UU Identity (and who in the Spirit of Life's name am I?)

[Gaura Priya]

Before I pop my question, I reckon that I should introduce myself. You can skip the italics as you like!

On this forum and in my public life, I used to be an avid Vaishnavite and part of my local Vaishnavite Hindu community. And although I have been only part of that movement for about four-five years, it has shaped my theology long from my Catholic past (with the Baha'i Faith and studies of various religious Scriptures in between).

However, things began to change as I myself began my transition as a transsexual woman last year. Although I had legalised my name according to my religious community, I quickly lost faith. I reasoned, how can I support a religious community that can not even allow same-sex marriage, when it has been part of our Canadian identity for about ten years now?

I ended up re-exploring Christianity, practicing Christian meditation and devotional reading at home, from reading the Book of Mormon to practicing Centering Prayer and Lectio Divina. An eclectic Christian, no doubt!

Of course, having received an agnostic-deistic-atheistic-Islamically-converted boyfriend, it forced me to restructure my way of thinking and theology, and even a liberal Christian denomination could no longer suffice me.

I have attended the Unitarian congregations in my locality sparsely throughout my life, as early as my late teenagehood as an exploration from my grade 12 English Literature teacher, who was a Unitarian.

I have had many good memories at one point in time, when I used to attend frequently at the church, and also some disappointing ones (especially one who I felt was insensitive to my lower socio-economic class at present and upbringing). However, especially with the advent of my somewhat anti-religionist boyfriend, I have decided to come back to the local Unitarian congregation.

Although there is a lack of young adults in the church (one is now in a position of administration with the UU Youth and Young Adults in Canada and I will see her once in a blue moon), I have decided that the only way that I can foster relationships is through complete participation and loyalty to the identity.

Both my place and my boyfriend's have chalices of which we light together and I alone as an expression of this liberal faith tradition.

However, from online and from complete assumption through the congregations, there is a struggle of what it means to be a Unitarian. What makes a Unitarian Universalist identity? What makes it a religious tradition to be passed down, and not a refuge of religious exiles?

I would always get jealous of how Unitarian Universalism seems more alive in the States than it will ever be in Canada... still, no congregation is perfect!

Blessings from Canada!

 

[Gaura Priya]

And a song! XD

[youtube]KiypaURysz4[/youtube]
Peter Mayer "Holy Now" (with lyrics in captions) - YouTube

 

[Storm]

GP, I'm much too groggy to give the answer you deserve right now, but I wanted to let you know you're not alone. Many blessings!

 

[Gaura Priya]

GP, I'm much too groggy to give the answer you deserve right now, but I wanted to let you know you're not alone. Many blessings!

What was the event? Celebrating Canada Day with us too?

 

[Storm]

No event, just a good night's sleep.

Anyway, the short answer to your question is "attitude."

 

[SageTree]

Have you found a UU congregation, my Friend?

There are 6 UU houses of worship in the lower mainland to my knowledge.
Some might be meetings and not a proper church.

Just curious how it's going?

The UUs helped me grow a lot.
Hope you're having success.

:namaste

 

[Gaura Priya]

Have you found a UU congregation, my Friend?

There are 6 UU houses of worship in the lower mainland to my knowledge.
Some might be meetings and not a proper church.

Just curious how it's going?

The UUs helped me grow a lot.
Hope you're having success.

:namaste

There's four, as far as I know. Here, there is the North Shore Unitarian Church in West Vancouver, the Unitarian Church of Vancouver, Beacon Unitarian Church in New Westminster, and the Unitarian Congregation of the Fraser Valley.

The first two have buildings, and the last two are renting space. I have been to the last three in my lifetime, and both my dating companion and I have decided that the Unitarian Church of Vancouver will be our place of interest.

My first service was when I was a teenager at the Fraser Valley congregation. They are renting the gym in the Surrey Senior's Centre, and I remember enjoying the service.

I will never get used to holding hands and singing "Carrying the Flame" though. It's too hard not to snicker...

 

[SageTree]

There's four, as far as I know. Here, there is the North Shore Unitarian Church in West Vancouver, the Unitarian Church of Vancouver, Beacon Unitarian Church in New Westminster, and the Unitarian Congregation of the Fraser Valley.

The first two have buildings, and the last two are renting space. I have been to the last three in my lifetime, and both my dating companion and I have decided that the Unitarian Church of Vancouver will be our place of interest.

My first service was when I was a teenager at the Fraser Valley congregation. They are renting the gym in the Surrey Senior's Centre, and I remember enjoying the service.

I will never get used to holding hands and singing "Carrying the Flame" though. It's too hard not to snicker...

Excellent you have options. I wasn't sure there were that many around.
I just knew that the one of 49th and Oak was the closest to me
Where I did attend intermittently while living there on 49th and Kerr.

So I hope that you continue to enjoy it there.

LoLz @ LoLzing @ Carry the Flame!



:namaste

 

[lilithu]

I will never get used to holding hands and singing "Carrying the Flame" though. It's too hard not to snicker...

Have no idea what this song is but ...

However, from online and from complete assumption through the congregations, there is a struggle of what it means to be a Unitarian. What makes a Unitarian Universalist identity? What makes it a religious tradition to be passed down, and not a refuge of religious exiles?

Always a risk to answer questions like this because no matter what one says there will always be some UUs who disagree. But if we never tackle these questions, we will always be wondering. Better to articulate. In my opinion, the hear of UUism, the thing that binds us all together, whether theist or atheist, Hindu or Christian or Pagan or secularist, is that all UUs are humanists. NOT 'Humanist' with a capital 'H' as there are quite a few UUs who believe in the Divine, myself included. But 'humanist' with a lowecase 'h,' which means that all UUs believe in human worth and agency. We measure whether something is "good" or "bad" morally by whether it harms humans (and other living beings), not by whether it's stated in a piece of scripture (of any kind). And we believe that it is up to humans to make the world a better place (rather than waiting for a deity to do it). Not all UUs call themselves humanists, but personally, I've yet to meet one that isn't one.

 

[Gaura Priya]

Have no idea what this song is but ...

"Carry the flame of peace and love, until we meet again!" x2

At the end of every service, all of the UU congregations here hold hands, and sing this song. It's cute... but a tad out of date. XD

Always a risk to answer questions like this because no matter what one says there will always be some UUs who disagree. But if we never tackle these questions, we will always be wondering. Better to articulate. In my opinion, the hear of UUism, the thing that binds us all together, whether theist or atheist, Hindu or Christian or Pagan or secularist, is that all UUs are humanists. NOT 'Humanist' with a capital 'H' as there are quite a few UUs who believe in the Divine, myself included. But 'humanist' with a lowecase 'h,' which means that all UUs believe in human worth and agency. We measure whether something is "good" or "bad" morally by whether it harms humans (and other living beings), not by whether it's stated in a piece of scripture (of any kind). And we believe that it is up to humans to make the world a better place (rather than waiting for a deity to do it). Not all UUs call themselves humanists, but personally, I've yet to meet one that isn't one.

That's true. Many, if not all, Unitarian Universalists have a sense of humanistic philosophy. I remember listening to a sermon online from Youtube with the minister describing Unitarian Universalism as radical agnosticism, or with a deeply agnostic theology. Humanist religion with a post-Protestant tradition and an agnostic theology.

I think the first principle of Unitarian Universalism, the inherent worth and dignity of every person, smacks of humanism, simply because it is an assertion that does not necessarily have physical proof.

I remember reading online on UUworld.org about a child who was born in the religion complain that there was nothing substantial enough that makes the Unitarian Universalist identity, and that the majority of its members are refugees from other religious traditions. I just thought it would be important to talk about how to articulate Unitarian Universalism in the home, among others who are not Unitarian Universalists, and among its own members.

 

[lilithu]

I think the first principle of Unitarian Universalism, the inherent worth and dignity of every person, smacks of humanism, simply because it is an assertion that does not necessarily have physical proof.

Bingo. :yes: To assert that every person has inherent worth and dignity is a faith statement. Out of our Seven Principles, only the first and seventh are faith statements. The other five describe ways of being with each other. That is why two thru six do not tend to get quoted as often. (Except when a UU feels they have been slighted - "You're not honoring my free and responsible search for truth and meaning!")

I remember reading online on UUworld.org about a child who was born in the religion complain that there was nothing substantial enough that makes the Unitarian Universalist identity, and that the majority of its members are refugees from other religious traditions. I just thought it would be important to talk about how to articulate Unitarian Universalism in the home, among others who are not Unitarian Universalists, and among its own members.

The fact that we are mostly converts, and most of us converts have been wounded by other faith traditions is the real issue. It's not that we don't have a theology - I think we do have one that is rooted in humanism - but such a large proportion of us are allergic to anything that smacks of "organized religion" that it's difficult to say anything coherent. Some of our wounded are able to heal themselves while within UUism but then get frustrated with our lack of spiritual depth and leave. I've seen so many leave once they are healed. On the one hand, that is a testament to UUism that we can provide that safe space for people to work out their hurts with regards to religion. Otoh, it tends to leave us perpetually at this reactionary, shallow level. I still have faith tho. We are only 50 years old. Maybe if we'd start to listen to some of the cradle UUs, we could get a stronger sense of identity.

 

[Gaura Priya]

Bingo. :yes: To assert that every person has inherent worth and dignity is a faith statement. Out of our Seven Principles, only the first and seventh are faith statements. The other five describe ways of being with each other. That is why two thru six do not tend to get quoted as often. (Except when a UU feels they have been slighted - "You're not honoring my free and responsible search for truth and meaning!")

But wouldn't the sacramentalisation of democracy (right of conscience and the democratic use) be also considered and assertion of political organisation over other forms? Also, the goal of world community with peace, liberty and justice for all is a very lofty goal, which a postmodernist may say otherwise of the impossibility of world community.

I suppose that many of these assertions in the Seven Principles which we revere to covenant amongst ourselves and each other can be seen in a utilitarian perspective rather than be immediately evidential.

The fact that we are mostly converts, and most of us converts have been wounded by other faith traditions is the real issue. It's not that we don't have a theology - I think we do have one that is rooted in humanism - but such a large proportion of us are allergic to anything that smacks of "organized religion" that it's difficult to say anything coherent. Some of our wounded are able to heal themselves while within UUism but then get frustrated with our lack of spiritual depth and leave. I've seen so many leave once they are healed. On the one hand, that is a testament to UUism that we can provide that safe space for people to work out their hurts with regards to religion. Otoh, it tends to leave us perpetually at this reactionary, shallow level. I still have faith tho. We are only 50 years old. Maybe if we'd start to listen to some of the cradle UUs, we could get a stronger sense of identity.

Which gets to me sometimes. I often talk to members just to see their personal view of what UUism IS... and usually they can only tell me what it IS NOT. I sometimes almost wonder if Unitarians are afraid of being passionate of their Faith Tradition.

Perhaps this 50 year old religion is too young still to adapt itself into a tradition that can have religious integrity. I remember watching about how to UUvangelise, and that most non-adherents do not want to know what UUism was, or is not... but what it can offer the world at large, the local community, and the individual as a liberal religious tradition.

A Bigger Boat

I believe that this religion has potential, and though the numbers are small, I want to claim this as my own, alongside my own personal belief system. And it makes it the more challenging personally as someone from an ethnic minority group and being a young adult in a sea of mainly older adults.

I suppose I should continue to attend and try to get involved with my local congregation. I only pray that I can muster to be more passionate about the movement.

 

[SageTree]

We are only 50 years old.

While I am REALLY enjoying the reading of you two talking I feel I have to add that the UUA.... the association is what is 50 years old. Unitarianism and Universalism are two very old ideas. I'd say they started looking like we know them around the time of the 'Transcendentalist' era of the mid 1800s. The two organizations almost joined at this point, but it took another 100 years until it actually happened.

Not stickling for no need here.

Knowing the history of a tradition, imo, is one of the strengthening agents to add to the awareness that this is a REAL tradition over the ages and not just a 50 year old movement.

Kindness and Love of UUism intended, Friends.

No... not THOSE Friends.... the UUs silly. LoL.

 

[Gaura Priya]

While I am REALLY enjoying the reading of you two talking I feel I have to add that the UUA.... the association is what is 50 years old. Unitarianism and Universalism are two very old ideas. I'd say they started looking like we know them around the time of the 'Transcendentalist' era of the mid 1800s. The two organizations almost joined at this point, but it took another 100 years until it actually happened.

Not stickling for no need here.

Knowing the history of a tradition, imo, is one of the strengthening agents to add to the awareness that this is a REAL tradition over the ages and not just a 50 year old movement.

Kindness and Love of UUism intended, Friends.

No... not THOSE Friends.... the UUs silly. LoL.

I understand that the Unitarian movement is quite old, and same with Universalism, especially in terms of doctrine (unitarianism and universalism, with a small u). I know for sure that the Unitarian religion has been continuing to change in doctrine and belief, from American transcendentalism as a subculture and influence, to staunch humanism by the 1900's.

However, the Principles and Sources, as well as Unitarian Universalist culture, as well as the ideas that we now articulate of at least a thousand years of development and refinement, is due to the merger in 1961. Unitarianism was still a very liberal Christian denomination, and I certainly feel that it has left its Christian roots since the merger and become a separate and evolving religion in itself.

When people ask me now if I am Christian, I say "No, I'm Unitarian / I practice Unitarian Universalism!" (with Hindu and Christian influences, of course). With the influx of Chinese, Indian and Filipino population in my locality, it would be difficult to articulate its beginnings with those of no experience with Christian denominationalism.

For those who ask and are immigrants, I usually tell them, "Unitarian Universalism (or the Unitarian religion) believes in all the religions, and trying to be a good person!"

I believe you are right too... I've toyed with the idea of keeping pictures of all the propagators of Unitarian Universalism of the distant past, such as Emerson, Channing, Hosea Ballou, and others. Without their bravery, without their courage to speak out of what is right and true, we wouldn't have our tradition today!

 

[SageTree]

It really sounds like you've made a deep connection. That is great.

 

[Gaura Priya]

It really sounds like you've made a deep connection. That is great.

Aww... thanks! ^-^;

I want to stop sounding academic and just absorb it!

Philip Hewitt's books are invaluable sources of Unitarian history and doctrine in a Canadian context, especially before the merger. If you've ever read his books, or ever intend to, I highly recommend them. And I love the fact that he still attends the Vancouver congregation!

 

[SageTree]

Aww... thanks! ^-^;

I want to stop sounding academic and just absorb it!

Philip Hewitt's books are invaluable sources of Unitarian history and doctrine in a Canadian context, especially before the merger. If you've ever read his books, or ever intend to, I highly recommend them. And I love the fact that he still attends the Vancouver congregation!

Sometimes it takes both to absorb it. The books are an emulsifier of sorts
So stuff can stick when you experience it.

I was mainly a UU in the US, so I'd be interested to know more about the history of Canadian UUism, because I'm SURE there are differences as what 'social justice' means here differs from the states on topics and extremes, from my participation in UUism here in Canada.

Thanks for the recommendation.


Blessings
SageTree

 

[lilithu]

But wouldn't the sacramentalisation of democracy (right of conscience and the democratic use) be also considered and assertion of political organisation over other forms? Also, the goal of world community with peace, liberty and justice for all is a very lofty goal, which a postmodernist may say otherwise of the impossibility of world community.

I suppose that many of these assertions in the Seven Principles which we revere to covenant amongst ourselves and each other can be seen in a utilitarian perspective rather than be immediately evidential.

Whether or not our promise to respect both the democratic process and the right of individual conscience is sacramental, it's still only about the way we promise to be with each other. It's not a claim on the nature of reality the way that our assertion that every person has inherent worth is. In fact, I would argue that the second thru sixth principles naturally follow from the first and seventh. If you believe in the inherent worth of each person then you will believe that they should have the right to make decisions for themselves, etc.

I believe that this religion has potential, and though the numbers are small, I want to claim this as my own, alongside my own personal belief system. And it makes it the more challenging personally as someone from an ethnic minority group and being a young adult in a sea of mainly older adults.

I suppose I should continue to attend and try to get involved with my local congregation. I only pray that I can muster to be more passionate about the movement.

Do you know about DRUUMM? Diverse and Revolutionary Unitarian Universalist Multicultural Ministries. It's the main people of color group
within the UUA. Sometimes some of the members are a little too angry for my tastes, but in general i've found it to be a comfort since there are so few of us within UUism. There is also a young adult caucus but I can't tell you much about them since I am not.

 

[lilithu]

While I am REALLY enjoying the reading of you two talking I feel I have to add that the UUA.... the association is what is 50 years old. Unitarianism and Universalism are two very old ideas. I'd say they started looking like we know them around the time of the 'Transcendentalist' era of the mid 1800s. The two organizations almost joined at this point, but it took another 100 years until it actually happened.

Not stickling for no need here.

Knowing the history of a tradition, imo, is one of the strengthening agents to add to the awareness that this is a REAL tradition over the ages and not just a 50 year old movement.

Kindness and Love of UUism intended, Friends.

No... not THOSE Friends.... the UUs silly. LoL.

It really depends on what you want to call Unitarian Universalism. I agree that both Unitarianism and Universalism are much older than 50 (tho in the grand scheme of things, even they are relatively young religions, being only a couple of hundred years old). And yes I know that the theological concepts of God being only one, not three (Unitarianism) and universal salvation (universalism) are older still, but they are not unique to UUism. Both Judaism and Islam are unitarian, and lots of other religions are universalist including Mahayana Buddhism and, I think, Hinduism. So... It depends on what you mean by UUism. But strictly speaking, Unitarian Universalism did not exist until the merger. In some respects I agree with you that what we have now can be traced directly to the Transcendentalist movement, but that was only the Unitarians, not the Universalists (who had remained Christian) and it was only a subset of Unitarians at that. It took at least another generation or so for Unitarianism as a whole to catch up with Emerson etc (which is why he left the Church).

I tell folks that Emerson is the reason why I'm a UU. (Or why I can be a UU; without him, I could not.) Because he took Hindu theology and translated it into Christian terminology. And I myself am very much a mixture of east and west, Buddhist and Christian (and a whole mess of other stuff). :namaste

 

[SageTree]

It really depends on what you want to call Unitarian Universalism. I agree that both Unitarianism and Universalism are much older than 50 (tho in the grand scheme of things, even they are relatively young religions, being only a couple of hundred years old). And yes I know that the theological concepts of God being only one, not three (Unitarianism) and universal salvation (universalism) are older still, but they are not unique to UUism. Both Judaism and Islam are unitarian, and lots of other religions are universalist including Mahayana Buddhism and, I think, Hinduism. So... It depends on what you mean by UUism. But strictly speaking, Unitarian Universalism did not exist until the merger. In some respects I agree with you that what we have now can be traced directly to the Transcendentalist movement, but that was only the Unitarians, not the Universalists (who had remained Christian) and it was only a subset of Unitarians at that. It took at least another generation or so for Unitarianism as a whole to catch up with Emerson etc (which is why he left the Church).

I tell folks that Emerson is the reason why I'm a UU. (Or why I can be a UU; without him, I could not.) Because he took Hindu theology and translated it into Christian terminology. And I myself am very much a mixture of east and west, Buddhist and Christian (and a whole mess of other stuff). :namaste

Thanks for your kind words. I would agree with you about the UU vs U and U... so I will.

I'm somewhat familiar with Emerson, but don't have a fully expressed knowledge of his writings about Eastern and Western spiritual language, and am interested to know if you would recommend anything to pick up, as I myself would tend to say Buddhism and Christianity are two foundational blocks in my Spiritual home... 'Me'.

:namaste