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Thousands of Hindu girls coerced into Islamic conversion in Pakistan

ShivaFan

Satyameva Jayate
Premium Member
Pakistan is close to falling completely into exremist hands. Those in the military who are Islamic but not extremist are hanging on the razor edge and have to resort to dictatorial measures very draconian to control the situation.

Yes forceful.conversions are happening. Actually, it happens though rarely in India. But less rare, the murder of one who was Muslim but left Islam.
 

icehorse

......unaffiliated...... anti-dogmatist
Premium Member
Islam is a one way street. You can go in (apparently by whatever means necessary), but you can't come out.
 

George-ananda

Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism
Premium Member
Memoirs of a Hindu girl - Pakistan - DAWN.COM
Forced conversion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"A 2014 report says about 1,000 Christian and Hindu women in Pakistan are forcibly converted to Islam every year."

If India was Muslim and Pakistan was Hindu, there would a massive Islamic Jihad against such a thing. Where is the Hindu anger over this?
Good question of where the anger is. But anger might just get you dead in a backwards thinking country. I hope international groups get involved to pressure Pakistan to stop the groups doing this. Sneaky Pakistani politicians have been known to say the right thing but then turn a blind eye to certain things. Still a pre-modern thinking part of the world.
 

MD

qualiaphile
Good question of where the anger is. But anger might just get you dead in a backwards thinking country. I hope international groups get involved to pressure Pakistan to stop the groups doing this. Sneaky Pakistani politicians have been known to say the right thing but then turn a blind eye to certain things. Still a pre-modern thinking part of the world.

Eventually Pakistan will become like ISIS and there will be a war with Hindu India. Polytheism is the worst sin in Islam, and once the country falls firmly into fundamentalist hands they will wage an all out war on the 'kuffars' of India practicing 'shirk'

I fear for my loved ones in India when this happens.
 

Poeticus

| abhyAvartin |
Where is the Hindu anger over this?
It's outshouted by the disease that is Indo-secularism; bullied by the plague that is known by rationalists as irrational idealism; and tortured to near death by the pseudo-progressive ideal that is arbitrary selectivism. By the way, if you have time you should watch the following:


OP, you want to know something? Most Hindus these days are rather too busy trying to get Hinduism to become more universalistic, Anglophone-centric/friendly, and/or something else that it is not, rather than call out such anti-Hindu atrocities and abuses. On average, most Hindus (online and offline) usually stay quiet about such things.

It's a symptom many Hindus are currently suffering from, both born-Hindus and converts are its patients. For example, there will be more Hindus lambasting other Hindus than unite with them in order to "Bring Back Our Girls(c)". I have never ever encountered such a disenfranchised, immobilized, and hopelessly scattered group---"Hindu unity" is more irrationally idealistic than getting ISIS to stop dead in its tracks its horrid crimes against both Kafirs and women.

In fact, an amoeba has a greater chance of mutating into a half-humanoid-alien-like thing than Hindus ever becoming progressively united. I dropped the disastrous illusion that is "Hindu solidarity" the day I realized that Hindus would rather have other Hindus let in the wolves (i.e., anti-Hindu encroachments with or without knowing them as such), than rather build a protective wall in order to keep an almost three-four thousand years old culture and faith and its practitioners safe (i.e., unite under something practical instead of hiding behind cliched, self-established moral high grounds).
 
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Estro Felino

Believer in free will
Premium Member
The fact that we will see very few Muslims criticize this crime against humanity harshly, here, on this Forum....clearly proves that Muslims are afraid of speaking out against extremism.

and it definitely proves that Islam needs a Reformation from within
 
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beenie

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
These people are sick. Extremist Islam needs to be stopped in its tracks, but I don't think people honestly know how to do it. Even the US doesn't know what steps to take to make it go away (or they DO know, but don't want to ruffle the feathers of our despicable KSA "allies".

Islam is 100% in need of reform, but it definitely needs to come from within, which is highly unlikely... unfortunately. There are some groups trying to modernize Islam, but they are seen as "non-Muslim" of course. It's just a vicious cycle.

Pakistan is a cesspool and will just continue to implode as long as they allow these religious extremists and corrupt politicians to rule.
 

Draupadi

Active Member
And how can Islam reform seeing that people are in denial? I just can't figure out what's happening after that infamous 9/11 incident? The Islamic terrorists have become bolder and joining them has become a trend even among the Westerners than ever before. Bangladesh is quite a secular country and we are very tolerant about minor religions. But after that incident of September Islamic fundamentalism started coming out of their hiding place. There were some terrorist activities but thank God they have been nipped in the bud. But what surprised me most was the damage of the Buddhist and Hindu temples and properties by the Muslims, a few years back. There was even a case where a fake FB account have been opened by a bunch of ruffians in the name of a Hindu. Then a derogatory post about Prophet Muhammad was made there. The thing spread like wildfire in the village and the Muslims started attacking all the Hindu villagers there and destroyed many of their properties! They say that ours is a land of thirteen festivals in twelve months. All these festival have been derived from Islam, Hinduism and maybe Buddhism. And look what happened?
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Funny how you don't see this thing going on beyond these places, which, yes are largely Islamic, but more importantly are war-torn places where cultural goats are butting heads, outsiders are claiming resources and establishing rulers and supporting cooperative ones, and where social stability is very fragile, which is where you tend to see some of the worst humanity has to offer, such as post-WWI Germany, which blew the gates open for Nazi ideology.
But yet it goes on that the bulk majority of Muslims are just as appalled by this as we are. There are many Muslim scholars who strongly disagree with this behavior and have denounced it as against Islamic law, and there is a massive outcry from majority of the Ummah, yet this all goes ignored as people still insist this "lack of outcry" proves all Muslims are like that. If they aren't responding here, it's because you're all being a bunch of jerks. Do you honestly believe the Muslim at large community here on RF believes such actions, being carried out in the name of Islam, is acceptable?
No one is calling for a Jewish reform, even though there have been Jewish terrorists and the Torah has somethings in it that are rather unpleasant. No one is calling for Christian reform, even though the Bible has many unpleasant things in it. And although anti-Catholicism has been a large part of the American spirit over it's history, no one was calling for a Christian reform as the priest sex-scandal was being brought to public attention. Now, why is it that we can separate Catholicism from Christianity when it angers us, and even better separate the Vatican from the other Catholics, but yet we cannot separate a few rabid dogs from Islam?
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
I have come to suspect that in order to understand and prevent such episodes we need to be very aware of the difference between the "proper views" and the actual reality.

Claims that "proper" Islam has no coercion and no violence can only go so far. At some point we must admit that there is a need to deal with things as they are and refuse to hide behind ghosts of how things would be in an ideal Islam that may well not be factible.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
I have come to suspect that in order to understand and prevent such episodes we need to be very aware of the difference between the "proper views" and the actual reality.

Claims that "proper" Islam has no coercion and no violence can only go so far. At some point we must admit that there is a need to deal with things as they are and refuse to hide behind ghosts of how things would be in an ideal Islam that may well not be factible.
It's nothing to do about "proper views" and reality. It's the reality that it's not just a religion causing problems in that part of the world. When you look at all the problems and issues face around the Middle East, it's no surprise they are both very religious and have lots of social and political turmoil. With cultural invasions, many foreigners with alot of power (in many cases more power than the state), and a long history of war fueled by Western and Middle Eastern conflicts, it's no wonder that the things happening are happening.
 

MD

qualiaphile
Funny how you don't see this thing going on beyond these places, which, yes are largely Islamic, but more importantly are war-torn places where cultural goats are butting heads, outsiders are claiming resources and establishing rulers and supporting cooperative ones, and where social stability is very fragile, which is where you tend to see some of the worst humanity has to offer, such as post-WWI Germany, which blew the gates open for Nazi ideology.
But yet it goes on that the bulk majority of Muslims are just as appalled by this as we are. There are many Muslim scholars who strongly disagree with this behavior and have denounced it as against Islamic law, and there is a massive outcry from majority of the Ummah, yet this all goes ignored as people still insist this "lack of outcry" proves all Muslims are like that. If they aren't responding here, it's because you're all being a bunch of jerks. Do you honestly believe the Muslim at large community here on RF believes such actions, being carried out in the name of Islam, is acceptable?
No one is calling for a Jewish reform, even though there have been Jewish terrorists and the Torah has somethings in it that are rather unpleasant. No one is calling for Christian reform, even though the Bible has many unpleasant things in it. And although anti-Catholicism has been a large part of the American spirit over it's history, no one was calling for a Christian reform as the priest sex-scandal was being brought to public attention. Now, why is it that we can separate Catholicism from Christianity when it angers us, and even better separate the Vatican from the other Catholics, but yet we cannot separate a few rabid dogs from Islam?

Pakistan is hardly war torn
 

Woodrow LI

IB Ambassador
Memoirs of a Hindu girl - Pakistan - DAWN.COM
Forced conversion - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"A 2014 report says about 1,000 Christian and Hindu women in Pakistan are forcibly converted to Islam every year."

If India was Muslim and Pakistan was Hindu, there would a massive Islamic Jihad against such a thing. Where is the Hindu anger over this?


Which raises many questions. While I do not doubt forced conversions do occur. Another story may also have some credibility. HERE.

All news sources will carry unintentional bias and sometimes deliberate bias. "Honor " does occur not only among Muslims. There is a level of "disgrace" in many cultures if a member leaves willingly. There is a strong incentive for the families of a person who leaves their religion to believe it was forced.

I am not trying to lessen the atrocity of forced conversions, but pointing out that all "Forced Conversions" might not be forced. I doubt if it is possible to separate real forced conversions from free will conversions in which the family can not accept it was free choice.

Just my opinion, but sadly no matter which occurs the result is increased tensions.
 

Estro Felino

Believer in free will
Premium Member
I am not trying to lessen the atrocity of forced conversions, but pointing out that all "Forced Conversions" might not be forced. I doubt if it is possible to separate real forced conversions from free will conversions in which the family can not accept it was free choice.
.

with all due respect. we are dealing with women, here.
I think that it is very very improbable that a Hindu woman can give up her freedom of sexual expression, independent thinking to convert to a religion that deny them.

By freedom of sexual expression I mean the liberty to wear feminine clothes, which underline who you are.
 
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Woodrow LI

IB Ambassador
with all due respect. we are dealing with women, here.
I think that it is very very improbable that a Hindu woman can give up state of freedom of sexual expression, independent thinking to convert to a religion that deny them.

By freedom of sexual expression I mean the liberty to wear feminine clothes, which underline who you are.

While I agree that is a very good point. It is quite difficult to distinguish Muslim and Hindu girls in Pakistan by their clothing, the clothing of both is very similar.
 

MD

qualiaphile
War torn is hardly the only thing I mentioned.

There is a strong concept of conquest and conquer in Islam. It is a part of the faith and it's history. I've had Pakistanis literally tell me that they used to rule India once and they will rule it again, in urdu.

The forced conversions take place in Egypt as well with the Coptic girls. Also there is less impetus or legal justification from an Islamic perspective to abduct 'people of the faith' vs Hindus who are seen as the worst sinners in Islam.
 
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