Westboro Baptist Church

[horizon_mj1]

Green Gaia, I agree that you should always keep an eye on evil. I see it like crossing a street, you look both ways before you cross to assure you reach the other side in one piece. Not only that, I feel I get a greater insight and appriciation of what is good.

 

[Elessar]

"But woe to you hypocritical Torah-teachers and P'rushim! For you are shutting the Kingdom of Heaven in people's faces, neither entering yourselves nor allowing those who wish to enter to do so. Woe to you hypocritical Torah-teachers and P'rushim! For you swallow up widow's houses while making a show of davvening at great length. Because of this your punishment will be all the worse!
"Woe to you hypocritical Torah-teachers and P'rushim! You go about over land and over sea to make one proselyte, and you make him twice as fit for Gei-Hinnom as you are!...
"You snakes! Sons of snakes! How can you escape being condemned to Gei-Hinnom?...And so, on you will fall the guilt for all the innocent blood that has ever been shed on earth,

Mattityahu 23:13-15, 33, 35a

 

[StripperClown]

They are nasty, vile people. But, at least they really stick to their convictions, and actually practice what they preach.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

"Passionate hatreds can give meaning and purpose to an empty life. These people haunted by the purposelessness of their lives try to find a new content not only by dedicating themselves to a holy cause but also by nursing a fanatical grievance. A mass movement offers them unlimited opportunies for battle."

~ Eric Hoffer
​

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

Ok, a question for folks. Imagine if you will, a country controled by Rev. Phelps. He is the political leader of a theocracy and has full control over the country. Doesn't have to be the US or even a real country, just someplace hypothetical. What do you think that country would be like? What laws do you think Phelps would create and how would he enforce them? What other countries in existance would most closely resemble Phelps creation? What Christian countries in the past might resemble the country Phelps would create?

(Ok, ok, its a lot of questions. )

 

[lilithu]

Ok, a question for folks. Imagine if you will, a country controled by Rev. Phelps. He is the political leader of a theocracy and has full control over the country.... What do you think that country would be like?

Iran, only worse??

Executions for being gay (or being accused of being gay).
Women as second-class citizens.
Theology dictated by law.
Morality police prying into your private business.
Probably prison for being anything other than Christian, I wouldn't put it past him.

shudder..... What is the purpose of having us imagine this nightmare scenario, Trey?

 

[Breathe]

Awful, awful bunch.
They're just wicked people. Nuff said.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

What is the purpose of having us imagine this nightmare scenario, Trey?

Understanding. People look at Phelps and say, "what a nut job, but he's harmless because nobodies going to listen to anyone that crazy." But in other countries there are people just as crazy but with true power. You're example of Iran is good and I was thinking of North Korea myself. It is important to remember that people like Phelps yearn for the ability to control other peoples lives and in some cases they have won the battle and are in power. People think we can deal with people like Kim Jong-il and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad as though they were normal people. Can you imagine trying to reason with Phelps on the subject of Gay rights? Yet some people think we can reason with Ahmadinejad over Israel's right to exist. You can't reason with a fanatic.

 

[Breathe]

Ok, a question for folks. Imagine if you will, a country controled by Rev. Phelps.

Awful, awful question!! :-D

He is the political leader of a theocracy and has full control over the country. Doesn't have to be the US or even a real country, just someplace hypothetical.

That would be horrible! I can't imagine people being stupid enough to vote for someone like him.... horrible questions!

What do you think that country would be like?

Iran, or Saudi Arabia??

What laws do you think Phelps would create and how would he enforce them?

Hmmm, I think...

1. Ban on homosexuality, with death penalty
2. death penalty for adultery
3. death penalty for not being nutty
4. death penalty for not being a Christian (or not an insane Christian)
5. Women must keep long hair
6. compulsory church attendance
7. Ban on abortions even in medical cases
8. Isolationist policies, effectively isolating it from the rest of the world
9. Compulsory tithing

He'd probably enforce them with religious police, I think.

What other countries in existance would most closely resemble Phelps creation?

Um. Christianized North Korea, Christianized Saudi Arabia?

What Christian countries in the past might resemble the country Phelps would create?

Oh man, that's a toughie. I can't really think of any!

(Ok, ok, its a lot of questions. )

But fun.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

Oh man, that's a toughie. I can't really think of any!

How about the Holy Roman Empire?

 

[Breathe]

How about the Holy Roman Empire?

Hmmm, possibly. I'm sure someone would disagree with that, though, but perhaps that is a good example!

Seems weird to think the HRE still existed until 1806 tho... weird. I can't imagine them being fanatical later on in life.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

Hmmm, possibly. I'm sure someone would disagree with that, though, but perhaps that is a good example!

Seems weird to think the HRE still existed until 1806 tho... weird. I can't imagine them being fanatical later on in life.

Yeah, I was talking about the HRE during the Crusades and Inquisition rather than later on.

 

[Breathe]

Yeah, I was talking about the HRE during the Crusades and Inquisition rather than later on.

Hmmm, during that, then yeah.

 

[Riverwolf]

Understanding. People look at Phelps and say, "what a nut job, but he's harmless because nobodies going to listen to anyone that crazy." But in other countries there are people just as crazy but with true power. You're example of Iran is good and I was thinking of North Korea myself. It is important to remember that people like Phelps yearn for the ability to control other peoples lives and in some cases they have won the battle and are in power. People think we can deal with people like Kim Jong-il and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad as though they were normal people. Can you imagine trying to reason with Phelps on the subject of Gay rights? Yet some people think we can reason with Ahmadinejad over Israel's right to exist. You can't reason with a fanatic.

Maybe someone can remind them of what their scripture says on their behavior.

That'll reveal their true colors.

 

[Wandered Off]

Not quite as famous but sort of along the same lines...
A True Church Home Page

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I thought it was funny how the ex-neo nazi was speaking against them.

Ok, a question for folks. Imagine if you will, a country controled by Rev. Phelps. He is the political leader of a theocracy and has full control over the country.... What do you think that country would be like?

The UN would probably offer an assistance program for people to get out. Such a nation would probably be far worse than Iran, Iraq, Castro controlled Cuba, Nazi Germany, and Medieval Europe combined.
Unless you would be an English speaking Christian male, you would have zero rights. If you was anything but an English speaking Christian male, your life would probably not last very long.

That's for the people to decide for themselves, and this church has no control over how they react.

And Fantome Profane is right. Any publicity is good publicity. It's really just best to ignore these people.

They already have publicity, and political power, as there are already some lawyers within the family. That's not counting other lawyers who work for them . There are several other political groups who fight people such as the Phelps clan to keep their religious perspectives out of politics.

 

[lilithu]

Understanding. People look at Phelps and say, "what a nut job, but he's harmless because nobodies going to listen to anyone that crazy." But in other countries there are people just as crazy but with true power. You're example of Iran is good and I was thinking of North Korea myself. It is important to remember that people like Phelps yearn for the ability to control other peoples lives and in some cases they have won the battle and are in power. People think we can deal with people like Kim Jong-il and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad as though they were normal people. Can you imagine trying to reason with Phelps on the subject of Gay rights? Yet some people think we can reason with Ahmadinejad over Israel's right to exist. You can't reason with a fanatic.

You said that my example of Ahmadinejad was a good one, yet I fully supported UUA President Sinkford meeting with him (as part of a panel discussion). And if you read the transcript of the meeting with Ahmadinejad, you may be surprised to see how "normal" he sounds. I disagree with him vehemently on a number of issues, but I don't think he's crazy. It's too easy to say he's crazy and refuse to talk with him. IMO, that does no one any good. If anything, calling someone "crazy" diminishes their culpability.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

You said that my example of Ahmadinejad was a good one, yet I fully supported UUA President Sinkford meeting with him (as part of a panel discussion). And if you read the transcript of the meeting with Ahmadinejad, you may be surprised to see how "normal" he sounds. I disagree with him vehemently on a number of issues, but I don't think he's crazy. It's too easy to say he's crazy and refuse to talk with him. IMO, that does no one any good. If anything, calling someone "crazy" diminishes their culpability.

Agreed, on the crazy part anyway. Crazy is what they call Phelps but then when someone in power shows the same fanaticism calling them crazy diminishes their culpability. My point in all this is that discussing an issue with any of these people will have the same results. Nothing. Even if the ones in power are smart enough to pretend to talk it will still go nowhere because there is no room in their beliefs for other beliefs and they will not tolerate their existance. I would support anyone who wanted to talk to Ahmadinejad, hopefully they would see him for the puppet he is.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

Such a nation would probably be far worse than Iran, Iraq, Castro controlled Cuba, Nazi Germany, and Medieval Europe combined.

How so? I see them as comparable but not worse to the degree that you suggest. Can you give examples of how Phelps could top Hitler?

 

[Riverwolf]

They already have publicity, and political power, as there are already some lawyers within the family. That's not counting other lawyers who work for them . There are several other political groups who fight people such as the Phelps clan to keep their religious perspectives out of politics.

Therefore you've just proved my point. There are plenty of people that can keep them in check.

They have all the publicity they need, but that's all they have. Any political "power" they have doesn't show much, and I doubt anybody outside of that church really takes them seriously.