The world was made from, by, through and for Jesus. In what sense is it for?

[whirlingmerc]

Is your Jesus big enough for a universe to be made for Him?

Colossians 1:16
For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

It is made for us -> Psalms 115:16; Matthew 5:5; Proverbs 2:21-22

 

[whirlingmerc]

there can be overarching purposes and subordinate dependent purposes... being made for us can be a dependent urpose

 

[BilliardsBall]

Is your Jesus big enough for a universe to be made for Him?

Colossians 1:16
For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him.

Are you asking a question in this thread?

 

[atpollard]

Is your Jesus big enough for a universe to be made for Him?

Yes. (That was easy.)

 

[pearl]

Is your Jesus big enough for a universe to be made for Him?

Colossians 1:16
For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him.

This is very similar to an alternate view of the Incarnation presented by John Duns Scotus who argued, for example, that God's supreme work, the Incarnation, had to be first and foremost in God's mind. It could not be dependent on or occasioned by any action of humans, especially sin. He emphasized divine love. God is love and created all life in order to communicate to creatures the fullness of divine love. The Incarnate Word is the foundation of the creative plan of God, the very reason for the existence of all creation.
There is a German Bishop who got himself in a bit of hot water for expressing much the same, that Jesus was not a scapegoat for our sins.

 

[Acim]

Is your Jesus big enough for a universe to be made for Him?

Colossians 1:16
For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him.

Nowhere in the paragraph this passage comes from, is Jesus mentioned.

So, I understand the inquiry as: is (my) Christ big enough for a universe to be made for him?
My answer: surely this is so

 

[VitoOFMCap]

This is very similar to an alternate view of the Incarnation presented by John Duns Scotus who argued, for example, that God's supreme work, the Incarnation, had to be first and foremost in God's mind. It could not be dependent on or occasioned by any action of humans, especially sin. He emphasized divine love. God is love and created all life in order to communicate to creatures the fullness of divine love. The Incarnate Word is the foundation of the creative plan of God, the very reason for the existence of all creation.
There is a German Bishop who got himself in a bit of hot water for expressing much the same, that Jesus was not a scapegoat for our sins.

Rupert of Duetz, who was a contemporary of Anselm. The Christological perspective is that the Incarnation is not contingent on humanity's sin. His argument: if sin caused the Incarnation, then either A. God willed sin, or B. the Incarnation was sort of a "Plan B," because God's first attempt at creation did not allow for humanity to live in union with God.

This is all fun, heady theology stuff. Glad to know someone else has looked into it! =)

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Rupert of Duetz, who was a contemporary of Anselm. The Christological perspective is that the Incarnation is not contingent on humanity's sin. His argument: if sin caused the Incarnation, then either A. God willed sin, or B. the Incarnation was sort of a "Plan B," because God's first attempt at creation did not allow for humanity to live in union with God.

To me, there was No incarnation because God simply transferred the pre-human heavenly life of Jesus to Mary.
Thus, Joseph was foster father. God then resurrected Jesus back to his original pre-human spirit body.

God's first attempt, so to speak, was that there is No other attempt.
ALL of us are descendants from Adam and Eve - Genesis 1:28
God's purpose, God's will, is that we call descend from Adam and Eve and we do.
So, going as far back to faithful Abel, mankind in general will be able to gain 'everlasting life on a beautiful paradisical Earth' as originally offer to Adam before his chosen downfall. That physically healthy ' living forever on Earth ' will start with calendar Day One of Jesus' coming 1,000-year governmental rulership over Earth begins when the humble meek will inherit the Earth - Matthew 5:5; Psalms 37:10-11

 

[pearl]

This is all fun, heady theology stuff. Glad to know someone else has looked into it! =)

Also very interesting is following the Christology of the evangelists through the Gospels as they, with post resurrection faith, come to understand who Jesus was in relation to God. The first gospel written, that of Mark, Jesus is God's son at his baptism, in MT and Luke He is God's son at birth, while in John, Jesus is pre existent.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Also very interesting is following the Christology of the evangelists through the Gospels as they, with post resurrection faith, come to understand who Jesus was in relation to God. The first gospel written, that of Mark, Jesus is God's son at his baptism, in MT and Luke He is God's son at birth, while in John, Jesus is pre existent.

Yes, I agree, Jesus is God's Son at 'baptism' according to Mark 1:11,
and also God's Son at 'baptism' at Matthew 3:16,
and God's Son at 'baptism' at Luke 3:21-22.
So, at Jesus' baptism the heavens were opened ( Jesus then knew what he needed to know about his pre-human heavenly existence before God sent Jesus to Earth.)
God sent the pre-existent heavenly Jesus ( transferred his heavenly life ) to Mary to be God's Son on Earth.
So, Jesus was pre-existent in the heavens before God sent His Son Jesus to Earth to be born as a sinless human.

 

[pearl]

In the Gospels there can be discerned two types of Christology, an 'ascending' Christology, from below, in Mk, Mt and Lk, a 'descending Christology, from above, in Jn. The synoptic gospels begin from Jesus human life, Jn begins from Jesus as God. Mt and Lk push the recognition of Jesus as God's son back before baptism, to his birth.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

In the Gospels there can be discerned two types of Christology, an 'ascending' Christology, from below, in Mk, Mt and Lk, a 'descending Christology, from above, in Jn. The synoptic gospels begin from Jesus human life, Jn begins from Jesus as God. Mt and Lk push the recognition of Jesus as God's son back before baptism, to his birth.

In the first chapter of John, there John writes at John 1:18 that No man has seen God at any time......
People saw Jesus. So, if No man has seen God at any time, but people did see Jesus, then Jesus, according to John 1:18, is Not God. - John 6:46; 1 John 4:12 ( Exodus 33:20 )

 

[pearl]

I assume it means that Jesus is God incarnate. I don't think it has to do with physical sight as much as to know, to understand. Much like the miracle of the 'man born blind', there was something greater than physical sight, the miracle was but a 'sign', he then understood who Jesus was. Concerning the quote from EX, the Gospels declare that Jesus greater than Moses, God incarnate.
It all reflects the struggle of the early church, that began with the events of Pentecost, to answer the why of Jesus.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I assume it means that Jesus is God incarnate. I don't think it has to do with physical sight as much as to know, to understand. Much like the miracle of the 'man born blind', there was something greater than physical sight, the miracle was but a 'sign', he then understood who Jesus was. Concerning the quote from EX, the Gospels declare that Jesus greater than Moses, God incarnate.
It all reflects the struggle of the early church, that began with the events of Pentecost, to answer the why of Jesus.

To me, how can Jesus be God incarnate when God created the pre-human Jesus according to Revelation 3:14; 1:5.
God is Un-created according to Psalms 90:2 , whereas created Jesus ( Colossians 1:15 ) is created by God as the beginning of the creation by God. So, only God was before the beginning. Pre-human heavenly Jesus was Not before the beginning as God was before the beginning.