What Role Do Your Emotions Play in Your Spirituality?

[Sunstone]

What role do your emotions play in your spirituality?

Before going further... yes, I fully realize this is RF and that our resident pettifoggers will be all over the title question as fast as flies on the fresh droppings of mountain goats, demanding to know what 'spirituality' means in this context, what 'emotions' are, and whether the promised 'role' will be served buttered or with olive oil. Yes. Yes, I know all of that -- in large part because I myself am one of RF's leading pettifoggers.

After all, Voltaire had a point when he said, "If you wish to converse with me, first define your terms".

So, let's get it over with. First, the commonsense disclaimer: News Flash: You are free to define your terms as you see fit (D'uh!), but please have the courtesy to make your meanings clear -- either implicitly or explicitly -- if you are using any terms in unconventional, 'non-dictionary' ways.

Next, the key term in dire need of definition here is "spirituality", is it not? I mean, the other terms are being used more or less in accordance with the deity-sanctioned Webster's and Oxford English Dictionaries, so no real need to define them (I hope).

Well, here goes then: In this context, 'spirituality' refers to the degree and manner in which a person manages, deals, or copes with their psychological self. And 'psychological self' refers to the thing you have been referencing nearly all your life when you refer to "I". "me", "myself", etc. That is, your psychological self is whatever it is that is 'you' as distinct from 'not-you'. e.g. if you think of 'you' as your thoughts, feelings, values, talents, and magazine subscriptions, then that is your psychological self (henceforth, just 'self') for the purposes of this thread.

For example, padawans, suppose you are one of those folks who self-identifies with a football team. Anyone who insults the team, insults you. When the team wins, you win. When the team loses, you lose. etc. etc. To one extent or another, you behave as if the team and you are the same thing. Suppose that were the case. Then that would be an example of the degree and manner in which you manage, deal, or cope with your 'self'.​

Again, for example, suppose you are one of those folks who self-identifies as a loving, caring spouse. Further suppose you goof up and say something hurtful to your spouse. Since you self-identify with being a loving, caring spouse, how you reconcile that self-image to your behavior of having goofed up will be indicative of how you manage, deal with, or cope with your self.​

To repeat: You are free to define 'spiritual' however you wish -- just please make clear how you are defining it.​

Do you have any intelligent questions now? More to the point, do you expect a dumbo like me to be capable of answering an intelligent question? What are you, some kind of gushing fountain of naivety?

So, with all of that said...

What role do your emotions play in your spirituality?

Specifically, in your spiritual progress? That is, in your becoming more and more skillful at managing, dealing with, or coping with your self?

In general, are your emotions your allies or your enemies in furthering the skillfulness with which you manage your self?

Do you self-identify with your emotions? Do you consider them part of 'you'?​

Also, please feel free to ask and/or answer any questions that are relevant to the topic and which you yourself think might be of interest to others.

Thank you for your time, patience, and any cake recipes you chose to PM me with.

 

[Nakosis]

So, with all of that said...

What role do your emotions play in your spirituality?

Specifically, in your spiritual progress? That is, in your becoming more and more skillful at managing, dealing with, or coping with your self?

In general, are your emotions your allies or your enemies in furthering the skillfulness with which you manage your self?

Do you self-identify with your emotions? Do you consider them part of 'you'?​

Spirituality, IMO, is about learning to trigger positive emotions.

I've learned to be happy/calm/content most of the time. It's a skill, I suppose. Something that took proctice.

Emotions can be your enemy. I don't see them as allies however. They are just physiological processes I can learn to control.

Obviously, my emotions are a part of me. They can drive me/motivate me, sometimes in good ways, sometimes bad. I no longer self identify with them. I see them as tools I can use to help me cope with life.

 

[Secret Chief]

What role do your emotions play in your spirituality?

Specifically, in your spiritual progress? That is, in your becoming more and more skillful at managing, dealing with, or coping with your self?

Negative ones (eg anger, greed, conceit, jealosy) are to be minimised or at least allowed to pass unacted upon. Don't know how I'm doing on the progress front...

In general, are your emotions your allies or your enemies in furthering the skillfulness with which you manage your self?

They are the grist for the mill.

Do you self-identify with your emotions? Do you consider them part of 'you'?

Yes. They are a part of "me."


All that with no questions about definitions. How good is that?

 

[Eyes to See]

Greetings!

When it comes to serving the true God Jehovah we are told to do it with our "power of reason:"

"Therefore, I appeal to you by the compassions of God, brothers, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, a sacred service with your power of reason."-Romans 12:1.

The NWT study Bible has some interesting information on this term "power of reason":

"The expression “power of reason” is translated from the Greek word lo·gi·kosʹ. In this context, it conveys the idea of sacred service rendered in a “logical,” “rational,” or “intelligent,” manner. One lexicon defines it as “pert[aining] to being carefully thought through, thoughtful.” Christians are often called on to weigh Bible principles carefully. They need to understand how Bible principles relate to one another and to decisions under consideration. They can use their God-given power of reason, or thinking abilities, to make balanced decisions that will have Jehovah’s approval and blessing. This way of worship was a change for many Jews who had become Christians. They had previously lived their life following the many rules dictated by tradition."

The Greek word logikos where we get our word logical from, or intelligent is used here when referring to serving Jehovah. So it is not based on emotion, or feeling. Then of course you have the contrast made there between the Jewish role of just following so many oral laws and regulations that developed over time and became tradition. Jesus said of this:

"So you have made the word of God invalid because of your tradition."-Matthew 15:6.

And it is not emotional like some of the evangelical and other movements that put more emphasis on feeling the spirit, and singing, and gyrating, and not really using rationality in their service.

True service to Jehovah God is not dictated by sentimentality, or emotions, but on logic, as we use our power of reason.

 

[Rival]

What role do your emotions play in your spirituality?

I have a different definition of spirituality. I'm using it to mean how I connect with myself and with the Divine, but the latter moreso. When I want to connect through prayer, my aim is to throw away as much rationality as possible. Prayer isn't a rational concept. I'm not even sure that connecting to G-d is a rational concept in the way that most people would define the word 'rational 'today. I have realised this somewhat for a while now, but one thing that happened gave me a higher understanding of this.

I connect well to myself in dreams, often lucid dream, am more aware than usual in dreams and so on. I have come to prefer the dreamtime to the waking one.

I had a dream during a part of which I was stranded on a kind of wooden pier in the middle of a sea. To my right was a Victorian prison I couldn't or more likely wouldn't swim to, as I had escaped it also. So I'm sitting on this pier, no help available, and realising I'm likely going to starve to death. My first thought wasn't trying to contact anyone, or swim away or anything else, I just yelled to Hashem for help, G-d help me! Send some people! Help me! And so He sent some people, nearly right that moment.

I awoke from that dream realising that if I want to connect to The Creator, I need to accept that life is absurd and the only way to respond to it is with another kind of, but more productive, absurdity. I harness the emotions strongly, the feelings, the heartaches, the pangs, the guilt, the soul workings, and forget everything else. The soul is beyond the natural, it's beyond the reason, so it needs to go beyond these things to connect to its Source. Emotion is the vehicle for this, as well as the dreamworld, and everything else most folks would like to throw out in the modern age.

Specifically, in your spiritual progress? That is, in your becoming more and more skillful at managing, dealing with, or coping with your self?

I think I have become better at it once I realised that emotions are morally neutral and can be dealt with using any number of creative ways. Once we stop looking at them through our modern scientific paradigm, we can come to hate them less, and therefore the self, less, and start working on them in a much healthier way. I do think the above written has helped me a lot.

In general, are your emotions your allies or your enemies in furthering the skillfulness with which you manage your self?

Allies.

Do you self-identify with your emotions? Do you consider them part of 'you'?

I do.

 

[Sunstone]

All that with no questions about definitions. How good is that?

Outstanding! But are you really from around these parts? You sure you're not a Russian hacker who's hijacked our Secret Chief's account? Just checking for a friend.

 

[Secret Chief]

Outstanding! But are you really from around these parts? You sure you're not a Russian hacker who's hijacked our Secret Chief's account? Just checking for a friend.

I know, it's hard to believe. I did have to suppress the urge to clarify what you meant by mountain goat.

 

[Hellbound Serpiente]

What role do your emotions play in your spirituality.

One of the most decisive role [if not the most decisive role]. They are like fuel to the engine of my self.

Specifically, in your spiritual progress?That is, in your becoming more and more skillful at managing, dealing with, or coping with your self?

They serve like a fuel spurring me towards making a spiritual progress [i.e. living a spiritually good and morally upright life] or they serve like gravity dragging me towards serving my lowly, base self [my ego], thus making me live a egoistic life that breeds destruction and harm, and morally unrighteous life.

In general, are your emotions your allies or your enemies in furthering the skillfulness with which you manage your self

Both, and neither. They are like double-edged sword. If I use them correctly and wisely, they can destroy my obstacles. If I don't use them correctly and wisely, they can cause harm to me. They are like accelerator in a car. If you use the accelerator wisely, you can reach your destination in the most cost-effective way. If you use them inefficiently, you can crash your car.

Do you self-identify with your emotions? Do you consider them part of 'you'?

No. Like fuel to the car, they come and go. They are born by my inner and outer forces, and can stay for a specific period, but they aren't me. Much like fuel, it ends. But, you need emotions just like car needs fuel.

 

[Sunstone]

@Rival, thanks for a well-thought out response to the OP that, however, neglected to include a cake recipe. Yet, tragic oversights aside, it was a fascinating read.

Once we stop looking at them through our modern scientific paradigm
/QUOTE]

I think I might have an approximate idea of what you mean by "modern scientific paradigm". Would I be correct to think you mean something along the lines of a view of nature confined to that which can be inter-subjectively verified? Anywhere in that ballpark?

 

[Sunstone]

I know, it's hard to believe. I did have to suppress the urge to clarify what you meant by mountain goat.

Thank the gods! That would have stumped me!

 

[Sunstone]

Spirituality, IMO, is about learning to trigger positive emotions.

Thank you so much for that! I was wondering if anyone held a view of spirituality along those lines. It's quite an interesting one!

 

[Sunstone]

Greetings!

When it comes to serving the true God Jehovah we are told to do it with our "power of reason:"

"Therefore, I appeal to you by the compassions of God, brothers, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, a sacred service with your power of reason."-Romans 12:1.

The NWT study Bible has some interesting information on this term "power of reason":

"The expression “power of reason” is translated from the Greek word lo·gi·kosʹ. In this context, it conveys the idea of sacred service rendered in a “logical,” “rational,” or “intelligent,” manner. One lexicon defines it as “pert[aining] to being carefully thought through, thoughtful.” Christians are often called on to weigh Bible principles carefully. They need to understand how Bible principles relate to one another and to decisions under consideration. They can use their God-given power of reason, or thinking abilities, to make balanced decisions that will have Jehovah’s approval and blessing. This way of worship was a change for many Jews who had become Christians. They had previously lived their life following the many rules dictated by tradition."

The Greek word logikos where we get our word logical from, or intelligent is used here when referring to serving Jehovah. So it is not based on emotion, or feeling. Then of course you have the contrast made there between the Jewish role of just following so many oral laws and regulations that developed over time and became tradition. Jesus said of this:

"So you have made the word of God invalid because of your tradition."-Matthew 15:6.

And it is not emotional like some of the evangelical and other movements that put more emphasis on feeling the spirit, and singing, and gyrating, and not really using rationality in their service.

True service to Jehovah God is not dictated by sentimentality, or emotions, but on logic, as we use our power of reason.

Thank you for such a thought-provoking response!

Among other things, it brings to mind the passage in John where Christ is identified (?) as the logos. Is "identified" the right word?

 

[Sunstone]

Negative ones (eg anger, greed, conceit, jealosy) are to be minimised or at least allowed to pass unacted upon.

That's pretty much what I end up doing, too. At least, when I'm not throwing a childish temper tantrum instead of allowing them to pass, that's pretty much how I too deal with negative emotions.

 

[Rival]

@Rival, thanks for a well-thought out response to the OP that, however, neglected to include a cake recipe. Yet, tragic oversights aside, it was a fascinating read. I think I might have an approximate idea of what you mean by "modern scientific paradigm". Would I be correct to think you mean something along the lines of a view of nature confined to that which can be inter-subjectively verified? Anywhere in that ballpark?

Basically yes.

 

[Sunstone]

One of the most decisive role [if not the most decisive role]. They are like fuel to the engine of my self.



They serve like a fuel spurring me towards making a spiritual progress [i.e. living a spiritually good and morally upright life] or they serve like gravity dragging me towards serving my lowly, base self [my ego], thus making me live a egoistic life that breeds destruction and harm, and morally unrighteous life.




Both, and neither. They are like double-edged sword. If I use them correctly and wisely, they can destroy my obstacles. If I don't use them correctly and wisely, they can cause harm to me. They are like accelerator in a car. If you use the accelerator wisely, you can reach your destination in the most cost-effective way. If you use them inefficiently, you can crash your car.



No. Like fuel to the car, they come and go. They are born by my inner and outer forces, and can stay for a specific period, but they aren't me. Much like fuel, it ends. But, you need emotions just like car needs fuel.

Thanks for a clear and concise response --- to say nothing of thought-provoking! I love the metaphors you used -- very apt ones.

Reminds me of the study done some years ago in California on people with brain injuries that prevented them from feeling emotions. The researchers found those people had extraordinary difficulty prioritizing what they should be doing. For example, should they immediately leave a burning house, or should they try to first rescue some item from it? It was so hard for them to make such decisions! They couldn't figure out the relevant importance to them of different things or courses of action.

 

[Sunstone]

Basically yes.

I GOT IT RIGHT! I WIN! I WIN!

Can I claim my first place lollipop now?

 

[Rival]

I GOT IT RIGHT! I WIN! I WIN!

Can I claim my first place lollipop now?

 

[Rival]

That's pretty much what I end up doing, too. At least, when I'm not throwing a childish temper tantrum instead of allowing them to pass, that's pretty much how I too deal with negative emotions.

I have a slightly different view. Some folks can come across as angry or temperamental. I prefer to think of it as 'passion', in the broader, more original sense. For me it's more how that emotion is used; how that feeling is displayed. For instance, a person may have a temper but also be prone to people pleasing. He can use this passion to offset his desire to please everyone, by allowing it to surface and lead him to be able to debate passionately rather than lay down and be too accommodating. He can use that angry passion in good ways if he harnesses it.

 

[osgart]

Definitely making the effort to channel positive emotions. Negative emotions are just warning signs. I would be foolish if I didn't question the truth value of my emotions I feel.

Peaceful emotions are the most reliable.

My understanding of things is in direct correlation to my feelings.

 

[SalixIncendium]

Using the definitions given in the OP of spirituality and self (even though personally, my view differs regarding the "you" and "not-you." But we'll talk about the pragmatic me for the purpose of this discussion).

What role do your emotions play in your spirituality?

My emotions can and have been a hinderance and have led to suffering, primarily because emotions are, for the most part, if not all, a product of ego.

Specifically, in your spiritual progress? That is, in your becoming more and more skillful at managing, dealing with, or coping with your self?

The tool that had the greatest experience in managing my ego, and thereby, my emotions, was The Four Agreements, which are a part of Toltec philosophy. For those not familiar with them, they are:

• Be impeccable with you word
• Don't take anything personally
  
• Don't make assumptions
• Always do your best.

These, along with meditative and contemplative practice, gave me the skills to manage and cope with my self.

In general, are your emotions your allies or your enemies in furthering the skillfulness with which you manage your self?

They can be either. It depends entirely on how they are managed.

Do you self-identify with your emotions? Do you consider them part of 'you'?

Pragmatically, yes, my emotions are a part of me.