Trump Supporters: Where do you draw the line?

[Mr Spinkles]

Trump supporters, and those who routinely defend him on RF: could you please list three or four things that you wouldn’t defend, minimize, or excuse, if Trump did those things?

It seems every time someone starts a thread criticizing Trump for X, a predictable group defends, downplays or changes the topic in some way. So I am curious what X would have to be in order to cross the line and no longer be worthy of defending.

Feel free to be as imaginative and outlandish as you please. After all, who could have predicted all the outlandish things Trump has done up to this point.

What if audio came out where Trump was mocking evangelical Christians in private?

What if he clearly loses the election, and refuses to accept the results?

Surely you can think of something ... you wouldn’t just reflexively defend *anything* he does no matter what ... right?

I want you to be on record before it happens, next time. Thanks.

 

[ReluctantMathematician]

What I wonder is if the moral integrity of his supporters has been permanently lowered by Trump's stay in the office. Will they revert back to traditional right-wing views when he is gone, or is this the new normal of the Right?

 

[Stevicus]

I keep thinking of this chilling scene from The Dead Zone.

 

[Samantha Rinne]

Trump supporters, and those who routinely defend him on RF: could you please list three or four things that you wouldn’t defend, minimize, or excuse, if Trump did those things?

It seems every time someone starts a thread criticizing Trump for X, a predictable group defends, downplays or changes the topic in some way. So I am curious what X would have to be in order to cross the line and no longer be worthy of defending.

Feel free to be as imaginative and outlandish as you please. After all, who could have predicted all the outlandish things Trump has done up to this point.

What if audio came out where Trump was mocking evangelical Christians in private?

What if he clearly loses the election, and refuses to accept the results?

Surely you can think of something ... you wouldn’t just reflexively defend *anything* he does no matter what ... right?

I want you to be on record before it happens, next time. Thanks.

Fair enough. If Trump supports mandatory vaccination, banging on people's doors to enforce this. Ditto for chipping/barcodes or any other transhumanism bull****. If Trump starts passing crazy laws that massively infringe the rights of native citizens. If Trump supports a plan to appease liberals that raises taxes to the point where they make life hard for regular citizens to hold their property. If Trump supports the violence of BLM or Antifa, I don't support him.

In other words, at any point where Trump betrays his base and acts like a liberal, I do not support him.

I also do not support him any time he supports Fauci. That man is a liar and a thief of our civil rights. He should have been booted months ago. We don't need a vaccine, we should ease up on masks and ****ty antisocial behavior. And I'm not strongly for handouts for relief, but people do need it now. What we need more is to get back to work though, which means cutting regulations.

You mean like this?

Having him mock conservatives would not phase me. I personally do not care how he feels about me. I didn't vote for him to be liked. I didn't even vote for him (something liberals fail to understand). I voted against Hillary.

If he fails to accept the election results, btw, I would support him fully. I'm convinced the reason for all these mail-in ballots is not to avoid contamination, but so there will be plenty of time to toss ballots. Also, I think they stole half of his actual presidency on stupid hearings. I'd like to see him get a half-term added in to make the presidency 2022 instead. Trump 2022!

Neither will I blink if he writes a mean tweet or some covfefe somewhere. That's your hangup, not mine.

New If Trump stomped on a kitten, they'd call it a gay atheist socialist as they licked its blood from Trump's boots.

I definitely would be upset if he stomped on a kitten.
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Now your turn! If Biden were caught saying something very off-color like "Those poor saps, I'm going to make it illegal for them to own houses or cellphones or cars. I'm gonna tax them so much they won't be able to afford any of that. And then I'll come into their houses and kill them, and then we're gonna mess their women and sniff them." Would this bring a halt to Biden support? (And yeah, Biden seems to like sniffing women)

 

[Mindmaster]

Trump supporters, and those who routinely defend him on RF: could you please list three or four things that you wouldn’t defend, minimize, or excuse, if Trump did those things?

This is literally projecting a leftist behavior on to someone more centrist or further right, but I digress you'll never understand what people vote for Trump for because it's too easy. Meanwhile, I see the complete irony as I feel leftists are completely incompatible with voting for someone on any reason but their feelings.

My feelings don't factor into my voting decisions the only thing that does is whether I am in a better place than I was, and that I see that other people are too. If that's the case then I know who am voting for. Trump can say or do something the left considers mean (which at this point is literally anything he does, and they're obviously over-sensitive and ridiculous about it) and I absolutely don't care at all because it's irrelevant to me. I don't have to like the guy as a person to like what he does when he's sitting in the Presidents seat. I'm not a child and people who serve me don't have to appease my personal values, just try to give me what I asked them to do.

People who expect everyone to cater to their hyper-sensitive natures are ridiculous, and the problem is with them not Donald J. Trump. Trump has the right to be who he is and no one here including me has the right to judge that. His self-expression is his right just as it is with any of you. I don't have to like it and it's got nothing to do with his job. If he's doing his job, but someone pisses him off I don't care if he weaves a tapestry of profanity and dumps it on the target of his ire. (probably a deserving one, from what I've seen... lol) It's got nothing to do with anything... This is why I don't see eye to eye with the left... The left is like what I used to experience when I was a teenager... People gossiping and spreading rumors all day and having a freak out over some spicy conversation. This is adult-aged child thinking, not adult. I'm having nothing to do with that...

 

[Father Heathen]

This is literally projecting a leftist behavior on to someone more centrist or further right, but I digress you'll never understand what people vote for Trump for because it's too easy. Meanwhile, I see the complete irony as I feel leftists are completely incompatible with voting for someone on any reason but their feelings.

My feelings don't factor into my voting decisions the only thing that does is whether I am in a better place than I was, and that I see that other people are too. If that's the case then I know who am voting for. Trump can say or do something the left considers mean (which at this point is literally anything he does, and they're obviously over-sensitive and ridiculous about it) and I absolutely don't care at all because it's irrelevant to me. I don't have to like the guy as a person to like what he does when he's sitting in the Presidents seat. I'm not a child and people who serve me don't have to appease my personal values, just try to give me what I asked them to do.

People who expect everyone to cater to their hyper-sensitive natures are ridiculous, and the problem is with them not Donald J. Trump. Trump has the right to be who he is and no one here including me has the right to judge that. His self-expression is his right just as it is with any of you. I don't have to like it and it's got nothing to do with his job. If he's doing his job, but someone pisses him off I don't care if he weaves a tapestry of profanity and dumps it on the target of his ire. (probably a deserving one, from what I've seen... lol) It's got nothing to do with anything... This is why I don't see eye to eye with the left... The left is like what I used to experience when I was a teenager... People gossiping and spreading rumors all day and having a freak out over some spicy conversation. This is adult-aged child thinking, not adult. I'm having nothing to do with that...

This post is rather adorable when you consider that most of Trump's supporters treat him like an infallible godking beyond reproach, merely because he paid lip service to their mawkish religious and "patriotic" sentiments and mewling paranoia. Most reject critical thought and science in favor of superstition and convoluted conspiracy theories.
Don't look down your nose when your chin is at boot level.

Could we get some serious responses?

 

[Mr Spinkles]

This is literally projecting a leftist behavior on to someone more centrist or further right, but I digress you'll never understand what people vote for Trump for because it's too easy. Meanwhile, I see the complete irony as I feel leftists are completely incompatible with voting for someone on any reason but their feelings.

My feelings don't factor into my voting decisions the only thing that does is whether I am in a better place than I was, and that I see that other people are too. If that's the case then I know who am voting for. Trump can say or do something the left considers mean (which at this point is literally anything he does, and they're obviously over-sensitive and ridiculous about it) and I absolutely don't care at all because it's irrelevant to me. I don't have to like the guy as a person to like what he does when he's sitting in the Presidents seat. I'm not a child and people who serve me don't have to appease my personal values, just try to give me what I asked them to do.

People who expect everyone to cater to their hyper-sensitive natures are ridiculous, and the problem is with them not Donald J. Trump. Trump has the right to be who he is and no one here including me has the right to judge that. His self-expression is his right just as it is with any of you. I don't have to like it and it's got nothing to do with his job. If he's doing his job, but someone pisses him off I don't care if he weaves a tapestry of profanity and dumps it on the target of his ire. (probably a deserving one, from what I've seen... lol) It's got nothing to do with anything... This is why I don't see eye to eye with the left... The left is like what I used to experience when I was a teenager... People gossiping and spreading rumors all day and having a freak out over some spicy conversation. This is adult-aged child thinking, not adult. I'm having nothing to do with that...

Wow you completely missed the point of why I oppose Trump. Maybe this can be a teachable moment.

I don’t oppose Trump because he writes mean Tweets that hurt my feelings. I could care less about that.

I oppose him because he is totally unfit to hold high office. I would not trust him to work as an intern for me, much less as President of the US. This unfitness has (1) caused real harm to real people, not just hurt feelings; (2) constantly threatens to cause even greater harm, though he has often been stymied by the opposition, his own party, and the “adults in the room”; (3) erodes our country’s democracy for his own personal benefit.

Just to cite one example: the President pardoned a guy who was convicted of lying to the FBI, during an FBI investigation into that same President. Mitt Romney called this “unprecedented corruption”. I could cite many more examples, but you get the idea. This is not a debate about whether taxes should be higher or lower, or we should let in more or fewer immigrants. Reasonable minds can debate those issues - and may the side with the most votes, win. But this is different. This ought to transcend political differences. This type of corrupt behavior, cheating, abuse of power ... whether Republican or Democrat .. ought to be disqualifying.

Would you support any demagogue as long as you feel better off? This is precisely how fascism starts.

His stupid Tweets are just the most public, visible symptom of his incurable ignorance and the danger it poses. Rest assured, he is the same idiot in private, when consulting with his advisors. We know this. Because Rex Tillerson, Gen. Mattis, Gen. McMaster, Gen. Kelly, John Bolton and many others have warned us.

So where is the line for you? Did you answer the question in the OP?

 

[Watchmen]

I wouldn’t forgive him if he promoted the Green New Deal.

I wouldn’t support him if he nominated a Supreme Court Justice who believed in using his/her position to create social policy rather than applying Constitutional principles.

I wouldn’t support him if he added unnecessary regulations and costly red tape.

 

[Cooky]

Wow you completely missed the point of why I oppose Trump. Maybe this can be a teachable moment.

I don’t oppose Trump because he writes mean Tweets that hurt my feelings. I could care less about that.

I oppose him because he is totally unfit to hold high office. I would not trust him to work as an intern for me, much less as President of the US. This unfitness has (1) caused real harm to real people, not just hurt feelings; (2) constantly threatens to cause even greater harm, though he has often been stymied by the opposition, his own party, and the “adults in the room”; (3) erodes our country’s democracy for his own personal benefit.

Just to cite one example: the President pardoned a guy who was convicted of lying to the FBI, during an FBI investigation into that same President. Mitt Romney called this “unprecedented corruption”. I could cite many more examples, but you get the idea. This is not a debate about whether taxes should be higher or lower, or we should let in more or fewer immigrants. Reasonable minds can debate those issues - and may the side with the most votes, win. But this is different. This ought to transcend political differences. This type of corrupt behavior, cheating, abuse of power ... whether Republican or Democrat .. ought to be disqualifying.

Would you support any demagogue as long as you feel better off? This is precisely how fascism starts.

His stupid Tweets are just the most public, visible symptom of his incurable ignorance and the danger it poses. Rest assured, he is the same idiot in private, when consulting with his advisors. We know this. Because Rex Tillerson, Gen. Mattis, Gen. McMaster, Gen. Kelly, John Bolton and many others have warned us.

So where is the line for you? Did you answer the question in the OP?

Trump is the medium, set into place as the new republican party begins... The neo-cons have been terminated for selling the U.S. out to their special interests / globalist ideologies. The democrats are also sell-outs -just like the neo-cons.

...So what Trump could do, that would make me turn against him is to sell out the American people by somehow benefitting non-Americans over Americans.

So there's the blueprint for your project... If you can prove that he has done that, then you will succeed in your mission.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

This is literally projecting a leftist behavior on to someone more centrist or further right, but I digress you'll never understand what people vote for Trump for because it's too easy. Meanwhile, I see the complete irony as I feel leftists are completely incompatible with voting for someone on any reason but their feelings.

My feelings don't factor into my voting decisions the only thing that does is whether I am in a better place than I was, and that I see that other people are too. If that's the case then I know who am voting for. Trump can say or do something the left considers mean (which at this point is literally anything he does, and they're obviously over-sensitive and ridiculous about it) and I absolutely don't care at all because it's irrelevant to me. I don't have to like the guy as a person to like what he does when he's sitting in the Presidents seat. I'm not a child and people who serve me don't have to appease my personal values, just try to give me what I asked them to do.

People who expect everyone to cater to their hyper-sensitive natures are ridiculous, and the problem is with them not Donald J. Trump. Trump has the right to be who he is and no one here including me has the right to judge that. His self-expression is his right just as it is with any of you. I don't have to like it and it's got nothing to do with his job. If he's doing his job, but someone pisses him off I don't care if he weaves a tapestry of profanity and dumps it on the target of his ire. (probably a deserving one, from what I've seen... lol) It's got nothing to do with anything... This is why I don't see eye to eye with the left... The left is like what I used to experience when I was a teenager... People gossiping and spreading rumors all day and having a freak out over some spicy conversation. This is adult-aged child thinking, not adult. I'm having nothing to do with that...

By the way, in your post about how you don’t use feelings to make these judgments, you seem to have neglected the logical consequences if candidates like Donald Trump become acceptable.

Consider the following logic:

1. IF you support candidates like Donald Trump because they support your agenda ...

2. ... THEN Democrats might do the same ...

3. ... THEN you might feel differently about a President who says he can pardon himself, who won’t accept the result of an election, who bashes “Republican-run” cities and won’t condemn Antifa. Etc. etc.

Cheating, bullying, constant lying, abuse of power and hitting below the belt might not seem like such a good idea if that happens. I hope it doesn’t. This election is our chance to put Country before Party and say there are some things even more important than a friggin’ tax cut!!

 

[Mr Spinkles]

I wouldn’t forgive him if he promoted the Green New Deal.

I wouldn’t support him if he nominated a Supreme Court Justice who believed in using his/her position to create social policy rather than applying Constitutional principles.

I wouldn’t support him if he added unnecessary regulations and costly red tape.

Is there anything he could do in service of your political agenda, or his re-election, that you would view as unacceptable?

Thanks.

 

[Watchmen]

Is there anything he could do in service of your political agenda, or his re-election, that you would view as unacceptable?

Thanks.

I’m sorry. Not sure what you mean.

 

[Cooky]

This post is rather adorable when you consider that most of Trump's supporters treat him like an infallible godking beyond reproach, merely because he paid lip service to their mawkish religious and "patriotic" sentiments and mewling paranoia. Most reject critical thought and science in favor of superstition and convoluted conspiracy theories.
Don't look down your nose when your chin is at boot level.

Could we get some serious responses?

Trump marks a turning point in right wing politics. It's progress, along with a lot of mistakes, granted... But ultimately, we're looking for whatever good we can find out of this, and apply it to the future.

We're long-term thinkers. We test and make plans, as opposed to flying by the seat of our pants like much of the left.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

Fair enough. If Trump supports mandatory vaccination, banging on people's doors to enforce this. Ditto for chipping/barcodes or any other transhumanism bull****. If Trump starts passing crazy laws that massively infringe the rights of native citizens. If Trump supports a plan to appease liberals that raises taxes to the point where they make life hard for regular citizens to hold their property. If Trump supports the violence of BLM or Antifa, I don't support him.

In other words, at any point where Trump betrays his base and acts like a liberal, I do not support him.

I also do not support him any time he supports Fauci. That man is a liar and a thief of our civil rights. He should have been booted months ago. We don't need a vaccine, we should ease up on masks and ****ty antisocial behavior. And I'm not strongly for handouts for relief, but people do need it now. What we need more is to get back to work though, which means cutting regulations.

You mean like this?

Having him mock conservatives would not phase me. I personally do not care how he feels about me. I didn't vote for him to be liked. I didn't even vote for him (something liberals fail to understand). I voted against Hillary.

If he fails to accept the election results, btw, I would support him fully. I'm convinced the reason for all these mail-in ballots is not to avoid contamination, but so there will be plenty of time to toss ballots. Also, I think they stole half of his actual presidency on stupid hearings. I'd like to see him get a half-term added in to make the presidency 2022 instead. Trump 2022!

Neither will I blink if he writes a mean tweet or some covfefe somewhere. That's your hangup, not mine.



I definitely would be upset if he stomped on a kitten.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now your turn! If Biden were caught saying something very off-color like "Those poor saps, I'm going to make it illegal for them to own houses or cellphones or cars. I'm gonna tax them so much they won't be able to afford any of that. And then I'll come into their houses and kill them, and then we're gonna mess their women and sniff them." Would this bring a halt to Biden support? (And yeah, Biden seems to like sniffing women)

Thank you, this provided insights into your views. They are kind of frightening ... but thanks.

To answer your question ... yes if Biden said something like that I would not be inclined to defend it ... obviously.

Is there anything Trump could do in service of your agenda that you would not support? Is there such a thing as “abuse of power” or “eroding our democracy” in your view even if those things are done to advance your conservative views?

This is the difference between someone who truly puts “America First” vs. someone who is just a blackshirt.

 

[Lyndon]

Seems a lot of people like Trumps brand of fascism, maybe they should be out buying brown shirts!!

 

[Mr Spinkles]

I’m sorry. Not sure what you mean.

Okay. Suppose Trump promised the PM of Israel increased military aid if he publicly criticized Joe Biden. Would that be appropriate?

In my view, this would be an abuse of power because it’s a conflict of interests: US military aid is supposed to be used in service of the United States’ national security. Not in the service of one candidate to politically get an advantage over his rivals. We also should always try to keep foreign countries out of our elections as a matter of national democratic integrity.

But, I tend to put America First rather than my own narrow political agenda. Not everyone does that.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

I’m sorry. Not sure what you mean.

By the way, I had a really hard time thinking of an example of an abuse of power that Trump has not already committed.

 

[Watchmen]

Okay. Suppose Trump promised the PM of Israel increased military aid if he publicly criticized Joe Biden. Would that be appropriate?

In my view, this would be an abuse of power because it’s a conflict of interests: US military aid is supposed to be used in service of the United States’ national security. Not in the service of one candidate to politically get an advantage over his rivals.

But, I tend to put America First rather than my own narrow political agenda.

To answer your specific hypothetical, no, it probably wouldn’t be appropriate. Would that particular hypothetical cause me to withdraw my support of Trump? Probably not.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

Trump marks a turning point in right wing politics. It's progress, along with a lot of mistakes, granted... But ultimately, we're looking for whatever good we can find out of this, and apply it to the future.

We're long-term thinkers. We test and make plans, as opposed to flying by the seat of our pants like much of the left.

I see you dodged the question of the OP. Do you care to answer it or should I just assume the worst?

 

[Mr Spinkles]

To answer your specific hypothetical, no, it probably wouldn’t be appropriate. Would that particular hypothetical cause me to withdraw my support of Trump? Probably not.

Thanks. Hypothetically, would it be appropriate if Trump pardoned someone who was convicted of obstructing an FBI investigation into the President?

This is the type of thing I am talking about. I am not asking if Trump supported liberal policies like the Green New Deal, would you support him. I am asking what could Trump do in service of your agenda that would cross the line?

I have asked for 3-4 examples. With my help, I consider that you have provided 1 example so far.