Vaccination as precondition

[Jayhawker Soule]

Recently, Reuters ran an article headlined Airports reject vaccine requirement as travel debate intensifies. It touches on an issue that will manifest itself in a number of ways once vaccines become available. So, for example:

Should proof of vaccination be a condition of employment in the health care and nursing home fields?

 

[Windwalker]

I think they should be allowed to travel, but not in the main seating areas with regular passengers. They could be stowed back with the luggage. Oxygen masks and blankets will be provided to accommodate their choice to not respect other the health concerns of others.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I think they should be allowed to travel, but not in the main seating areas with regular passengers. They could be stowed back with the luggage. Oxygen masks and blankets will be provided to accommodate their choice to not respect other the health concerns of others.

I disagree, but mostly I find myself curious about why you chose not to address the poll question.

 

[Windwalker]

I disagree, but mostly I find myself curious about why you chose not to address the poll question.

I did address the poll. I voted they should. Must I always add a smiley face to indicate a joke? (I was being sarcastic about anti vaxxers in my post, to spell it out and ruin the joke).

 

[lewisnotmiller]

I voted yes. My only condition here is that any vaccine has to go through the appropriate trials and safeguards. That sounds obvious, but there is a risk with a largescale pandemic like this that medical checks are abbreviated.

My hope is that the amount of additional resource being thrown at this is allowing them to speed up testing, and still getting this to a point where side-effects are known, but additional resource cannot properly replicate longer term impacts...they can simply do additional testing for shorter term impacts.

How this compares to a 'normal' testing regime, I have to admit I have some ignorance on.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

I voted yes. My only condition here is that any vaccine has to go through the appropriate trials and safeguards. That sounds obvious, but there is a risk with a largescale pandemic like this that medical checks are abbreviated.

My hope is that the amount of additional resource being thrown at this is allowing them to speed up testing, and still getting this to a point where side-effects are known, but additional resource cannot properly replicate longer term impacts...they can simply do additional testing for shorter term impacts.

How this compares to a 'normal' testing regime, I have to admit I have some ignorance on.

The challenges are daunting, particularly in this maximally corrosive climate imposed on us by Trump and his covidiots.

 

[exchemist]

Recently, Reuters ran an article headlined Airports reject vaccine requirement as travel debate intensifies. It touches on an issue that will manifest itself in a number of ways once vaccines become available. So, for example:

Should proof of vaccination be a condition of employment in the health care and nursing home fields?

What I have read about the stance on this in the UK is that the government does not itself propose to make vaccination a mandatory condition for anything, but they have said they would not be surprised if certain employers, for instance, demand proof of vaccination as a condition of working. The health and care sectors seem obvious candidates for this.

Obviously they will have to wait for long enough that all employees have had a reasonable chance to get vaccinated. Heath and care workers are first in line to get the jab anyway, so this will be quite feasible before long. For other sectors of the economy it is a different story. Once the health and care workers have been done the vaccine will be made available by tranches of age: over 70, 60-70, 50-60 etc. So it could be well into the summer before younger people say 20-30, in non Covid-critical work, get the chance to get vaccinated. I therefore do not think it would be reasonable for general employers, or restaurateurs or airlines, say, etc., to demand proof of vaccination for a long time to come.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

... it could be well into the summer before younger people say 20-30, in non Covid-critical work, get the chance to get vaccinated. I therefore do not think it would be reasonable for general employers, or restaurateurs or airlines, say, etc., to demand proof of vaccination for a long time to come.

And if they were prioritized such that they had such an opportunity?

 

[oldbadger]

What I have read about the stance on this in the UK is that the government does not itself propose to make vaccination a mandatory condition for anything, but they have said they would not be surprised if certain employers, for instance, demand proof of vaccination as a condition of working. The health and care sectors seem obvious candidates for this.

Hi.....
I felt that I had to vote No, because where an existing employee has a history of severe vaccination reaction such as severe breathing difficulty, then I don't think that they should have to lose their job in such circumstances.
Where all patients or care-customers are being vaccinated, or all airline passengers, then a person with an history of Vax reaction or with exemption certificate should be left free to travel, or work.

Difficult one, I thought.

 

[Left Coast]

Recently, Reuters ran an article headlined Airports reject vaccine requirement as travel debate intensifies. It touches on an issue that will manifest itself in a number of ways once vaccines become available. So, for example:

Should proof of vaccination be a condition of employment in the health care and nursing home fields?

I think the requirement should be similar to what we do for the flu vaccine (at least at the places I've worked in California) - either get the shot or wear mask/face shield at all times.

 

[exchemist]

And if they were prioritized such that they had such an opportunity?

That would be different of course. But my sense is that the UK government - quite understandably - does not want to get enmeshed in micromanagement of relative priorities for different categories of work.

Health and care work, plus residents of nursing homes like my old dad, are top priority, starting next week. All those people will get the vaccine brought to them, so there will be no issue of availability and no excuse for not getting immunised. (if you are a care worker that doesn't believe in vaccines, you deserve to be sacked, I would say.)

After that it will be sent out, I imagine either to special vaccination centres or to local doctors' surgeries, or both, and we will get called in, by letter or text, according to our ages. I already get letters inviting me for exciting things like flu and pneumonia jabs, and bowel cancer screening, on an age-related basis, so the system for this is already set up in the NHS computer system. But it will be up to us to make an appointment t the centre or surgery to get it done. So this will take a while.

 

[exchemist]

Hi.....
I felt that I had to vote No, because where an existing employee has a history of severe vaccination reaction such as severe breathing difficulty, then I don't think that they should have to lose their job in such circumstances.
Where all patients or care-customers are being vaccinated, or all airline passengers, then a person with an history of Vax reaction or with exemption certificate should be left free to travel, or work.

Difficult one, I thought.

Oh I'm sure there will be some medical exemptions. That's normal. But it should be very much by exception and properly validated ad documented, I would suggest.

Those people will need to carry on with barrier precautions and regular testing if they work in Covid-critical jobs. In the care homes, one could reach a point at which all the residents and staff but one medically exempt worker have been vaccinated. At that point that person has nobody to infect, so the issue goes away!

 

[oldbadger]

Oh I'm sure there will be some medical exemptions. That's normal. But it Should be very much by exception and properly validated ad documented, I would suggest.

Yes, fair enough.
But I just felt that I wanted to include such cases in the vote. We mustn't overlook them, is all.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Should proof of vaccination be a condition of employment in the health care and nursing home fields?

It already is for certain vaccines and positions. I had to retrieve my own records to work as a case manager in mental health.

 

[sun rise]

because where an existing employee has a history of severe vaccination reaction such as severe breathing difficulty, then I don't think that they should have to lose their job in such circumstances.

I voted yes but agree that there are special circumstances such as you outlined. But even there, I would as noted mandate special PPE as well as hopefully keep the very few such people away from those most at risk.

 

[stvdv]

Should proof of vaccination be a condition of employment in the health care and nursing home fields?

IMO:

NO. But.

All who give covid injections in hospital should be vaccinated (seems fair and logical); don't give to others what you don't want to be given to you


Those who have been vaccinated are safe, and won't get sick; that's the whole point of vaccination. Those who don't vaccinate know they take the risk. When I go to India I take hepatitis vaccination, no worry if doctor is vaccinated or not. I am (proven) safe, and won't get it. I only might get it without vaccination

Note:
When vaccine is scientifically proven safe enough (so, after a decades or two), then you can make it mandatory IF needed in healthcare
* I think of children being born ... they should not die in hospital before getting their covid jab
* I think of people getting their covid jab and getting covid instead (usually takes a few weeks before being protected with vaccines)

 

[Eddi]

I voted "Yes"

Such people should be part of the solution...

Not part of the problem

 

[oldbadger]

I voted yes but agree that there are special circumstances such as you outlined. But even there, I would as noted mandate special PPE as well as hopefully keep the very few such people away from those most at risk.

OK.
But let's not forget that mostly everybody will have chosen the vaccination.
The Brit government has already told us that it would never enforce this vaccination, so I'm not alone in holding back on pushing it on all.
But..... If a private airline requires the vaccination as a condition of travel, that's perfectly ok. Private companies can set their own terms and conditions.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Different countries will make different decisions as will companies and individuals.
You might not be able to fly to some countries because of local regulations.
It is unlikely that there will be a world wide agreement on this.

Any one who travels between countries should protect them selves.

Some people will still be in danger with a vaccination 5% at least.