Valentinus

[gnostic]

What do Gnostics today think of Valentinus and the Valentinian sect? More precisely, what do you think of him and his group?

 

[Halcyon]

Pretty broad questions...

I like his works, although i prefer Sethian.
I don't really know how to comment on the man or the group, i wasn't there, but they did a lot to spread Gnostic thought and it spread damned fast, so they must have been very appealing as a group of people.
Valentinus was very nearly Pope at one stage, so his contemporaries (pre Irenaeus) must have thought highly of him too.

Can you imagine how the world would be today if Valentinus had become Pope? No crusades, no witch-burnings for a start - who knows what else?

 

[Random]

This site has some stuff on Valentinus. I think his cosmology is fascinating, certainly the most intricate and absorbing of any Christian era thinkers.

 

[gnostic]

Pretty broad questions...

Well, it is a broad question.

I don't know much about Valentinus. And I also don't know much about how modern gnostics like yourself see Valentinus and the Valentinian schools.

I actually don't know much about the other gnostic sects too, such as the Sethians and the Basilidians and their respective leaders/teachers.

Can you or anyone explain the difference between these three gnostic schools?

I like his works, although i prefer Sethian.

If you like Sethian then I would have thought that you would like the Sethian Gospel of the Egyptians cosmogony than you would like the Apocryphron of John? But that's don't seem to be the case.

Valentinus was very nearly Pope at one stage, so his contemporaries (pre Irenaeus) must have thought highly of him too.

Can you imagine how the world would be today if Valentinus had become Pope? No crusades, no witch-burnings for a start - who knows what else?

Yes, it might have been a different world. The orthodox Christians prevailed because it receive the Roman emperor's backing, and became corrupted by the powers it gained.

 

[Halcyon]

I actually don't know much about the other gnostic sects too, such as the Sethians and the Basilidians and their respective leaders/teachers.

Can you or anyone explain the difference between these three gnostic schools?

Sethians, it can be argued, were originally Jewish Gnostics, who later embraced Christianity and rewrote many of their works to include a Christian theme. Some, like the Apocalypse of Adam, remained untouched.

Valentinian thought pretty much evolved directly from Sethian thought, but with a greater leaning towards certain orthodox concepts of Christianity.
Valentinus played a large role in the early Christian community, he wanted converts - so, as not to alienate too many non-Gnostic Christians, he tried to make his ideas gel more with the predominant proto-orthodox views than his Sethian precursors had done.

Not much is known of the Basilideans. I don't think any of their works have survived. Their cosmology and understanding of Gnosis differed quite a lot from their Sethian and Valentinian cousins. They leaned much more toward a Zurvanite understanding of creation - dark vs light, rather than the truth vs ignorance of the Sethian/Valentinian school. They were the group who believed in Abrasax and used Abraxas stones as charms. I don't know a great deal about the group though.

If you like Sethian then I would have thought that you would like the Sethian Gospel of the Egyptians cosmogony than you would like the Apocryphron of John? But that's don't seem to be the case.

Both are Sethian texts. I simply prefer the Apocryphon of John because it has many links to ideas found in other Sethian and Valentinian texts.

Yes, it might have been a different world. The orthodox Christians prevailed because it receive the Roman emperor's backing, and became corrupted by the powers it gained.

Gnostics couldn't give a crap about money or worldly possessions, it would not have blended well with the very materialistic Roman way of life.

 

[gnostic]

They were the group who believed in Abrasax and used Abraxas stones as charms. I don't know a great deal about the group though.

Ah, yes. Abrasax. :yes:

I've been meaning to ask about Abrasax, but I keep forgetting. I will do so in a different topic.

I had never heard of the Zurvanite.

Thanks, for explaining the differences between the various schools.