To anyone - Why do people espouse religion?

[MSizer]

OK, I'm appealing to the harsh facts here, and neglecting some of the nicer ones, so please don't accuse me of bashing religion by being "one-sided" about it. I know that religion has contributed to formalizing codes of behaviour, missionary work (mind you much of it was evil, but some of course is good) and so on. But, here's what interests me at the moment:

There is a known inversly non-linear correlation between the IQ of children and the religiosity of their parents (the more religious you are, the less smart your kid will likely be).

There is a non-linear correlation between religiosity and social patholgoy (murder, rape, theft...).

In the US, the prison populations are per capita much more christian than the general public.

I was raised in a catholic family and from the time I was a kid I thought it was ridiculous. What is it about religion that is so appealing to some people?

 

[themadhair]

In the US, the prison populations are per capita much more christian than the general public.

I thought it was pretty bloody close from the only data I’ve seen (and even that dated to 1998). The problem with trying to determine this is due to how professing a faith may help with getting reduced jail time, and the most common faith to reach for is Christianity.

 

[Morse]

OK, I'm appealing to the harsh facts here, and neglecting some of the nicer ones, so please don't accuse me of bashing religion by being "one-sided" about it. I know that religion has contributed to formalizing codes of behaviour, missionary work (mind you much of it was evil, but some of course is good) and so on. But, here's what interests me at the moment:

There is a known inversly non-linear correlation between the IQ of children and the religiosity of their parents (the more religious you are, the less smart your kid will likely be).

Err, while I agree with you from anecdotal experience on the topic of intelligence, the only studies I have ever encountered included minimal control groups, and about half of them concluded no significant correlation. Relying on statistics in this field is not a good idea.

I was raised in a catholic family and from the time I was a kid I thought it was ridiculous. What is it about religion that is so appealing to some people?

Here's an idea, find some heavily religious people with a full brain (In real life) (and yes they do exist, I've met a few) and ask them. I bet most of the answers on here will be from foaming at the mouth atheists in agreement or dolts like Thief.

 

[sandandfoam]

How about citing those studies so we can have a look at them?

 

[Kilgore Trout]

I was raised in a catholic family and from the time I was a kid I thought it was ridiculous. What is it about religion that is so appealing to some people?

I would guess that they don't think it's ridiculous.

 

[MSizer]

How about citing those studies so we can have a look at them?

The National Longitudinal surveys by the U.S. Labor board (2008):

"on average, Atheists scored 1.95 IQ points higher than Agnostics, 3.82 points higher than Liberal persuasions, and 5.89 IQ points higher than Dogmatic persuasion"

Helmuth Nyborg & Richard Lynn, in "The Scientific Study of Intelligence" (using UN data from 137 countries) published that atheists average 6 IQ points higher than theists.

Oh boy am I gonna win some enemies with this post. 8^(

 

[DavyCrocket2003]

Perhaps there is a deep psychological yearning for a meaning and a purpose to life. Sort of an emptiness and aching that people are desperate to fill. I think that some people turn to religion to try and obtain this fulfillment. Some turn to other things. I think that is why you see people that join gangs or do drugs. Some people think that they can find what they are missing through money or sex. Am I making sense?

 

[MSizer]

Perhaps there is a deep psychological yearning for a meaning and a purpose to life. Sort of an emptiness and aching that people are desperate to fill. I think that some people turn to religion to try and obtain this fulfillment. Some turn to other things. I think that is why you see people that join gangs or do drugs. Some people think that they can find what they are missing through money or sex. Am I making sense?

Actually that seems plausible to me, as there's no doubt that religion is a means for community for many people.

 

[DavyCrocket2003]

The National Longitudinal surveys by the U.S. Labor board (2008):

"on average, Atheists scored 1.95 IQ points higher than Agnostics, 3.82 points higher than Liberal persuasions, and 5.89 IQ points higher than Dogmatic persuasion"

Helmuth Nyborg & Richard Lynn, in "The Scientific Study of Intelligence" (using UN data from 137 countries) published that atheists average 6 IQ points higher than theists.

Oh boy am I gonna win some enemies with this post. 8^(

Why should that be the case? You're just respectfully quoting studies. And I think it makes sense. I think that the people with the lowest IQ are less likely to think rationally about their religious beliefs. They would be more likely to just go along with whatever they were taught as kids, no questions asked. Because most atheists in America were brought up religious and would have to at some point reject it, I would expect them as a whole to be fairly intelligent and mentally agile.

 

[ChristineES]

If you find it ridiculous, then you find it ridiculous. It is your own decision to accept or not accept something, no one can make that decision for you.

I never bought into the idea that people of faith have lower IQs. Since there are more theists (something like 86% in the USA) then it would only be normal that most prison populations would be theists, since I don't think having or not having faith causes a person to commit more or less crimes.

 

[Caladan]

The National Longitudinal surveys by the U.S. Labor board (2008):

"on average, Atheists scored 1.95 IQ points higher than Agnostics, 3.82 points higher than Liberal persuasions, and 5.89 IQ points higher than Dogmatic persuasion"

Helmuth Nyborg & Richard Lynn, in "The Scientific Study of Intelligence" (using UN data from 137 countries) published that atheists average 6 IQ points higher than theists.

Oh boy am I gonna win some enemies with this post. 8^(

Do you really want to go that way?
"Certain psychometric studies have recorded people of Jewish background as scoring higher than average on various tests, with estimates ranging from 3 to 12 points above the mean of white gentiles".
"The authors argue that these finding are supported by Ashkenazi academic achievement, noting that while, for example, in the United States, Ashkenazi Jews represent less than 2% of the population, they have have won 27% of the US Nobel Prizes in science."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashkenazi_intelligence

 

[linwood]

How about citing those studies so we can have a look at them?

Me too what he said.

 

[linwood]

I never bought into the idea that people of faith have lower IQs. Since there are more theists (something like 86% in the USA) then it would only be normal that most prison populations would be theists, since I don't think having or not having faith causes a person to commit more or less crimes.

Actually the prison stats Msizer mentions are by percentages.

Atheists are severely under reported in prison populations.

Msizer,

Thank you for the other references as they pique my interest I`ll check them out.

 

[Metalic Wings]

Perhaps there is a deep psychological yearning for a meaning and a purpose to life. Sort of an emptiness and aching that people are desperate to fill. I think that some people turn to religion to try and obtain this fulfillment. Some turn to other things. I think that is why you see people that join gangs or do drugs. Some people think that they can find what they are missing through money or sex. Am I making sense?

I completely agree. Being human means being sad or lonesome at some point or another. A whole LOT of people turn to drugs (I shudder to even think of the numbers) and a lot of people in foreign situations turn to gangs as well.

I guess the best way I can put it is: If people are RESPONSIBLE about their religion (ie they are respectful of others and try their best to understand other's positions while still trying to stay moral and ethical themselves) why not let them believe? So what if "God" is just some imaginary friend that you have to get you through the rough times? Isn't the more important fact that you find the strength in yourself to overcome those hard times? Who cares putting a name to it.

I know most religious leaders (or srtongly religious people, for that matter) might not like what I have to say, or even agree. But I'm talking on an individual level here. And I assume (hopefully not incorrectly, but do tell me if I'm wrong) that the individual level is what you're aiming at here.

 

[Willamena]

There is a known inversly non-linear correlation between the IQ of children and the religiosity of their parents (the more religious you are, the less smart your kid will likely be).

Is "inversely non-linear" the same as "linear"?

 

[Guitar's Cry]

It's existential, man.

Life is rough, is full of suffering, and our post-modernistic world can leave our heads spinning. It's nice to have something to hold on to.

 

[T-Dawg]

"on average, Atheists scored 1.95 IQ points higher than Agnostics, 3.82 points higher than Liberal persuasions, and 5.89 IQ points higher than Dogmatic persuasion"

I can see why an atheist might come out higher than a dogmatic, but I'm very doubtful that an atheist would come higher than an agnostic. Most agnostics are inherently more open-minded than atheists, since they haven't compleely come to the decision of whether or not there is a god, and are therefore still accepting evidence. And I highly doubt religiousity has an effect on actual IQ, it probably has to do with other variables, such as how the children were raised and what genetics are in them (it's possible, that since most Christians only reproduce with other Christians, they could become their own race, similar to the Jews, I think. In this case, a race where IQ is not a strong gene.). Or, you know, that atheists have to be brave to be atheist in America. You have to be decently intelligent to get past the cultural infatuation with Hypocrite Christianity, which means that most people who reject Hypocrite Christianity (which is pretty much the only influential religion in America) will be decently intelligent, or raised by decently intelligent people (who will transfer that intelligence through genetics and the way they raise their child). Claiming that atheists are inherently smarter than religious people simply because the atheists tested in an experiment have higher IQs than the religious people is like claiming that most people outside of an assylum are somewhat sane (sorry, couldn't think of a better comparison =/).

 

[Sunstone]

It's existential, man.

Life is rough, is full of suffering, and our post-modernistic world can leave our heads spinning. It's nice to have something to hold on to.

It seems a lot of religion -- but certainly not all -- is escapism. Escapism from suffering. Usually, when we encounter suffering, we try to escape from it. And religions often -- but not always -- help us to do that by ascribing various meanings to suffering. Those meanings, however, are escapes.

 

[Erebus]

I was raised in a catholic family and from the time I was a kid I thought it was ridiculous. What is it about religion that is so appealing to some people?

Religion has different benefits for different people. Some people are afraid, angry or insecure and their religion gives them something to hold dear. Some people want the sense of community and love that an organised religion can provide. However, the benefits of a religion isn't the only thing that draws people to it, the desire for truth also plays a big role.
I believe that everybody searches for truth in their own way, whether that is by joining a mainstream religion, following your own "religion" (as I do) or by rejecting the metaphysical in order to explore the things that can be seen and touched. At the end of the day, it's simply a means to try and create order in a chaotic universe (or, depending on the person, to create chaos in a boring society ).
Religion is ridiculous to you because of the values you hold, it's that simple (and that isn't a dig at you either).

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

... There is a known inversly non-linear correlation between the IQ of children and the religiosity of their parents (the more religious you are, the less smart your kid will likely be).

How about citing those studies so we can have a look at them?

The National Longitudinal surveys by the U.S. Labor board (2008):

"on average, Atheists scored 1.95 IQ points higher than Agnostics, 3.82 points higher than Liberal persuasions, and 5.89 IQ points higher than Dogmatic persuasion"

Helmuth Nyborg & Richard Lynn, in "The Scientific Study of Intelligence" (using UN data from 137 countries) published that atheists average 6 IQ points higher than theists.

Oh boy am I gonna win some enemies with this post. 8^(

You are far more likely to make a fool of yourself if you don't do better than this. Try again.