Was it any use for jesus to die for sins?

[Remté]

If your in a lot of physical pain, maybe you should see a doctor not a preist.

I think you didn't understand me, but now that you mention it guilt can cause to activate the part of the brain which activates at physical pain and so an originally emotional feeling can be like physical pain.

 

[Timothy Spurlin]

No, it took billions of billions of years for God's creation to create a species who wrote such a story about such a God.

Can you prove your god created anything?
Can you prove your god is real?

 

[Timothy Spurlin]

I think you didn't understand me, but now that you mention it guilt can cause to activate the part of the brain which activates at physical pain and so an originally emotional feeling can be like physical pain.

People feel guilt because of sin. Sin is a human construct, used to control people.

I live free of the guilt of sin and then fear of hell.

 

[sealchan]

Can you prove your god created anything?
Can you prove your god is real?

No one could prove any God real or has created anything. To be able to do so one would have to claim a perspective superior to Gods.

Any claim about God is mainly a faith-based statement.

 

[Timothy Spurlin]

No one could prove any God real or has created anything. To be able to do so one would have to claim a perspective superior to Gods.

Any claim about God is mainly a faith-based statement.

If you can't prove a god exist, why do you worship it?
Faith is believing without evidence.
Humans are superior to any of the gods they created.

 

[MonkeyFire]

In judaic macabee first man mustn't live forever, then Jesus comes and fulfils that prophecy then the Quran saves jesus from that very cross, gives the devil his special purpose then saves his son from the devilish purpose which is to suffer and possibly hate.

 

[Shantanu]

If you can't prove a god exist, why do you worship it?
Faith is believing without evidence.
Humans are superior to any of the gods they created.

I have proven that God exists but He is not to be worshipped because worshipping God means worshipping oneself and that is egotistical.

 

[sealchan]

If you can't prove a god exist, why do you worship it?
Faith is believing without evidence.
Humans are superior to any of the gods they created.

Evidence is much more common than proof. I've had experiences which have led me from a "default" atheism to an inspired belief. These experiences constitute personal evidences of which I do not feel the need to assume literal reality nor universal truth-value.

What's more these personal evidences resemble the experiences of others today and of those encounters with God that Abram/Abraham is described as having. So in that sense I see my experiences as evidence of a universal human psychological experience. But the variety of experiences suggest that God is something much more than any literal interpretation of any scripture.

 

[Shantanu]

the variety of experiences suggest that God is something much more than any literal interpretation of any scripture.

This is the most profound statement raising the question of which experience is truly representative of communications with God. You believe that the Christian God is the one and true God and teaches love and compassion, am I right?

 

[Workman]

Did you eat the forbidden fruit? Which fruit is forbidden?

Seek Thomas! Apparently he has it!
‘The Forbidden knowledge’

 

[sealchan]

This is the most profound statement raising the question of which experience is truly representative of communications with God. You believe that the Christian God is the one and true God and teaches love and compassion, am I right?

I believe that I have had an experience of the Judeo-Christian God, but i am not of the opinion that my personal experience proves anything about that God being the one and true God as defined by the Judeo-Christian perspective. My experience is likely colored by my cultural inheritance and personal knowledge at the time of the experience.

I do think that my experience matches qualities described in the Bible of Abram/Abraham's experience as well as an informal survey i did of those on another forum who told me about their own or others experiences of God.

I see God as having created an amoral creation but He/She/It intends us to act morally in it. I see Jesus as having much more compassion as he is like an avatar of the Judeo-Christian God to the experience of humans rather than a representative of Gods creation and Its Way.

 

[Shantanu]

I believe that I have had an experience of the Judeo-Christian God, but i am not of the opinion that my personal experience proves anything about that God being the one and true God as defined by the Judeo-Christian perspective. My experience is likely colored by my cultural inheritance and personal knowledge at the time of the experience.

I do think that my experience matches qualities described in the Bible of Abram/Abraham's experience as well as an informal survey i did of those on another forum who told me about their own or others experiences of God.

I see God as having created an amoral creation but He/She/It intends us to act morally in it. I see Jesus as having much more compassion as he is like an avatar of the Judeo-Christian God to the experience of humans rather than a representative of Gods creation and Its Way.

Thanks. My experience shows that God can be very cruel indeed in order to be kind in other ways, so we suffer Him.

 

[sealchan]

I have proven that God exists but He is not to be worshipped because worshipping God means worshipping oneself and that is egotistical.

Interesting...kind of a backdoor egotism.

That might explain a lot about the conservative mentality in my culture that suffers the rich because for someone to be rich, or some one God to be in control, then that in some psychological way suggests that per fate or fortune one's own dream/desire of such power IS A POSSIBILITY.

And that is a closet egotism.

 

[Shantanu]

Interesting...kind of a backdoor egotism.

That might explain a lot about the conservative mentality in my culture that suffers the rich because for someone to be rich, or some one God to be in control, then that in some psychological way suggests that per fate or fortune one's own dream/desire of such power IS A POSSIBILITY.

And that is a closet egotism.

In the Vedantic discovery that I have made God exists but we ourselves are the limit of the experience of God that one can attain.

 

[Timothy Spurlin]

Evidence is much more common than proof. I've had experiences which have led me from a "default" atheism to an inspired belief. These experiences constitute personal evidences of which I do not feel the need to assume literal reality nor universal truth-value.

What's more these personal evidences resemble the experiences of others today and of those encounters with God that Abram/Abraham is described as having. So in that sense I see my experiences as evidence of a universal human psychological experience. But the variety of experiences suggest that God is something much more than any literal interpretation of any scripture.

What objective evidence do you have that your god is real?
The Bible is the claim, not the evidence

 

[ManSinha]

If you can't prove a god exist, why do you worship it?
Faith is believing without evidence.
Humans are superior to any of the gods they created.

And if that is your way of looking at everything around - your worldview so to speak - that is perfectly fine
If it works for you - great - who are the rest of us to try and convince you of anything different?

Truth be told - as I was discussing with another group on a different forum - with laws existing in today's civilized world about how we treat others and workplace regulations and rights of women / minorities etc - the role for religion in daily life does seem to be narrowing

In case you are interested, I personally use it as a solace for the darker times, as a source of hope perhaps - but to me it is more the inner facing aspects of self improvement that start to take precedence than convincing others -

As a great soul indicates: Read the first few stanzas

 

[ManSinha]

Thanks. My experience shows that God can be very cruel indeed in order to be kind in other ways, so we suffer Him.

Explain please?

 

[ManSinha]

What objective evidence do you have that your god is real?
The Bible is the claim, not the evidence

I believe the coldly logical answer to that question - IMHO - is that there is none (objectively) - Miracles have been described and may have happened down the ages - is that proof of existence of a higher being? Not by today's scientific standards of reproducibility - it is indeed up to each and every one themselves with perhaps a role for how we grew up and what teachings appeal to us throughout our evolving life and experiences.

I look around and see a Universal sense pervading - is that God or The Light? I honestly could not say .....

 

[TheBannerofHomuraAkemi]

What is it supposed to change? Personal responsibility remains.

If you believe in the doctrine then you would think Jesus died for our sins as way for mankind to receive salvation

But what if he was just a cult leader who got too popular and was executed?

 

[Shantanu]

Explain please?

I have had a very difficult time over the past 20 years during which I was assessed as having a mental disorder of persistent delusional disorder and consequently was incarcerated in mental hospitals twice and the forced to take anti-psychotic and anti-depressant medication when out living in the Community. So I not only suffered torture but my reputation as a normal sane human being was irreparably damaged. But on the positive side it taught me a lot about the workings of the UK State so I learnt from it. That was the blessing in disguise. It had been God who had got me to do things that gave me the label of being a gross misconduct person at the University that I worked in. Prior to that I had a brilliant scientific career in having published 35 scientific papers in international journals and securing three promotions to go with my PhD and Post Graduate Diploma in Agricultural Development. So I believe that God had been within me guiding me through my life and putting me through severe trials and tribulations all for the purpose of being able to find out about advaita and the method by which one can attain God. So God was being very cruel materially to me in order to be kind to me on reflection. I would not change all that has happened to me for anything. That is my experience of God.