What do you think about the Bahai faith?

[PureX]

What do you think about the Bahai faith?

Bahai is not a faith, it's a religion. Faith is an internal choice we make to trust in something that we cannot be sure is true, or that it will turn out to be true when we act on it. Faith is about putting our trust into action knowing that we might be wrong. It's not a set of "beliefs" that we blindly pretend to know to be true. Bahai looks to me to be very much the latter.

I am not a fan of any religion that touts itself to be the mediator between humanity and God. I see that as a recipe for abuse by the religion's purveyors, and idiocy for the followers. However, I am not the yardstick by which all things should be measured or understood. So I acknowledge that my opinion is just my opinion on the subject.

 

[SalixIncendium]

Bahai is not a faith, it's a religion.

The religion is called "Baha'i Faith".

The Bahá’í Faith

The Official Website of the Worldwide Bahá’í Community

www.bahai.org

 

[PureX]

The religion is called "Baha'i Faith".

The Bahá’í Faith

The Official Website of the Worldwide Bahá’í Community

www.bahai.org

So even it's name is misleading ... got it.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

What do you think about the Bahai faith?

I think it is the greatest challenge for all humanity in this age.

On an open forum, in a debate section, where anyone can join the conversation, that really redefines proselytizing. People need to look at that in a new way, yet many are not ready to.

Regards Tony

 

[Vinayaka]

Not much. It says that 535 million Buddhists are incorrect in their understanding of their own religion, in an attempt to fit the Bahai narrative. The Buddha was not a messenger of any deity. End of.

So too with Hinduism, and there are 1.4 billion of us.

 

[F1fan]

So even it's name is misleading ... got it.

The word “faith” is misleading. Why? Because what faiths claim is true aren’t factual nor can be shown to be plausible. This is mostly due to core assumptions of a supernatural. Faiths are adopted or accepted for social reasons or for the sake of identity and meaning.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

So too with Hinduism, and there are 1.4 billion of us.

We can consider that numbers do not determine what is true, or not. At one time the few that taught the world was round, were persecuted and ridiculed by the multitude.

I wish you always well and happy and safe. I hope you get the chance and choose to visit the new temple when it is built and get to meet people that practice the Love offered.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

The word “faith” is misleading. Why? Because what faiths claim is true aren’t factual nor can be shown to be plausible. This is mostly due to core assumptions of a supernatural. Faiths are adopted or accepted for social reasons or for the sake of identity and meaning.

Everything is subjective, thus we all have faith. Humanity does not have the answers to most fundamental foundation of existence. Science can go so far to explain this and no further.

Using Logic and Reason the spiritual reality of man is as plausable as any science, both of which comes from a rational mind.

Regards Tony

 

[F1fan]

Everything is subjective, thus we all have faith.

Sorry, no. We humans can be certain of a great deal. I see theists want yo blur knowledge to a point where they can try to justify their beliefs in implausible concepts. Their mistake is that if we humans are less able to know and understand anything then religion is that much further away. Critical thinkers know this, and recognize the motives behind such assertions.

Humanity does not have the answers to most fundamental foundation of existence. Science can go so far to explain this and no further.

Wise thinkers know the limitations, but also know not to tie the self up in knots with uncertainty, and then respond with implausible and absurd concepts like those of religions. Atheists are at peace with “I don’t know” while the faithful build emotional dependency on ideas they can’t verify are true either. I am baffled why humans default to irrational frameworks only because science can’t explain things with facts.

Using Logic and Reason the spiritual reality of man is as plausable as any science, both of which comes from a rational mind.

Regards Tony

My thoughts about being a spiritual person is anyone who is grounded in reason, emotionally secure, and able to accept science and knowledge without anxiety. So this renders many believers outside this definition. We see the hostility towards science and reason by theists almost exclusively. Those who accept science demonstrate a stability that other believers should envy.

 

[Vinayaka]

We can consider that numbers do not determine what is true, or not. At one time the few that taught the world was round, were persecuted and ridiculed by the multitude.

I wish you always well and happy and safe. I hope you get the chance and choose to visit the new temple when it is built and get to meet people that practice the Love offered.

Regards Tony

If it even gets built. The destruction of natural habitat and deer routes would be something I'd be opposed to as well.

‘Tourist attraction’: Baháʼí Temple poised to put Markham on world map, but has neighbours worried

World-class architecture is coming to Markham, but not without altercations.

www.yorkregion.com

 

[Vinayaka]

The word “faith” is misleading. Why? Because what faiths claim is true aren’t factual nor can be shown to be plausible. This is mostly due to core assumptions of a supernatural. Faiths are adopted or accepted for social reasons or for the sake of identity and meaning.

My impression was that 'faith' in this sense was a word that was reserved for a small group, who have yet to pass the test of time, or numbers to even be close to being called a religion. The only people proposing it be called a religion are the Bahai's themselves. As if a single word word add to the legitimacy of it. Course I could be wrong, as I usually am.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

If it even gets built. The destruction of natural habitat and deer routes would be something I'd be opposed to as well.

‘Tourist attraction’: Baháʼí Temple poised to put Markham on world map, but has neighbours worried

World-class architecture is coming to Markham, but not without altercations.

www.yorkregion.com

I have not studied the native diversity there as yet. I think I read that it used to be open farmland? I did watch a youetube video of a decendant of the traditional owners of the land and he had a vision that was complimentary to traditional use, which was enjoyable to my wife and I. It was a 12 minute video.

I see it will only proceed as per the legal and environmental requirements and with the blessing of majority of the locals.



Regards Tony

 

[Trailblazer]

I think it is the greatest challenge for all humanity in this age.

You just reminded me of a favorite quote.

“What “oppression” is greater than that which hath been recounted? What “oppression” is more grievous than that a soul seeking the truth, and wishing to attain unto the knowledge of God, should know not where to go for it and from whom to seek it? For opinions have sorely differed, and the ways unto the attainment of God have multiplied. This “oppression” is the essential feature of every Revelation. Unless it cometh to pass, the Sun of Truth will not be made manifest. For the break of the morn of divine guidance must needs follow the darkness of the night of error. For this reason, in all chronicles and traditions reference hath been made unto these things, namely that iniquity shall cover the surface of the earth and darkness shall envelop mankind. As the traditions referred to are well known, and as the purpose of this servant is to be brief, He will refrain from quoting the text of these traditions.” The Kitab-i-Iqan, pp. 31-32​

We can clearly see the oppression on this forum.

On an open forum, in a debate section, where anyone can join the conversation, that really redefines proselytizing. People need to look at that in a new way, yet many are not ready to.

Proselytize: convert or attempt to convert (someone) from one religion, belief, or opinion to another. https://www.google.com

Proselytizing implies intent to convert people from one opinion or belief to another.
It is impossible to know another person's intent unless they tell you. It is highly arrogant to claim to know another person's intent, especially after they tell you that is NOT their intent.

What Baha’is are enjoined to do is share our Faith.

“Consort with all men, O people of Bahá, in a spirit of friendliness and fellowship. If ye be aware of a certain truth, if ye possess a jewel, of which others are deprived, share it with them in a language of utmost kindliness and good-will. If it be accepted, if it fulfil its purpose, your object is attained. If anyone should refuse it, leave him unto himself, and beseech God to guide him. Beware lest ye deal unkindly with him. A kindly tongue is the lodestone of the hearts of men. It is the bread of the spirit, it clotheth the words with meaning, it is the fountain of the light of wisdom and understanding….” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 289​

But that does not mean we share it with people who are not interested. However, in a conversation about religion on a public forum, we cannot know who is interested and not, so it is perfectly appropriate to share what we believe, just like everyone else does.

Sharing is not proselytizing. Proselytizing implies intent to convert but sharing does not imply intent to convert.
Nobody has any way of knowing the intent of any other person.

Baha’is are only supposed to “teach” the Baha’i Faith to people if they have shared and someone is interested in learning more about it.

Share: give a portion of (something) to another or others. https://www.google.com

Teach: show or explain to (someone) how to do something.https://www.google.com

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Sorry, no. We humans can be certain of a great deal. I see theists want yo blur knowledge to a point where they can try to justify their beliefs in implausible concepts. Their mistake is that if we humans are less able to know and understand anything then religion is that much further away. Critical thinkers know this, and recognize the motives behind such assertions.

Wise thinkers know the limitations, but also know not to tie the self up in knots with uncertainty, and then respond with implausible and absurd concepts like those of religions. Atheists are at peace with “I don’t know” while the faithful build emotional dependency on ideas they can’t verify are true either. I am baffled why humans default to irrational frameworks only because science can’t explain things with facts.

My thoughts about being a spiritual person is anyone who is grounded in reason, emotionally secure, and able to accept science and knowledge without anxiety. So this renders many believers outside this definition. We see the hostility towards science and reason by theists almost exclusively. Those who accept science demonstrate a stability that other believers should envy.

That is all relative to you.

You have not reflected the beauty found in my reality, which is beyond self, beyond envy or hate of any other being, be it on this planet or any in the limitless universe.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

You just reminded me of a favorite quote.

“What “oppression” is greater than that which hath been recounted? What “oppression” is more grievous than that a soul seeking the truth, and wishing to attain unto the knowledge of God, should know not where to go for it and from whom to seek it? For opinions have sorely differed, and the ways unto the attainment of God have multiplied. This “oppression” is the essential feature of every Revelation. Unless it cometh to pass, the Sun of Truth will not be made manifest. For the break of the morn of divine guidance must needs follow the darkness of the night of error. For this reason, in all chronicles and traditions reference hath been made unto these things, namely that iniquity shall cover the surface of the earth and darkness shall envelop mankind. As the traditions referred to are well known, and as the purpose of this servant is to be brief, He will refrain from quoting the text of these traditions.” The Kitab-i-Iqan, pp. 31-32​

We can clearly see the oppression on this forum.

Proselytize: convert or attempt to convert (someone) from one religion, belief, or opinion to another. https://www.google.com

Proselytizing implies intent to convert people from one opinion or belief to another.
It is impossible to know another person's intent unless they tell you. It is highly arrogant to claim to know another person's intent, especially after the tel you that is NOT their intent.

What Baha’is are enjoined to do is share our Faith.

“Consort with all men, O people of Bahá, in a spirit of friendliness and fellowship. If ye be aware of a certain truth, if ye possess a jewel, of which others are deprived, share it with them in a language of utmost kindliness and good-will. If it be accepted, if it fulfil its purpose, your object is attained. If anyone should refuse it, leave him unto himself, and beseech God to guide him. Beware lest ye deal unkindly with him. A kindly tongue is the lodestone of the hearts of men. It is the bread of the spirit, it clotheth the words with meaning, it is the fountain of the light of wisdom and understanding….” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 289​

But that does not mean we share it with people who are not interested. However, in a conversation about religion on a public forum, we cannot know who is interested and not, so it is perfectly appropriate to share what we believe, just like everyone else does.

Sharing is not proselytizing. Proselytizing implies intent to convert but sharing does not imply intent to convert.
Nobody has any way of knowing the intent of any other person.

Baha’is are only supposed to “teach” the Baha’i Faith to people if they have shared and someone is interested in learning more about it.

Share: give a portion of (something) to another or others. https://www.google.com

Teach: show or explain to (someone) how to do something.https://www.google.com

That is worth infinite trophies.

Regards Tony

 

[Trailblazer]

That is worth infinite trophies.

Baha'u'llah's Writings get the trophies. Even if that was all I had for evidence of His Station it would suffice.

I do not want to get involved on this thread but what I said had to be said.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Baha'u'llah's Writings get the trophies. Even if that was all I had for evidence of His Station it would suffice.

I do not want to get involved on this thread but what I said had to be said.

That is wise. Regards Tony

 

[Trailblazer]

That is wise. Regards Tony

I'm learning.

 

[Vinayaka]

I have not studied the native diversity there as yet. I think I read that it used to be open farmland? I did watch a youetube video of a decendant of the traditional owners of the land and he had a vision that was complimentary to traditional use, which was enjoyable to my wife and I. It was a 12 minute video.

I see it will only proceed as per the legal and environmental requirements and with the blessing of majority of the locals.



Regards Tony

Lots of groups have their plans rejected based on land use, and other considerations. Some folks are naive enough to purchase land without due consideration of all the factors, like if whether or not the land needs to be rezoned. I'm not sure of the specifics in this case. The video was a biased Baha'i production. No wonder you enjoyed it.

Edited ... I did further research and the land was zoned residential. Not sure if they got that changed. Hopefully for the community they purchased it with a 'subject to rezoning' clause. Otherwise they could be out a boatload of money.

 

[danieldemol]

What do you think about the Bahai faith?

I think it has some positives and some negatives - the biggest one being declaring it's all too human founding figures as infallible.

Some obvious sticking points for me are;

Bad fruits of the Baha'i faith;
-Anti-gay teaching
-Men and women supposedly equal but no women's representation on the Universal House of Justice.
-Opposition to the scientific method as Baha'i have to assume what the Messenger says is "fundamentally true".
-Baha'u'llah cursing those who reject him eg:

'Amongst them were those who claimed: "These are not clear verses from God, nor do they proceed from an innate and untaught nature." Thus do the unbelievers seek to remedy the sickness of their hearts, utterly heedless that they thus render themselves accursed of all who dwell in heaven and on earth.'

Source: Bahá'í Reference Library - The Summons of the Lord of Hosts, Pages 3-54

-Baha'u'llah appears to occasionally speak out of both sides of his mouth with respect to the murder of his opposition, for example he describes the act of murder of Siyyid Muhammad-i-Isfahani as an act that caused his heart and pen to groan in one instance, and then in the Kitab-i-Aqdas he describes it as an act of God, 'God hath laid hold on him who led thee astray'

Source: Bahá'í Reference Library - The Kitáb-i-Aqdas, Pages 249-250

Some additional notes;
The reason Baha'u'llah cursing people is an issue is because he condemns cursing people