Trump Indicted. To be Arrested in Days.

[lewisnotmiller]

The rule of law applies to all.

'does' or 'should' or...

Laws are not applied evenly. They are sometimes not applied at all.

 

[Jose Fly]

I'll watch with interest, but I'm way more concerned about his attempts to vote rig in Georgia than this, in terms of the safety of your democracy.

There's a grand jury for that as well. However, GA Republicans are giving themselves the power to remove prosecutors at their whim, so we'll have to see how that goes too.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

The actual crime is misuse of campaign funds; it's a financial crime. I know we Americans tend to be tolerant of white collar crime, but we shouldn't be.

That's only a misdemeanour.

To be inducted, the misuse needs to be connected to concealing another crime.

The New York hush-money probe of Donald Trump explained

More than six years after Donald Trump's lawyer paid off a porn star, New York prosecutors appear to be close to deciding whether the former president should face charges in connection with that payoff.

apnews.com

 

[lewisnotmiller]

There's a grand jury for that as well. However, GA Republicans are giving themselves the power to remove prosecutors at their whim, so we'll have to see how that goes too.

I don't know that it will be successful legally, but morally that was pretty outrageous imho.

 

[Jose Fly]

I don't know that it will be successful legally, but morally that was pretty outrageous imho.

True, regardless of what's in the law they still have to actually take action (unless someone tries to make a prima facie case). And yeah it's outrageous....it's a completely new thing for our country.

 

[Windwalker]

As much as I'd like to see Trump charged, tried, convicted, & sentenced
to prison, this all strikes me as pure politics. They're going after him for
paying hush money. Not even clear what the crime is. They should be
going after him for insurrection.
But Clinton wasn't prosecuted for certain perjury to a grand jury, &
suborning perjury. Let's go after both...send a message to these scoundrels.

BTW, one thing you may be overlooking here, is that it was Donald Trump's own DOJ under Bill Barr, who went after Michael Cohen for the exact same crime, to which Cohen was sentenced for 6 years. So, let's not think that this is about politics. If it were, then Cohen would never have been charged. Now Trump will be charged for the same crime, just by New York instead.

This is about the facts and the law. Not politics. The only thing I will say is that the DA is going after him because he has a long history of crimes. So it's about pursuing a career criminal, not an ex-president.

 

[Debater Slayer]

As much as I'd like to see Trump charged, tried, convicted, & sentenced
to prison, this all strikes me as pure politics. They're going after him for
paying hush money. Not even clear what the crime is. They should be
going after him for insurrection.
But Clinton wasn't prosecuted for certain perjury to a grand jury, &
suborning perjury. Let's go after both...send a message to these scoundrels.

And Bush and Cheney were not and will not be prosecuted for war crimes and misleading the public.

The fact that Trump is the first former president to face criminal charges when Bill Clinton and George W. Bush exist is a blot on the American justice system. Every single one of the three deserves to be charged.

 

[Revoltingest]

Nonsense. The law is the law. Right? It doesn't apply to former presidents? And it's not for paying hush money. It's for lying about it what it was for and committing business fraud. Just wait till the actual charges come out. You can't just say it's about politics, when you don't know what the charges even are.

You say "nonsense", but that's exactly what I'm criticizing.
Lying about hush money isn't inherently illegal.
If he declared it as a business deduction, that's normally
a matter for the IRS to simply levy penalties & interest
against an ordinary citizen.
But the masses would go to prison for perjury & suborning
perjury. Yet Clinton escaped even the lightest scrutiny for
those. And then there was the selling of pardons. No
prosecution at all.
The double standard smacks of politics.

 

[F1fan]

It’s political and sets a precedent. The Biden crime family will be next! What a terrible mistake!

Would it not be political to let him get away with felonies?

 

[Revoltingest]

The actual crime is misuse of campaign funds; it's a financial crime. I know we Americans tend to be tolerant of white collar crime, but we shouldn't be.

That would be a crime, but it's a fairly common one
for politicians, & seldom results in prosecution. The
last I know of is John Edwards over a decade ago.
Acquitted on one charge. Others dropped.
So not really treated as a crime by government.

 

[Revoltingest]

I understand the tu quoque.

Since I'm not discrediting anyone's argument with a
personal attack, I think you meant something other
than...

Tu quoque - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

And as I said in a former post, high positioned politicians get away with one or two crimes. But Trump is a habitual criminal. At one point the line has to be drawn. And the damage to the reputation is less with Trump convicted than with the notion that the law is toothless in the US. And the danger that future presidents will take Trump as a role model.

I'm in favor of prosecution, but for insurrection & subversion.
Going after him for crimes less than ignored previously sends
the message: It's about politics.

 

[Revoltingest]

I pointed out in the other thread that Trump's case bears a lot of similarities to the John Edwards case...covering up hush money paid to hide an affair, and subverting campaign finance laws to do it.

And how did that turn out for Edwards?
All show, but no judgment or sanctions.
Trump might've been acting on the
message that it's OK for Democrats, &
must be for him too.

 

[Revoltingest]

The rule of law applies to all.

It should.
It doesn't.

 

[Revoltingest]

BTW, one thing you may be overlooking here, is that it was Donald Trump's own DOJ under Bill Barr, who went after Michael Cohen for the exact same crime, to which Cohen was sentenced for 6 years. So, let's not think that this is about politics. If it were, then Cohen would never have been charged. Now Trump will be charged for the same crime, just by New York instead.

This is about the facts and the law. Not politics. The only thing I will say is that the DA is going after him because he has a long history of crimes. So it's about pursuing a career criminal, not an ex-president.

The problem I see is that Presidents (ex & otherwise)
evade prosecution by their status. Underlings don't
enjoy such impunity.
Why not go after him for insurrection & subversion?
Tis almost as though the prosecution wants to avoid
the real crimes...for whatever fear, I don't know.
So they go for small potatoes. Are they actually
seeking vengeance while simultaneously protecting
him from meatier charges?

 

[F1fan]

The problem I see is that Presidents (ex & otherwise)
evade prosecution by their status. Underlings don't
enjoy such impunity.
Why not go after him for insurrection & subversion?
Tis almost as though the prosecution wants to avoid
the real crimes...for whatever fear, I don't know.
So they go for small potatoes. Are they actually
seeking vengeance while simultaneously protecting
him from meatier charges?

The Gwyneth Paltrow ski trial happened last week. That incident happened in 2016. Lawsuits often take time. The more people involved the more work involved. I understand many people are impatient but law takes time.

 

[Revoltingest]

The Gwyneth Paltrow ski trial happened last week. That incident happened in 2016. Lawsuits often take time. The more people involved the more work involved. I understand many people are impatient but law takes time.

Tort suits involving celebrities are very different
from criminal prosecution of (ex) Presidents.

 

[F1fan]

And how did that turn out for Edwards?
All show, but no judgment or sanctions.
Trump might've been acting on the
message that it's OK for Democrats, &
must be for him too.

Heck, a jury let OJ off. That didn't mean murder is ok for ex-football players. We can’t look at similar cases as if the evidence is the same.

 

[crossfire]

There are more brewing in the courts in various states. This one is probably the most minor. Let's hope people are not bored by these and think The Boy Who Cried Wolf by the time the Georgia one comes up.

 

[Revoltingest]

Heck, a jury let OJ off. That didn't mean murder is ok for ex-football players. We can’t look at similar cases as if the evidence is the same.

Perhaps you misunderstand me.
I'm not saying it's OK for Presidents to commit crimes.
Instead, I want all of'm prosecuted when they have.
Clinton's several crimes were ignored.
Trump's lesser crimes are being prosecuted.
And his subversion is being ignored.
This whole history is a perversion of justice.

 

[Stevicus]

Trump Indicted in New York: Donald Trump Is Indicted in New York (Published 2023)

Mr. Trump will be the first former president to face criminal charges. The precise charges are not yet known, but the case is focused on a hush-money payment to a porn star during his 2016 campaign.

www.nytimes.com

It begins!

Well, it should be an interesting circus, both inside and outside the courtroom.