Holy has its own meaning in English and its Indo-European roots. It doesn't need to be defined by a completely unrelated language.
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Unholy Places
- Thread starter Rival
- Start date
Ebionite
Well-Known Member
The English meaning of holy is consistent with sanctity through association with the divine.
English and Hebrew have some commonalities, eg English ash relates to Hebrew esh, meaning fire.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Rival, when you say unholy, do you mean mundane places? Or are you talking about cursed places or evil places?
You mean like churches?
However you define it.
That's just taken out of context so you could take a shot a religion.
You're better than this.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Then I will respond to both.
Holy means to set aside for God's purposes. Thus, for me, the Shabbat is holy. The other six days of the week are not holy, mundane if you like. In the same way, we can set aside certain places for God, making them holy, such as a church or temple or synagogue. For some people, an incredible place in nature can be so extraordinary that they set it aside. And of course, other places would be ordinary, mundane.
I do not believe in curses. But I do believe that evil actions are more common in some places than others, that you will find more harm on skid row than Joe's farm. You can say that places where evil accrues are evil. Some are quite obvious -- the shipping container that confines women being trafficked into prostitution would be something obvious. Other things are less obvious, because the toxicity is subtle. Places where humans are overcrowded have a toxic effect on us--I avoid cities with their crime and decay and people crammed together like bees in a hive. Some places suck your life from you, such as a casino. I avoid bars, because of the problems with drunk people making fools of themselves and predators looking to hook up. I just make the conscious decision to only go places that I know will build me up.
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
I consider libraries a sacred place, so I suppose that makes things that destroy amd censor and limit books and information to be unholy.
It's how i feel, churches do get their income, often from people who make claims but act differently once sunday worship is over or in the case of the church i went to, act against 'gods" laws while in church. 'tiz the reason i left the church and religion behind me.
But if you feel i should delete the post please let me know
I get it, but you're so far off topic, you can't even see the topic.
Heyo
Veteran Member
I'm not sure about holy/unholy places, too ambiguous. But sacred is something different though related. Places like churches get officially consecrated and, when a church is no longer used as such, it officially gets desecrated.
Like the church where I was over the WE which became a community centre. We had a spring gala there and just to be sure and if the pastor did a lacklustre job, we made sure it was desecrated,
So, if there is a parallel to unholy places, they would have to have been holy first. Just like with undeads, a place can only be made unholy from a holy place. Does that make sense to you?
Viker
Your beloved eccentric Auntie Cristal
Some would say that where I live, because of me, and that wherever my coven meets are unholy. It's really a matter of perspective, although.
Viker
Your beloved eccentric Auntie Cristal
Definitely a candidate for holiness in my book. The library in New Albany was a sanctuary and like a temple for me when I was younger.
dybmh
ויהי מבדיל בין מים למים
@metis, I think, was referring to an older definition. Yes, the opposite is mundane, ordinary. No, unholy is not the same as mundane. The 'un' prefix here, I think, is an exception. Not exactly the opposite, in this case.
Kadosh = holy, literally, set-apart = special
That is pious, related to chesed, which is kindness, giving. The pious are always giving of themselves in service of God and neighbor, for example. They go above and beyond. It's the action of going, active, reaching out, that makes them a Chasid. Not really set apart.
dybmh
ויהי מבדיל בין מים למים
My toilet is unholy?
1:05
Would you drink from your toilet? Please be honest?
In general, your excrement is unholy. It is a conglomerate of the non-digestable components of your food that have been seperated by your body from the components which provide for you. They are generally the 'husks' of the food you eat. The outer shell. This outer shell is an old defintion for unholy. It seperates, and sets apart, but in a way which is different than holiness.
So, there's a seperation that produces holiness, and there's seperation that produces unholiness.
Would what's holy or unholy be dependent on human outlook, then? My cats sometimes drink from the stool. And flies find excrement delightful.
Or would that make animals unholy?
(I ask genuinely.)
I won't drink from my tap.
Interesting.
In Hinduism, we have sattvic foods and tamasic foods derived from Ayurveda, an ancient Indian medical system. Sattvic foods promote energy, calmness, and a clarity of mind, while tamasic foods promote laziness, lethargy, and apathy. Sattvic foods include things like certain vegetables and fruits, nuts, grains, beverages like water, tea, or juice, and dairy. Tamasic foods include meats, processed and fried foods, sugary foods, beverage like alcohol and soft drinks, and refined grains.
I'm not sure if this would equate to what is considered "holy" or "unholy." I suppose sattvic foods could be considered holy, while tamasic foods could be considered unholy.
I suppose in Hinduism, we're more concerned with what goes in our bodies than what comes out.
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
Try telling that to the Chasidim.
dybmh
ויהי מבדיל בין מים למים
I think they're great questions! I would take them seriously regardless of who is asking.
First, hopefully you noticed I was speaking generally about the "unholy". In particular, it's a case by case evaluation, and holy/mundane/unholy is a spiritual quality so, a person is looking for signs to indicate what it is. That's why I said "generally your excrement is unholy".
Regarding animals, insects, humans, plants, rocks, whomever, whatever, unholiness is not transferred in that way. A person doesn't become unholy, if they are in a situation where they need to consume something.. rotting, decomposing. There's stories of captured soldiers being tortured and being fed a "bitter meal". Not sure if the stories are true, but, this in no way makes the soldier unholy. The pet consuming its own feces does not make it unholy. The dog drinking from the toilet, the flies in the garbage... doesn't change them that way.
In general, animals, plants, insects are less sensitive than humans in a lot of ways. They are canabalistic, they have no qualms killing brutally. Plants will mercilessly take over a yard killing the other plants, and knock down a house by invading the foundation, etc. But they are also less sensitive to ecoli, and salmonella, and other harmful "stuff" than humans. So this insensitivity is not a flaw. It just is. And this doesn't in any way detract from their positive qualities. I love animals and plants. In a way, I think they are capable of love as well. I even love insects. I have an affinity for ants and ticks, believe it or not.
One of the ways they are insensitive is they are lacking an aversion to things that are unholy. Again, in general. This, imo, is by design. They are part of the cycle of life. When a fly is feeding off excrement, it is further seperating and sifting out the 'husks' 'shells' 'peels' of unholiness from the 'leavings'. In this way, true, the 'leavings' are not completely unholy when they 'leave' the human body. There is still something nutritious there which can be sifted further from the 'dross'. They are able to sift it and sort it further than a human as a result of their insensitivity. They are like nature's refineries.
And this is why it appears as if unholiness is relative. The vast majority, almost everything that exists is a mixture of holy/unholy. Again, it gets complicated. It's not that the excrement is unholy for us and not unholy for the animals, plants, insects, rocks, etc... it's that excrement is still a mixture of holy/unholy when it leaves the body, but it is much-much more unholy than holy. And the animals, plants, insects, rocks, etc are not naturally disinclined towards that high concentration so that they can fulfiill their function in the cycle of life.
dybmh
ויהי מבדיל בין מים למים
The largest Jewish out-reach orrganization in the world is Chasidic. Anyway, I think it's clear, you had the correct concept "holy = set apart", you just remembered the wrong Hebrew word. It's not Chasid, it's Kadosh. And the methods the Chasid uses are cultivating humility not their own "holiness". They self-nullify.
out-reach. Chasidic Judaism comes from the Baal Shem Tov. The innovation which was brought is devekut, cleaving to God. Again. out-reach.
Clinging is the opposite of set-apart. It's energetically very different.
Devekut - Wikipedia
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