What is your opinion of Jesus?

[Ajax]

You believe there is no soul, that's all.

What do understand this God you refer to, to actually be?

I will explain it to you...
Christianity teaches that the soul has memory, so each person can defend itself during Judgement day. It also claims that the soul enters the body upon conception.
So if the above two dogmas are correct, you should be able, using your soul's memory, to describe us in full detail, what you saw and feel in your mother's womb for 9 months and tell us all your memories from the first 2-3 years of your life.
You can not though because these two Christian dogmas are false. All the memories are stored in our brain and at the first years of our lives (let alone as embryo) our brain isn't fully developed. Which means that when we die and our brain becomes worm food, we won't be able neither to have memories, nor to feel anything.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

If the author of Matthew knew that the Isaiah 7:14 did not mean virgin but young woman, then he is guilty of altering the meaning of Isaiah in order to present his idea of immaculate conception. If he didn't know, then he was ignorant and unsuited to present Old Testament prophecies.

Or, it was midrash which recognized that any jungfrau worthy of serving as a sign was, almost by definition, a virgin.

Suggesting that the author was either devious or dumb is dumb or devious.

BTW, this Forward article is worth considering.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

I will explain it to you...
Christianity teaches that the soul has memory, so each person can defend itself during Judgement day. It also claims that the soul enters the body upon conception.
So if the above two dogmas are correct, you should be able, using your soul's memory, to describe us in full detail, what you saw and feel in your mother's womb for 9 months and tell us all your memories from the first 2-3 years of your life.
You can not though because these two Christian dogmas are false. All the memories are stored in our brain and at the first years of our lives (let alone as embryo) our brain isn't fully developed. Which means that when we die and our brain becomes worm food, we won't be able neither to have memories, nor to feel anything.I as

Soul is at a different level of existence than the ego self, one is eternal and the other is temporal. I as Ben am not the soul, but am a temporary expression of it.

 

[Ajax]

Or, it was midrash which recognized that any jungfrau worthy of serving as a sign was, almost by definition, a virgin.

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, not midrash interpretation.

In any case. when I write against Matthew, I'm not that much concerned about the word parthenos or almah or whatever.. I'm more concerned that having read the whole passage, the author should have been 100% able to understand from the very detailed and explicit context, that it was a sign for king Ahaz to see and had nothing to do with a birth of a child 600 years later.
Therefore the author of the gospel was either dishonest, or dumb. And because very few people, especially authors, are dumb, I put my money on the dishonesty.

 

[Ajax]

Soul is at a different level of existence than the ego self, one is eternal and the other is temporal. I as Ben am not the soul, but am a temporary expression of it.

I do not believe there is a soul as Christianity teaches because 1) is useless, as all its supposed functions are in fact brain functions and 2) the Christian dogma regarding soul is debunked, as I showed you earlier.
If you have any solid evidence of the existence of soul, I will be glad to accept it. I presume though you understand that somebody saying that there is soul, or that many people believe in it, is not evidence at all.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

I do not believe there is a soul as Christianity teaches because 1) is useless, as all its supposed functions are in fact brain functions and 2) the Christian dogma regarding soul is debunked, as I showed you earlier.
If you have any solid evidence of the existence of soul, I will be glad to accept it. I presume though you understand that somebody saying that there is soul, or that many people believe in it, is not evidence at all.

As I said, your belief is not evidence there is no soul.
Religion is not meant to be about belief, but realization.
There can never be any direct scientific evidence for a soul for Soul is spirit, not matter. Science can only detect universal physical substance which constitutes only 5% of the universe in terms of mass, it is only aware of the other 95% indirectly via Casimir Effect, Gravity measurements, etc..

 

[Ajax]

As I said, your belief is not evidence there is no soul.

I wrote about the Christian theory of soul and is a good indication, if not evidence, that does not exist.

Religion is not meant to be about belief, but realization.

Again I wrote about the Christian soul... John 11:25-26 "He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live."

There can never be any direct scientific evidence for a soul for Soul is spirit, not matter. Science can only detect universal physical substance which constitutes only 5% of the universe in terms of mass, it is only aware of the other 95% indirectly via Casimir Effect, Gravity measurements, etc..

The fact that we do not know yet about the vast majority of the universe, does not mean that we can invent and believe things which are unexplainable, invisible, immaterial, unproven and useless.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

I wrote about the Christian theory of soul and is a good indication, if not evidence, that does not exist.

Again I wrote about the Christian soul... John 11:25-26 "He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live."


The fact that we do not know yet about the vast majority of the universe, does not mean that we can invent and believe things which are unexplainable, invisible, immaterial, unproven and useless.

Ok, thank you Ajax for the exchange, I wish you well in your endeavors to understand religion.

 

[1213]

I don't think it is because of the teachings of Jesus. His teachings are very good.
I think it is because of the Bible and all that is claimed about Jesus, what Jesus allegedly said and did.

That may be true. And I think it is not a good reason. If the teachings are good, I think there is no good reason to reject them.

 

[Ajax]

Ok, thank you Ajax for the exchange, I wish you well in your endeavors to understand religion.

Thank you too Ben, all the best.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, not midrash interpretation.

And extraordinary pedantry deserves extraordinary contempt.

 

[Ajax]

And extraordinary pedantry deserves extraordinary contempt.

We are all entitled to our thoughts. Don't be so spiteful because you can not answer.

 

[Firenze]

And extraordinary pedantry deserves extraordinary contempt.

Where's the pedantry in pointing out errors in scripture? You think promoting a virgin birth if none actually existed and teaching a lie to generations of children is a minor detail?

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

There's a big difference in the promises given by a car salesman, and those given by the creator of the universe.
An even bigger difference in the ability to deliver on those promises.

When the creator of the universe makes some promises, I'll have to remember this.

I've seen lots of promises made by people who claim to speak for the creator of the universe, but that isn't quite the same thing.

 

[PearlSeeker]

Christianity teaches that the soul has memory, so each person can defend itself during Judgement day. It also claims that the soul enters the body upon conception.
So if the above two dogmas are correct, you should be able, using your soul's memory, to describe us in full detail, what you saw and feel in your mother's womb for 9 months and tell us all your memories from the first 2-3 years of your life.
You can not though because these two Christian dogmas are false. All the memories are stored in our brain and at the first years of our lives (let alone as embryo) our brain isn't fully developed. Which means that when we die and our brain becomes worm food, we won't be able neither to have memories, nor to feel anything.

Even when the body is not fully developed it stores information. Also in DNA... Not all memories are encoded as narratives. Even if we can’t explicitly remember specific events, their accumulation nevertheless leaves lasting traces.

Information can be stored at (and transfered to) different storage media. For example when your hard disk bites the dust you can still have a back up copy in a cloud storage. If there is a same thing for our personal experiences/memories then there is a soul that can transcend a physical death.

 

[Ajax]

Even when the body is not fully developed it stores information. Also in DNA... Not all memories are encoded as narratives. Even if we can’t explicitly remember specific events, their accumulation nevertheless leaves lasting traces.

Information can be stored at (and transfered to) different storage media. For example when your hard disk bites the dust you can still have a back up copy in a cloud storage. If there is a same thing for our personal experiences/memories then there is a soul that can transcend a physical death.

Perhaps then you can describe your memories as an embryo and as 1-2 years old person from the backup in your soul. What? No?
Seriously though, memories cannot be passed down genetically. The idea that memories or traits can be passed down from one generation to another through DNA or genetics is known as Lamarckian inheritance, but this idea has been discredited by modern science. Amnesia is a deficit in memory caused by brain damage or brain diseases. Probably the only information that can be stored in a child up to 1-2 years old is the face of the mother/father, due to the repeated exposure to them and even that takes some time. Around 5–6 years of age is thought to be when autobiographical memory seems to stabilize and be on par with adults.
How does the brain store memories?

 

[Trailblazer]

I wrote about the Christian theory of soul and is a good indication, if not evidence, that does not exist.

What about other theories of the soul? Christianity is not the only religion in the world.

The fact that we do not know yet about the vast majority of the universe, does not mean that we can invent and believe things which are unexplainable, invisible, immaterial, unproven and useless.

We can believe things that are invisible, immaterial, and unproven. The soul is not unexplainable, nor is it useless.

 

[Ajax]

What about other theories of the soul? Christianity is not the only religion in the world.

I have not studied what other religions say about soul, but I think all believe in some version of a “self”, variously named, which survives death.

We can believe things that are invisible, immaterial, and unproven. The soul is not unexplainable, nor is it useless.

Yes, you are right, there are things which can be invisible, immaterial, and unproven, but they can be observed by various means whilst others have been extensively studied and supported by empirical evidence,. The soul can not be observed neither be supported by any evidence.

Would you care to explain the soul with valid arguments? Also why it is not useless with regard to it's contribution to the human body?

 

[IndigoChild5559]

I'm curious on why people don't believe in Jesus?

I have nothing in particular against Jesus -- he was a nice Jewish man. But I see no reason to "believe in him."

To start with, we really know very little about him. The four gospels are basically collections of legends about him that had grown up orally in the decades after his death. So like, virgin birth? Healing a blind man? Walking on water? Never happened. I find it doubtful that he said many of the things that the various authors attribute to him as well.

As to his claim to be the messiah, he is excluded from the possibility due to lack of fulfilling the messianic prophecies. For example, he never fulfilled this one:
Isaiah 2:4
And He shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people; and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruning hooks; nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war anymore.

As far as the claim that he is God, my own religious text is pretty emphatic that God is not a man.
Numbers 23:19 God is not a man...nor a son of man.
1 Samuel 15:29 for he is not a man
Hosea 11:9 I am God and not a man
Job 9:32 For he is not a man

 

[IndigoChild5559]

I have not studied what other religions say about soul, but I think all believe in some version of a “self”, variously named, which survives death.

Actually, I have known quite a few religious Jews who don't believe in any sort of afterlife at all. I'm not saying all Jews. Obviously our opinions vary.