer to meaning because some gases has no color.and galazies looks like smokes in universe.

 

[exchemist]

Forget about me and Mohsen you losers and see what the verse itself says

Then He directed Himself to the heaven while it was smoke and said to it and to the earth, "Come [into being], willingly or by compulsion." They said, "We have come willingly."(41:11)

Do you understand from the verse that it speaks about the origin of the universe while earth was already created?

I am simply trying to get some confirmation from you about what you are claiming this verse represents.

I have no idea whatsoever what it could mean, quite frankly. Its meaning in translation seems vague and self-contradictory, to the point of being meaningless, at least to the uninitiated like me. But I am not a Quran scholar. That's why I want to get clear what you think.