Torath Mosheh / Orthodox Judaism - The History of Terah and his family

[Ehav4Ever]

Side question. The Hebrew scriptures were allowed to be translated into Koine Greek, which I would conclude was not against any law as such?

Actually, that is not true. It was not the Jewish community in Israel that "allowed" a translation to be made into Greek. According to some historians the Jews of Egypt who did not know Hebrew very well translated the text into Greek. This translation no longer exists.

Yet, their translation in Greek was never considered to be equal to the original. In the Talmud, it is clearly stated that no translation can fully translate ideas from the Torah. The closest one was the Aramaic translations because Aramaic has a lot of similarities to Hebrew. YET, the Aramaic never was considered an equal to the original. That is when they read or verbally translate the Hebrew Torah it was always twice in Hebrew and once in Aramaic translation.

Also, it must be noted that translation are a form of commentary. Professional translators recognize this, and often translations have to come with a lot of commentary to explain concepts more easily available to someone who knows the original text and the culture behind it.

Thus, no Jew ignores the plain sense of the Hebrew text in order to make a foreign concept work in translation.

Again, I am not trying to tell you what to beleive about your translation. That is not for me to dictate to anyone.

 

[Ehav4Ever]

I'm beginning to think you should study the scriptures more and ask God Almighty for help. But that's me, I'm not telling you what to do, just a little suggestion.

I had a feeling you were just waiting to try to sneak in a disrepectful comment.

 

[GoodAttention]

Actually, that is not true. It was not the Jewish community in Israel that "allowed" a translation to be made into Greek. According to some historians the Jews of Egypt who did not know Hebrew very well translated the text into Greek. This translation no longer exists.

Interesting. I would have thought Christianity came from this.

Yet, their translation in Greek was never considered to be equal to the original. In the Talmud, it is clearly stated that no translation can fully translate ideas from the Torah. The closest one was the Aramaic translations because Aramaic has a lot of similarities to Hebrew. YET, the Aramaic never was considered an equal to the original. That is when they read or verbally translate the Hebrew Torah it was always twice in Hebrew and once in Aramaic translation.

Also, it must be noted that translation are a form of commentary. Professional translators recognize this, and often translations have to come with a lot of commentary to explain concepts more easily available to someone who knows the original text and the culture behind it.

Thus, no Jew ignores the plain sense of the Hebrew text in order to make a foreign concept work in translation.

I will hold you to this!

Again, I am not trying to tell you what to beleive about your translation. That is not for me to dictate to anyone.

Then we should discuss the hypothetical questions, which I started but don't think we completed.

Did Abram bury his father, and if not what was the reason?

 

[Ehav4Ever]

Did Abram bury his father, and if not what was the reason?

There is a midrash that states that he returned to Haran to bury his father. The midrash explains that this is where he was when Sara died. When he returned he found out that she had passed away and he he had to bury her.

 

[GoodAttention]

There is a midrash that states that he returned to Haran to bury his father. The midrash explains that this is where he was when Sara died. When he returned he found out that she had passed away and he he had to bury her.

So Terah the idol maker financed his son Abram whilst he was alive, and was also alive when Isaac was born.

However he lived until 205 years of age only by the affect of Abraham?

The last time we discussed this I thought Abraham didn't bury Terah because of his idolatry, but this reconciles both Terah and Abraham.


Non-Jewish comment:
Considering Terah could have been worshipping Vedic gods, it can be considered that he was exposed to a Vedic way of life and instruction. The five yamas, which include non-violence, truthfulness, non-stealing, and sexual morality, have common ground in four of the seven Noahide laws. The fifth yama however is aparigraha, which translates to non-possessiveness, non-greed, or non-attachment. This is explained as the following;

"Let your concern be with the action alone, and never with the fruits of action. Do not let the results of your action be your motive, and do not be attached to inaction"

I believe Terah defied this yama with wholeheartedness, and his mantra would have been the following;

"Let not my concern be with the action (idol making/worship), and always the fruits of action (money). Let the results of my actions by my motive (wealth), and always have a purpose (that my son can complete)!".

Terah had determination, taking his family out of Ur Kasdim, and becoming like a king in the city of Harran as described by the Hittites to Abraham. Given how he shows himself to reject the Vedas by not upholding the yamas tells me his idol worship was for "business interests" only, and never truly within his heart. I believe this was a personal secret between God and Terah the idol maker, who's rejection of non-possessiveness teaches Abram through example what God considers righteous, as well as justification for Abram to take possession of the promised land by God's direction and Terah's wealth.

Terah living 30 years longer than Abraham is significant within this context, as is the explanation as to why he didn't complete the journey he started, being that he became attached to inaction.

 

[Ehav4Ever]

So Terah the idol maker financed his son Abram whilst he was alive, and was also alive when Isaac was born.

However he lived until 205 years of age only by the affect of Abraham?

The last time we discussed this I thought Abraham didn't bury Terah because of his idolatry, but this reconciles both Terah and Abraham.

Yes, sometimes when digging deep into what previous generations of Jews have written or passed on about the Torah one has to look at various commentators who had differenct focuses in their commentary. I found one that detailed more about what took place during certain periods and found one that stated that Avraham buried Terah when he passed away.

 

[GoodAttention]

Yes, sometimes when digging deep into what previous generations of Jews have written or passed on about the Torah one has to look at various commentators who had differenct focuses in their commentary. I found one that detailed more about what took place during certain periods and found one that stated that Avraham buried Terah when he passed away.

ba'al teshuvah

 

[River Sea]

So Terah the idol maker financed his son Abram whilst he was alive, and was also alive when Isaac was born.

However he lived until 205 years of age only by the affect of Abraham?

The last time we discussed this I thought Abraham didn't bury Terah because of his idolatry, but this reconciles both Terah and Abraham.


Non-Jewish comment:
Considering Terah could have been worshipping Vedic gods, it can be considered that he was exposed to a Vedic way of life and instruction. The five yamas, which include non-violence, truthfulness, non-stealing, and sexual morality, have common ground in four of the seven Noahide laws. The fifth yama however is aparigraha, which translates to non-possessiveness, non-greed, or non-attachment. This is explained as the following;

"Let your concern be with the action alone, and never with the fruits of action. Do not let the results of your action be your motive, and do not be attached to inaction"

I believe Terah defied this yama with wholeheartedness, and his mantra would have been the following;

"Let not my concern be with the action (idol making/worship), and always the fruits of action (money). Let the results of my actions by my motive (wealth), and always have a purpose (that my son can complete)!".

Terah had determination, taking his family out of Ur Kasdim, and becoming like a king in the city of Harran as described by the Hittites to Abraham. Given how he shows himself to reject the Vedas by not upholding the yamas tells me his idol worship was for "business interests" only, and never truly within his heart. I believe this was a personal secret between God and Terah the idol maker, who's rejection of non-possessiveness teaches Abram through example what God considers righteous, as well as justification for Abram to take possession of the promised land by God's direction and Terah's wealth.

Terah living 30 years longer than Abraham is significant within this context, as is the explanation as to why he didn't complete the journey he started, being that he became attached to inaction.

@GoodAttention

Their relationship with Terah and Abram, as well as their travels, would be considered a matriarchal or patriarchal society, or could they possibly combine the two?

 

[GoodAttention]

@GoodAttention

Their relationship with Terah and Abram, as well as their travels, would be considered a matriarchal or patriarchal society, or could they possibly combine the two?

I have answered this in the other thread.

As we learn about Mother Tamil and matriarchal society, patriarchal society

@GoodAttention More questions I have. Greeks were Pharaohs in ancient Egypt yet later traveled away from ancient Egypt to Rome, Italy. How come? How come these Greek descendants didn't bring with them this word 'Pharaohs' to the rulers of Rome—no longer calling themselves Pharaohs...

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