Unitarian vs. Unitarian Universalism

[nutshell]

What's the difference between the two?

 

[lilithu]

What's the difference between the two?

Hi nutshell.

Unitarian = non-trinitarian Christian.

Unitarian Universalism is the result of a merger between American Unitarianism and American Universalism. While it has its roots in Christianity, UU is not Christian. (To elaborate on that would probably require an essay.)

Because UU comes partly from Unitarianism we share many similarities and some UUs have maintained connections with Unitarian congregations in Europe.

 

[lunamoth]

I'm a TU.

 

[lilithu]

I'm a TU.

A trinitarian unitarian or a trinitarian universalist? lol!

 

[lunamoth]

A trinitarian unitarian or a trinitarian universalist? lol!

I think only a trinitarian universalist makes sense...but I could consider the other a koan. Heck the Trinity is a koan to begin with!

 

[Katzpur]

I think only a trinitarian universalist makes sense...but I could consider the other a koan. Heck the Trinity is a koan to begin with!

You lost me...

 

[lunamoth]

You lost me...

Sorry...just kind of joking around a bit. I said I was TU because I am a Trinitarian and also a Universalist, or at least something close to Universalism.

I said that the Trinity is a koan...you go beyond logic to get to the meaning...if you try to focus on the literal interpretation you can't. Like the sound of one hand clapping.

A kō·an (公案; Japanese: kōan, Chinese: gōng-àn) is a story, dialogue, question, or statement in the history and lore of Chan (Zen) Buddhism, generally containing aspects that are inaccessible to rational understanding, yet that may be accessible to intuition. A famous koan is, "Two hands clap and there is a sound; what is the sound of one hand?" (oral tradition, attributed to Hakuin Ekaku, 1686-1769, considered a reviver of the koan tradition in Japan).

 

[lilithu]

I think only a trinitarian universalist makes sense...but I could consider the other a koan. Heck the Trinity is a koan to begin with!

Yeah, that's what I was thinking, both.

The thing is, for me the word unitarian doesn't just mean non-trinitarian. It means humanist. Because that's the theme that has run through Unitarian history, from the Transcendentalists to the influx of atheists to the influx of pagans.

Thomas Starr-King, a Unitarian (who used to have a statue in statuary hall in Congress until the California legislature decided to replace him with Ronald Reagan) put it this way:
Universalists believe that everyone is going to heaven because God is too good to condemn anyone.
Unitarians believe that everyone is going to heaven because we are too good for God to condemn anyone.

It's a joke but that's the gist of the difference between Unitarians and Universalists. And what I love about that dichotomy is that we still end up in the same place. To me, Unitarian Universalism holds those two seemingly conflicting views together and says that they are really one and the same.

 

[lunamoth]

Yeah, that's what I was thinking, both.

The thing is, for me the word unitarian doesn't just mean non-trinitarian. It means humanist. Because that's the theme that has run through Unitarian history, from the Transcendentalists to the influx of atheists to the influx of pagans.

Thomas Starr-King, a Unitarian (who used to have a statue in statuary hall in Congress until the California legislature decided to replace him with Ronald Reagan) put it this way:
Universalists believe that everyone is going to heaven because God is too good to condemn anyone.
Unitarians believe that everyone is going to heaven because we are too good for God to anyone.

It's a joke but that's the gist of the difference between Unitarians and Universalists. And what I love about that dichotomy is that we still end up in the same place. To me, Unitarian Universalism holds those two seemingly conflicting views together and says that they are really one and the same.

I'm OK with being a humanist-theist too.

 

[lunamoth]

Lol...once you accept that an electron has the properties of a particle and a wave, holding two ideas like this at the same time don't really pose a problem.

Universalists believe that everyone is going to heaven because God is too good to condemn anyone.
Unitarians believe that everyone is going to heaven because we are too good for God to anyone.

 

[Katzpur]

Lol...once you accept that an electron has the properties of a particle and a wave, holding two ideas like this at the same time don't really pose a problem.

Maybe that's my problem!!!! See, electrons and particles and waves are over my head. Obviously I am never going to catch on to anything more complicated than that!

 

[lunamoth]

Maybe that's my problem!!!! See, electrons and particles and waves are over my head. Obviously I am never going to catch on to anything more complicated than that!

Oh Katz, that was a (dweeby) joke too! Well, kind of...electrons really do have the properties of partical and a wave...but I'm using it as a metaphor for a truth that seems to contradict reason...yet it still has meaning, it represents the experience, and it relates something that is true. In Christianity we call it Mystery.

I'd better start using those annoying winky smilies or something when I'm being light in my replies.

 

[lilithu]

Lol...once you accept that an electron has the properties of a particle and a wave, holding two ideas like this at the same time don't really pose a problem.

Yup. Supposedly one of the things that many UUs (and I suppose TUs too) have in common is that we are comfortable with uncertainty and paradox

humanist - theist
immanent - transcendant
inherent worth - universal grace

particle - wave



Oh here's another pair that I love:
love the world as it is - love the world as it should be

 

[lunamoth]

Yup. Supposedly one of the things that many UUs (and I suppose TUs too) have in common is that we are comfortable with uncertainty and paradox

Oh my goodness Lilithu, I wrote a sentence almost identical to that in my reply to Katz but then took it out...

humanist - theist
immanent - transcendant
inherent worth - universal grace

particle - wave



Oh here's another pair that I love:
love the world as it is - love the world as it should be

Nice.

The System *curse you System* will not let me frubal you again right now. :sorry1:

 

[Kay]

I'm a TU.

I'm a PU.

 

[lunamoth]

I'm a PU.

ROFL!

Haha, Maybe then I'm a PUT! (or would that but TUP?)

 

[Kay]

Hmmm. I must be very dense this evening, cause I just can't figure it out. PUT? :sorry1:

 

[Kay]

Heh. By PU, I meant Pluraltarian Universalist. I googled pluraltarian cause I figured SOMEONE had to have used it sometime, but nope. I created a new word.

 

[lunamoth]

Hmmm. I must be very dense this evening, cause I just can't figure it out. PUT? :sorry1:

Oh sorry. It's not you it's me! I've seen you refer to yourself as a panentheist ...that's what I thought the P was for. That's what I was using the P for.

U, universalist, T, Trinitarian

 

[lunamoth]

Heh. By PU, I meant Pluraltarian Universalist. I googled pluraltarian cause I figured SOMEONE had to have used it sometime, but nope. I created a new word.

Is that the same as Pluralist?