What is the evidence of God’s Love?

[Yokefellow]

Christians claim that God is Love and Baha’is claim that God is All-Loving, but where is the evidence?

The fact that you have always existed, are existing now, and will always continue to exist is all the evidence you should ever need.

Christians say that the evidence of God’s Love is that God sent Jesus, His only Son, to die for our sins.

Jesus died so that we would not have to reincarnate back into this place of Eternal Punishment. Sacrifice is the ultimate form of Love.

Most Christians have yet to understand this.

Nobody can prove that God is Love or that God is All-Loving.

I just did.

...how is God expressing love towards people?

Again, Love is sacrifice.

 

[loverofhumanity]

That's right, humans cannot understand God owing to our limitations and that is why I am sick to death of humans telling me that God is Loving.
God created us out of His love for us is not the same as saying that God is loving, and besides that, lots of things have happened since humans were created. Maybe God thought we humans were going to be what He hoped we would be but that has not turned out to be the case.

I think that some atheists like @blü 2 can understand this but sadly, believers are too biased to understand.

God sending us Baha’u’llah and all the wonderful Teachers is sufficient proof to me that God is loving.

 

[Trailblazer]

The fact that you have always existed, are existing now, and will always continue to exist is all the evidence you should ever need.

That is not evidence that God is loving.
Who says that I want to exist?

Jesus died so that we would not have to reincarnate back into this place of Eternal Punishment. Sacrifice is the ultimate form of Love.

Most Christians have yet to understand this.

Indeed, sacrifice is the ultimate for of love.
I know Jesus was loving but I am not talking about Jesus, I am talking about God.

I just did.

No, not quite.

Again, Love is sacrifice.

What as God sacrifice? God still has everything He ever had.

 

[Trailblazer]

God sending us Baha’u’llah and all the wonderful Teachers is sufficient proof to me that God is loving.

I am sorry but that is not good enough for me.
How does that demonstrate that God is loving?

 

[osgart]

No, I don't think that's true, and it's not a Baha'i teaching.

God loves everyone regardless of their beliefs or non-beliefs.

"How ignorant therefore the thought that God who created man, educated and nurtured him, surrounded him with all blessings, made the sun and all phenomenal existence for his benefit, bestowed upon him tenderness and kindness, and then did not love him. This is palpable ignorance, for no matter to what religion a man belongs even though he be an atheist or materialist nevertheless God nurtures him, bestows His kindness and sheds upon him His light."

('Abdu'l-Baha, Star of the West, Vol. 8, issue 7, p. 78)

I do not believe that God rejects anyone on the basis of honest disbelief and that is not a Baha'i teaching.

That's a major departure from other Abrahamic Gods.

God does not hate anyone, God loves everyone.

How far does that extend? What about genocide, and psychopathic serial killers

No, God does not demand love. God does not need our love. God only wants us to love Him so we can have a connection to Him.
If we do not love God, we close the conduit by which love flows from God to us, and then back to God.

You're right I see in nature no evidence of a loving God.

5: O SON OF BEING! Love Me, that I may love thee. If thou lovest Me not, My love can in no wise reach thee. Know this, O servant.
The Hidden Words of Bahá’u’lláh, p. 4

I agree. Love is entered into freely or it ain't love. I don't think God wants phonies. We either love Him sincerely or it is better not to love.
I cannot force myself to love God but I am working on it. That's what these threads are all about.

I don't think my loving God should be contingent upon whether God loves me. I just want to know whether there is any evidence of God's love.

I wouldn't pursue that kind of thing because life on earth is so vulnerable to horrors, atrocities, and other nightmares.

 

[Colt]

Christians claim that God is Love and Baha’is claim that God is All-Loving, but where is the evidence?

Christians say that the evidence of God’s Love is that God sent Jesus, His only Son, to die for our sins.

Baha’is say God is All-Loving because God sends Messengers and because Baha’u’llah wrote that God is All-Loving.

Anyone can ‘believe’ that God is Love, and maybe those two things above demonstrate God’s Love, but what does God actually do on a regular basis to demonstrate His Love? In my opinion, if God is All-Loving, we should be able to see evidence of that, not only Scriptures that say that God is Love or that God is All-Loving, or Messengers that God sends every 500-1000 years or so.

Nobody can prove that God is Love or that God is All-Loving. I have concluded that what it boils down to is what people are willing to believe. Not only that, I think it is about what people want to believe. People want to believe that God is Love or that God is All-Loving, and I think that is the primary reason they believe that.

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The reason I thought to post this is because I have come to the conclusion that Love is very important, and in fact it is the chief reason why people are happy. I came to realize this by watching a TV show called The Waltons. In that show there is a family of seven children, a mother and a father, and a grandmother and grandfather, all living together in the same big house in rural Virginia. The story takes place during the Great Depression, World War II, and the post-war era. What is so striking about this family is how much love they have for each other and how they demonstrate it. The parents love each other romantically even after having been married for 25 years, the parents love all the children, and all the siblings love each other even though they fight. I can only dream about such a family, since my family was not loving at all.

I think that the reason this family is so happy is because of the love they have for each other. I know what brings happiness to me, feeling and expressing love for other people and animals. People are expressing love for each other all the time but how is God expressing love towards people?

God gives life, he shares his being with others.

A demonstration of Gods Love is when he became one of his own created beings and lived the turbulent life that we are called to live! Even the willingness to share the death experience on the cross!

 

[Trailblazer]

That's a major departure from other Abrahamic Gods.

God has always been the same but the message from God changes over time as humanity progresses. Humanity no longer need a God who sends people to hell as a way to frighten them into believing as people can now use their intellectual faculties to make that choice.

How far does that extend? What about genocide, and psychopathic serial killers

God loves everyone but that does not mean that God considers all men equal.

“Let no one imagine that by Our assertion that all created things are the signs of the revelation of God is meant that—God forbid—all men, be they good or evil, pious or infidel, are equal in the sight of God.” Gleanings, p. 187

You're right I see in nature no evidence of a loving God.

I sure don't see it when I turn on the TV and watch nature programs. I just cannot understand how a 'loving God' would allow animals to suffer and die, and I feel the same way about humans. Sadly, believers have no explanation for this.

I wouldn't pursue that kind of thing because life on earth is so vulnerable to horrors, atrocities, and other nightmares.

I understand how you feel.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

“What is the evidence of God’s Love​

Oh my goodness,
Where to start?!

Let’s start with butterflies, strawberries, & enjoying the company of good friends And having the ability to appreciate these things.

Don’t they make you smile?
I know cats do.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I think the fact that I exist and get to live and experience the world is proof enough that the Creator loves me. There's a lot of possible people who don't exist and never will, but somehow a specific sperm just managed to meet a specific egg, against almost unimaginable odds and here I am. And I almost left the world multiple times afterwards, including before I was born. So I appreciate being alive. I don't know what more you could ask for.

Also, don't you believe your own religion that God will perfect all things in the end? Suffering is temporary.

 

[Trailblazer]

“What is the evidence of God’s Love​

Oh my goodness,
Where to start?!

Let’s start with butterflies, strawberries, & enjoying the company of good friends And having the ability to appreciate these things.

Don’t they make you smile?
I know cats do.

But what about the other things in the world that aren't so nice, like suffering and death of loved ones?
Why do Christians only look at the good things and say that is evidence that God is loving, when the Bible clearly says that God is also responsible for the bad things? Where would I even start in describing those?

NIRV I cause light to shine. I also create darkness. I bring good times. I also create hard times. I do all these things. I am the Lord.

AMP The One forming light and creating darkness, Causing peace and creating disaster; I am the Lord who does all these things.

ERV I made the light and the darkness. I bring peace, and I cause trouble. I, the Lord, do all these things.

EHV I am the one who forms light and creates darkness, the one who makes peace and creates disaster. I am the Lord, the one who does all these things.

ESV I form light and create darkness; I make well-being and create calamity; I am the Lord, who does all these things.

TLB I form the light and make the dark. I send good times and bad. I, Jehovah, am he who does these things.

NASB The One forming light and creating darkness, Causing well-being and creating disaster; I am the Lord who does all these things.

NCB I form the light and create the darkness; prosperity and disaster depend upon my will; I, the Lord, do all these things.

NCV I made the light and the darkness. I bring peace, and I cause troubles. I, the Lord, do all these things.

NIRV I cause light to shine. I also create darkness. I bring good times. I also create hard times. I do all these things. I am the Lord.

NIV I form the light and create darkness, I bring prosperity and create disaster; I, the Lord, do all these things.

Isaiah 45:7 - Bible Gateway

 

[Hockeycowboy]

But what about the other things in the world that aren't so nice, like suffering and death of loved ones?

Why do you think Jesus wants us to pray , “Thy Will be done on earth “?

We’re to pray for it, right?

That means what? That God’s Will isn’t happening right now, until His appointed time.

I will try to get around addressing more of your post later.

Have a good evening, cousin

 

[Saved by grace 2]

True, but I guess I need more than faith to believe that God is loving, given everything I see in the world that runs contrary to that.

I can't prove God's Love that he gives me, other than showing love to others, and I really have experienced the Love of God thru Jesus Christ!. God truly does reveal his love to all who by faith believe in him. God is Love, and his Love is real!, and is experienced thru confirming in our hearts he is real thru forgiveness, grace, mercy, which are all tangible experiences one receives when they truly believe.

 

[Trailblazer]

Why do you think Jesus wants us to pray , “Thy Will be done on earth “?

We’re to pray for it, right?

That means what? That God’s Will isn’t happening right now, until His appointed time.

It means that God's Will was not happening when that verse was recorded. It does not mean that God's Will is not happening now.

We were to pray for God's Will to be done on earth from the time that verse was recorded until the appointed time, when God's Will was done.

 

[Link]

People are expressing love for each other all the time but how is God expressing love towards people?

He has compassion for humans. To merit his pleasure and acceptance, we have to embrace God's Name and Sword and defeat the Satanic sorcery that engulfs the minds and hearts of mankind.

Without fighting out of love and desire for him as well as fear of the consequences of failing, we will not merit his pleasure and love. God is Unseen. The path to him is unseen. If he was too apparent and manifest, there would be no merit in either fearing him or loving him, because it would be all too easy. No one would doubt if God manifested himself like the way he will on the day of judgment. But in such a world, worship of God would hardly mean anything and rewarding spiritually would be hard, and physical pleasures over time are not that enjoyable. We would be bored to death and not really journey to God very much.

Free-will is a potential gift.

Of course, maybe, if God saw that this would be the outcome, he would not have gone with this plan. But the probabilities was neither Satan disobey nor Adam break his resolution and trust nor humans choose the unjust leaders over God's Messengers. When all that happened, perhaps, he did regret creating humans in the first place and the place of trial.

The final push by God was through Mohammad (s), and he trained companions to love Ali (a), and the original believers were tried with heavy trials and they passed most of them, but Surah Auli-Imran shows they too can turn on their backs after Mohammad (S) passes away, and were volatile. It was not expected, but warned and possible, and it unfortunately happened that very few stayed steadfast.

Bani-Israel were patient waiting for Musa (a), but gave their Prophets (a) a hard time, after being saved. Even took a golden statue as a god.

How many Angels have fell from grace to demonic rebels and how many humans have turned away from guidance over a fleeting world to disappear.

God's sustenance is greater and everlasting, but we deplete that and chase Satanic pride, greed, envy, and vying with ourselves over nothing.

How could it be that we give up the inner beauty of God to touch outer beauty? His pleasures of sanctity so we please some animal desires?

God is worth every effort that humans have to go through. His pleasure must be earned as a Lord who has the right to judge us as he alone sees us for who we are.

The truth is Satan doesn't convince himself he hates humans. He does, but that is not what he tells himself. In reality, he just wants people to go to hell but no one can live telling that to themselves. He tells himself that mortal creation in human bodies and matter is bad idea. Before physical world came, beings worshipped God as unseen lights. He tells himself he is a champion for creation and that God Lord of the Worlds is a Jinn that is wrong and must be defeated.

The truth is human creation is a mystery that Angels did not understand. And so how can we? We don't understand it. It's hard to. God knows the purpose, but if he didn't create us, Angels would be full of themselves and worship God in an arrogant way. It's my belief that God would have created us all as Angels (saintly Jinn) if the Angels were humble and we all remained humble. But Satan even surrounded and corrupted the Angels with arrogance before Adam (a). The pride was unacceptable to God and their worship without merit. So he created Adam (a) to try them and humble them. But even Iblis was suppose to pass.

The problem is when you go through the thought that God knew this outcome and created anyways. If I believed that, I would not be able to love God and worship him.

The truth is, God doesn't know the future, but this not out of ignorance, it's out of the fact it's impossible. Future doesn't exist along side God forever like some ignorant people think.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

It means that God's Will was not happening when that verse was recorded. It does not mean that God's Will is not happening now.

We were to pray for God's Will to be done on earth from the time that verse was recorded until the appointed time, when God's Will was done.

It’s still not being done

Revelation 11:18…Has God brought to ruin “those ruining the Earth”?
It’s still being ruined.

Matthew 5:5…”Blessed are the meek, for they will inherit the earth.”
Have the meek ‘inherited the earth’ yet? No.


Has Isaiah 11:6-9 been fulfilled yet? No.

Psalms 37:38… do you see wicked people still around? I do. They make the news everyday!

Are people still in ‘pain & mourning’? (I know you are. Me too, to some degree.) Are people still dying? Then Revelation 21:3,4 has not been fulfilled, either.

There are so many more Scriptures i could use.

No, God’s will for the Earth isn’t being done yet. “As in Heaven”? No way.

What made you think it had been?

 

[Eddi]

People are expressing love for each other all the time but how is God expressing love towards people?

As a Panentheist I believe God is nature and nature is God

Humans are a part of nature therefore humans are parts God

So when one human loves another to me that is an example of there being a loving God, of God being love, of God loving himself

God's love is not something that shines down from Heaven above

Rather it is something humans must bring about amongst themselves

 

[PureX]

The evidence is that love exists.

The faith based theory is that love is God's divine nature being expressed in our reality. That we can love because God's divine spirit exists within us. And the reason this spirit of love is considered divine is because the natural universe would function just fine without it. Love is therefor "extra", and considered superior to the natural world. It is "supra-natural", i.e., 'divine'.

 

[Kenny]

Christians claim that God is Love and Baha’is claim that God is All-Loving, but where is the evidence?

Christians say that the evidence of God’s Love is that God sent Jesus, His only Son, to die for our sins.

Baha’is say God is All-Loving because God sends Messengers and because Baha’u’llah wrote that God is All-Loving.

Anyone can ‘believe’ that God is Love, and maybe those two things above demonstrate God’s Love, but what does God actually do on a regular basis to demonstrate His Love? In my opinion, if God is All-Loving, we should be able to see evidence of that, not only Scriptures that say that God is Love or that God is All-Loving, or Messengers that God sends every 500-1000 years or so.

Nobody can prove that God is Love or that God is All-Loving. I have concluded that what it boils down to is what people are willing to believe. Not only that, I think it is about what people want to believe. People want to believe that God is Love or that God is All-Loving, and I think that is the primary reason they believe that.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

The reason I thought to post this is because I have come to the conclusion that Love is very important, and in fact it is the chief reason why people are happy. I came to realize this by watching a TV show called The Waltons. In that show there is a family of seven children, a mother and a father, and a grandmother and grandfather, all living together in the same big house in rural Virginia. The story takes place during the Great Depression, World War II, and the post-war era. What is so striking about this family is how much love they have for each other and how they demonstrate it. The parents love each other romantically even after having been married for 25 years, the parents love all the children, and all the siblings love each other even though they fight. I can only dream about such a family, since my family was not loving at all.

I think that the reason this family is so happy is because of the love they have for each other. I know what brings happiness to me, feeling and expressing love for other people and animals. People are expressing love for each other all the time but how is God expressing love towards people?

I think we can look at the love for our spouses or love for our children and understand the love of God.

Would I lay down my life for my wife or children because I love them? Yes. Scripturally, no greater love has a man that this, the he lay down his life for another. For us, Jesus laid down His life for all mankind… the greatest love.

If I have genuine love, would I forgive my wife and/or children? Yes. God is love because He forgave all mankind.

And things like unto these.

 

[Trailblazer]

For us, Jesus laid down His life for all mankind… the greatest love.

That's true, but I do not believe that Jesus is God.

 

[Kenny]

That's true, but I do not believe that Jesus is God.

OK.

Do you think that his death on the cross did anything for mankind?