There is no Truth, and if there was you don't have it.

[Repox]

None of you have the truth and you never will. The truth of the truth is that it doesn't exist, sorry but that is the honest truth. This is not solipsism, as solipsism recognizes at least one truth, the sad fact is when everyone claims they have the the truth then no one has the truth. The subjectively greedy want to suck up all the truth for themselves and in doing so have made it so no one can have truth anymore. If you want to have your truth back then everyone needs to share, sorry but that is the truth of it.

Truth is found outside of mixed up talking and thinking. There are few, if no differences, in hard core experiences. There is no disagreement about falling off a tall cliff or tall building, the truth is we all die. Truth is found in the animal world where survival is predicted on the right instinct. A bear bits a fox, the fox dies. We have truth. Water erodes soil from land, we have truth. Fire destroys trees, we have truth. Philosophers debate the meaning of life, we have individual views and made up reality. What is permanent truth? Is it is death caused by falling off the cliff, or is it winning a philosophical debate?

 

[Jeremiahcp]

You're a pesky little guy, aren't you?

"And isn't it a bad thing to be deceived about the truth, and a good thing to know what the truth is? For I assume that by knowing the truth you mean knowing things as they really are. -Plato"

"The philosopher is in love with truth, that is, not with the changing world of sensation, which is the object of opinion, but with the unchanging reality which is the object of knowledge. -Plato"

"Truthfulness. He will never willingly tolerate an untruth, but will hate it as much as he loves truth. ... And is there anything more closely connected with wisdom than truth? - Plato"

"What is at issue is the conversion of the mind from the twilight of error to the truth, that climb up into the real world which we shall call true philosophy. - Plato"

"The object of knowledge is what exists and its function to know about reality. - Plato"

"One trait in the philosopher's character we can assume is his love of the knowledge that reveals eternal reality, the realm unaffected by change and decay. He is in love with the whole of that reality, and will not willingly be deprived even of the most insignificant fragment of it - just like the lovers and men of ambition we described earlier on. - Plato"

"When the mind's eye rests on objects illuminated by truth and reality, it understands and comprehends them, and functions intelligently; but when it turns to the twilight world of change and decay, it can only form opinions, its vision is confused and its beliefs shifting, and it seems to lack intelligence. - Plato"

 

[Willamena]

I can only declare a truth if we do it together.

Truth is objective. If it doesn't belong to any one of us, it certainly doesn't belong to any one group of us.

 

[Willamena]

You are seriously ignorant of doctrines concerning the Absolute?

I think most of us are ("us" in the modern world).

 

[Willamena]

"The basic concept of the Absolute is that it is the truest reality."

It would do you good to read that link instead of blindly flailing to save your pride.

Except that that makes no sense, and the Wikipedia author putting "(Philosophy)" in the title doesn't make it make sense.


Is this the jokes forum?

 

[Jeremiahcp]

Truth is objective. If it doesn't belong to any one of us, it certainly doesn't belong to any one group of us.

Let's declare it objective together then.

 

[Willamena]

Let's declare it objective together then.

Then it's subjective.

 

[DavidFirth]

Except that that makes no sense, and the Wikipedia author putting "(Philosophy)" in the title doesn't make it make sense.


Is this the jokes forum?

That's because your mindset doesn't comprehend it.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

Then it's subjective.

It is an agreed upon classification of an empirically observable and/or intersubjectively verifiable phenomenon based on certain qualities, but the question is: Would it still be objective if no was around to call it objective? Perhaps it takes two to tango.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

That's because your mindset doesn't comprehend it.

If I had a machine that swapped my mind to another's brain, and I was dying, and had to choose a new brain asap, but my only choices were your brain or her brain, I would take her brain without a second thought.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

Well then.


The cake is a lie.

I agree, cheesecake is clearly pie.

 

[Desert Snake]

None of you have the truth and you never will. The truth of the truth is that it doesn't exist, sorry but that is the honest truth. This is not solipsism, as solipsism recognizes at least one truth, the sad fact is when everyone claims they have the the truth then no one has the truth. The subjectively greedy want to suck up all the truth for themselves and in doing so have made it so no one can have truth anymore. If you want to have your truth back then everyone needs to share, sorry but that is the truth of it.

I agree.

 

[Willamena]

It is an agreed upon classification of an empirically observable and/or intersubjectively verifiable phenomenon based on certain qualities, but the question is: Would it still be objective if no was around to call it objective? Perhaps it takes two to tango.

It would be objective if no one was around. That's kind of what 'objective' means.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

It would be objective if no one was around. That's kind of what 'objective' means.

Could you describe something to me which is objective?

 

[Revoltingest]

How about things like the speed of light having a certain velocity? or Pi? things like that?

One view.....
Those things are different from each other.
The speed of light is a fact (a posteriori), which could possibly be observed to be different in another place & time.
The value of pi is a fact, & it is true (a priori), since it depends only upon premises. It will never change.

 

[Willamena]

Could you describe something to me which is objective?

Facts. In being true, an idea or concept refers to something that is factual and/or actual. It is truth that makes things objective.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

Facts. In being true, an idea or concept refers to something that is factual and/or actual. It is truth that makes things objective.

Well I was talking about something specific, but facts are empirically based.

In science, a fact is a repeatable careful observation or measurement (by experimentation or other means), also called empirical evidence.

Fact - Wikipedia

Empirical means of the senses.

Empirical evidence, also known as sense experience, is the knowledge or source of knowledge acquired by means of the senses, particularly by observation and experimentation.

Empirical evidence - Wikipedia

 

[siti]

Now everyone tell the truth. . . .



Is this emoji suppose to be a surprise hug emoji, or a surprise butt sex emoji?

Its OK either way as long as its consensual. And so is "the truth" - i.e. "objective" "truth" is really a matter of consensus between sufficiently expert observers - we actually don't know that it is true that the moon (for example) is really there when nobody is looking but we can reasonably make that assumption because sufficiently many observers with sufficient expertise making a careful enough examination have noted that it is always there when somebody is looking.

 

[LukeS]

The mind independent universe is a posit. Otherwise, we have the strange idea of navigating a 99.9999....% non existent reality.

By "posit" I don't mean so much as an axiom, that's too formal.

More like an assumption, rather than intellectual, its more a disposition to think, behave and even perceive in certain ways.

Its in the genes, an investment maybe, in a way of being (from in-vestere; originally " to clothe in official robes of an office" and later used to mean to use money to produce profit)...

Religiously:

"O children of Adam, we have provided you with garments to cover your bodies, as well as for luxury. But the best garment is the garment of righteousness. These are some of God's signs, that they may take heed. "


Object permanence is largely an unconscious assumption rather than something we have to keep on doing. More mature children (around 2 yo) are said to start to get the idea.

see also:

Object permanence - Wikipedia

Philosophically its untestable, like brain in a vat scenarios etc. Even so, I think that if you take away normal psychological and genetic development, normal people would become disabled.


See also:
William James - Wikipedia

(cash value - "He would seek the meaning of 'true' by examining how the idea functioned in our lives." )



Also from a religious perspective:

"According to the information expressed by the Prophet (PBUH), the size of seven skies with respect to the Holy Chair is like the size of seven coins (Dirham) cast into a shield."

Sama (Sky) | Questions on Islam

 

[DavidFirth]

If I had a machine that swapped my mind to another's brain, and I was dying, and had to choose a new brain asap, but my only choices were your brain or her brain, I would take her brain without a second thought.

Thanks. You just proved my point. Nice little chat.