What the Bible teaches about the holy spirit

[Eli G]

Jehovah's Witnesses conceive of the spirit of Jehovah (or holy spirit or spirit of God) spoken of in the Bible as a force whose primary source is Jehovah God. Trinitarians, on the other hand, consider that this "spirit" is a third person, who together with Jehovah and Jesus in heaven, make up a god made up of three individual persons, and which they call "Trinity".

I opened this topic to share some interesting information that the Scriptures contain about the spirit of God, and that can help many to have an exact idea of what it is based on biblical information, and not according to traditions. Obviously, the information can be analyzed and the interpretation of the facts can be debated by whoever thinks they have more relevant biblical information about it, especially if that analysis is also based on the biblical Scriptures.

The first thing I want to share is that in the Bible, the holy spirit can be distributed, divided into parts, removed from one person and placed in several or vice versa. This characteristic of the holy spirit shows that it cannot be a person, otherwise that person would be fragmented. The first text that I am going to show to support this is the following:

Heb.2:4
συνεπιμαρτυρουντος __ joined in bearing witness
του θεου __ God
σημειοις __ with signs
τε και τερασιν __ and wonders
και ποικιλαις δυναμεσιν __ and various powerful works
και πνευματος αγιου __ and of [the] holy spirit
μερισμοις __ distributions
κατα την αυτου θελησιν __ according to his will

Paul is talking about how serious is to pay more than the usual attention to the things they have heard, since God himself joined in bearing witness with the holy spirit distributed according to his (God's) will.

This is not the only case in which it is shown that the holy spirit is distributed, and in future comments I will continue to show more biblical information about it.

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

"God" is a spirit. "God" is holy. "God" is the only spirit that is holy. "God" is the holy spirit.

 

[Eli G]

When Jehovah chose Moses as the leader of Israel, he filled him with holy spirit so that he could perform the mighty works he did, with Jehovah's strength and power:

Is.63:10 But they rebelled and grieved his holy spirit.
He then turned into their enemy,
And he fought against them.
11 And they remembered the days of old,
The days of Moses his servant:
“Where is the One who brought them up out of the sea with the shepherds of his flock?
Where is the One who put within him His holy spirit,
12 The One who made His glorious arm go with the right hand of Moses,
The One who split the waters before them
To make an everlasting name for himself,
13 The One who made them walk through the surging waters,
So that they walked without stumbling,
Like a horse in the open country?
14 Just like livestock when they go down into the valley plain,
The spirit of Jehovah made them rest.”
This is how you led your people,
To make a majestic name for yourself.

When the burden of Israel's leadership became heavy so that Moses couldn't bear it alone, Jehovah took part of that spirit that he had put in him and distributed it among seventy Israelites so that they would have the authority and power of God to direct and make important decisions and other deeds in Israel:

Num. 11:16 Jehovah replied to Moses: “Gather for me 70 men from the elders of Israel, men whom you recognize as elders and officials of the people, and take them to the tent of meeting, and have them stand there with you. 17 I will come down and speak with you there, and I will take away some of the spirit that is on you and place it on them, and they will help you in bearing the burden of the people so that you may not have to bear it alone."

After Jehovah deposited part of the holy spirit that He had placed in Moses in other Israelites, several who were not in the same place also received a portion. This is what Scripture tells us:

Num 11:26 There were two of the men still in the camp. Their names were Elʹdad and Meʹdad. And the spirit began to settle down on them, as they were among those whose names had been written down, but they had not gone out to the tent. So they began to behave as prophets in the camp. 27 And a young man ran and reported to Moses: “Elʹdad and Meʹdad are behaving as prophets in the camp!” 28 Then Joshua the son of Nun, the minister of Moses from his youth, responded and said: “My lord Moses, restrain them!” 29 But Moses said to him: “Are you jealous for me? No, I wish that all of Jehovah’s people were prophets and that Jehovah would put his spirit on them!”

This biblical account shows us once again that the spirit of God is not a person.

 

[pearl]

He is given the title “Giver of Life” as his role is always to bring life. The Holy Spirit is the one who is breathed into the dust of the earth to create man and hovers over the waters at the beginning of creation. By bringing life, the Holy Spirit brings God’s life in touch with God’s creation.

 

[nPeace]

"God" is a spirit. "God" is holy. "God" is the only spirit that is holy. "God" is the holy spirit.

That's some bit of reasoning you've got going on there. Only, are you positive it's right?
Mark 8:38

 

[paradox]

Trinitarians, on the other hand, consider that this "spirit" is a third person

I think your confusion is that "person" does not mean separation of a God, but rather revelation of God.

 

[Eli G]

I think your confusion is that "person" does not mean separation of a God, but rather revelation of God.

I think you are not talking about what this topic is about.
Have you read my posts?

Do you think that although the Bible clearly states that the spirit of God is distributed by God (read my posts before), it is logical to think that it is a person, as Trinitarians say?

Some similar words in the Bible help to understand what μερισμοις in Heb. 2:4 means:

μερίζω:

τοὺς δύο ἰχθύας ἐμέρισεν πᾶσιν __ he divided up the two fish for all (Mark 6:41)

πᾶσα βασιλεία μερισθεῖσα καθ’ἑαυτῆς __ Every kingdom divided against itself (Mat.12:25)

μερίσασθαι μετ’ ἐμοῦ τὴν κληρονομίαν __ to divide the inheritance with me (Luke 12:13)

μεμέρισται ὁ Χριστός __ Is the Christ divided? (1Cor.1:13)

διαμερίζω:

τὰ κτήματα καὶ τὰς ὑπάρξεις ἐπίπρασκον καὶ διεμέριζον αὐτὰ πᾶσιν καθότι ἄν τις χρείαν εἶχεν __ they were selling their possessions and properties and distributing the proceeds to all, according to what each one needed. (Acts 2:45)

διαμεριζόμεναι γλῶσσαι ὡσεὶ πυρός __ tongues as if of fire became visible to them and were distributed (Acts 2:3)

μεριστής

τίς με κατέστησεν κριτὴν ἢ μεριστήν; __ who appointed me judge or apportioner over you? (Luke12:14)

 

[paradox]

Do you think that although the Bible clearly states that the spirit of God is distributed by God (read my posts before), it is logical to think that it is a person, as Trinitarians say?

There is no need to post in hebrew unless we don't agree on translation:
According to Hebrews 2:4 it's distribution of the gifts of the holy Spirit, rather than distribution of holy spirit.

 

[Eli G]

There is no need to post in hebrew unless we don't agree on translation:
According to Hebrews 2:4 it's distribution of the gifts of the holy Spirit, rather than distribution of holy spirit.

???? Who is posting in hebrew?
Did you check on my post where I quoted the original Greek text in Heb. 2:4?

Are you playing some game in my topic? My thread is a very serious topic for all who consider Christians themselves, and it takes me a lot of time and effort to do my Bible research to post here, so please, be serious if you're going to comment here. Thanks in advance.

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

That's some bit of reasoning you've got going on there. Only, are you positive it's right?
Mark 8:38

I Samuel 2:2

 

[RabbiO]

???? Who is posting in hebrew?

I think it is safe to assume that @paradox has demonstrated that neither Greek nor Hebrew is a language with which he is familiar.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

"God" is a spirit. "God" is holy. "God" is the only spirit that is holy. "God" is the holy spirit.

True, God is a spirit person, God is holy, and God sends forth His spirit according to Psalms 104:30.
God sends forth a ' neuter ' "IT" at Numbers 11:17,25 KJV, thus God's spirit is a neuter 'it' and Not a person.
Even in English we speak of a car or a ship as a 'she' but they remain a neuter 'it'.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

I Samuel 2:2

1 Samuel 2:2 in connection to Exodus 15:11; Deuteronomy 4:35; Psalms 86:8; Psalms 89:6

 

[URAVIP2ME]

He is given the title “Giver of Life” as his role is always to bring life. The Holy Spirit is the one who is breathed into the dust of the earth to create man and hovers over the waters at the beginning of creation. By bringing life, the Holy Spirit brings God’s life in touch with God’s creation.

Yes, the word Father means Life Giver.
I find No mention of God's spirit being used at Genesis 2:7.
I find No mention of God's spirit being used at Acts of the Apostles 17:25.

 

[nPeace]

I Samuel 2:2

1 Samuel 2:2 There is none holy as the Lord: for there is none beside thee: neither is there any rock like our God.

Does that say the angels are not holy? Does it say Paul is lying?
It says neither.
It says there is none holy like / as the Lord / God.
In other words, none can compare, and that's obvious, because only Jehovah is holy to the superlative degree.

Even in mightiness, there is none mighty like Jehovah, but that doesn't mean they are not mighty.
Neither does it mean they are not holy.

Why not examine your reasoning against scripture, and see if it stands up.
1 Samuel 2:2 says, in the latter part. 'neither is there any rock like our God.'
Does that mean there is no rock besides God?
That would make - not only Paul but - Jesus, a liar.
Matthew 16:15-18
However, that is not the case.

Suppose though, that the text did say, "There is none holy, but you alone.", would that make it okay to dismiss Mark's statement "when he comes in the glory of his Father with the holy angels."? Luke's - "when he comes in his glory and that of the Father and of the holy angels."?
...and all the scriptures in Daniel, and Paul's 13 letters, as well as Peter's and James' that mentions the saints - ἁγίων?
ἁγίων - hagios: sacred, holy

No. We would consider the fact that the word is used in context to highlight or magnify God as most holy.

So first, understanding what we read is important. Second, considering the context is important, and third, not relying on our reasoning, but rather sticking to scriptures is important.

It would be nice to see you address @Eli G's point in the OP, and explain how a person can be split into fragments as mentioned... and poured out like liquid, as well.

 

[Eli G]

Jehovah told Elijah that Elisha would be his successor as prophet, and he should go and find him and show him that he had been chosen as his helper and substitute (1 Kings 19:16). Elijah did so, and when Elisha realized his privilege, he immediately killed his bulls, fed his people, said goodbye to them, and followed Elijah (1 Kings 19:19-21).

When Jehovah had decided to move Elijah to another region, Elijah tried to leave without Elisha following him, but Elisha would not let him (2 Kings 2:1-8). When Elijah was saying goodbye to Elisha, he told him to make a wish before being separated from him. This is what happened:

2 Kings 2:9 As soon as they had gone across, E·liʹjah said to E·liʹsha: “Ask what you want me to do for you before I am taken from you.” So E·liʹsha said: “Please, may I receive a double portion of your spirit?” 10 He replied: “You have asked a difficult thing. If you see me when I am taken from you, it will happen for you that way; but if you do not, it will not happen.”
11 As they were walking along, speaking as they walked, suddenly a fiery chariot and fiery horses made a separation between the two of them, and E·liʹjah ascended to the heavens in the windstorm. 12 While E·liʹsha was watching, he was crying out: “My father, my father! The chariot of Israel and his horsemen!” When he could no longer see him, he took hold of his own garments and ripped them into two pieces. 13 After that he picked up the official garment of E·liʹjah that had fallen off him and went back and stood by the bank of the Jordan. 14 Then he took the official garment of E·liʹjah that had fallen off him and struck the waters and said: “Where is Jehovah, the God of E·liʹjah?” When he struck the waters, they were divided to the left and to the right, so that E·liʹsha went across.
15 When the sons of the prophets at Jerʹi·cho saw him from a distance, they said: “The spirit of E·liʹjah has settled down on E·liʹsha.” So they went to meet him and bowed down to the ground before him. 16 They said to him: “Here are 50 capable men with your servants. Let them go, please, to look for your master. Perhaps the spirit of Jehovah has lifted him up and then thrown him on one of the mountains or in one of the valleys.” But he said: “Do not send them.” 17 However, they kept urging him until he was embarrassed, so he said: “Send them.” They sent the 50 men, who kept looking for three days but did not find him. 18 When they returned to him, he was staying in Jerʹi·cho. Then he said to them: “Did I not tell you not to go?”

Elisha asked Elijah to give him "a doble portion" of the spirit that was deposited in him. Elijah told him that it was very difficult for him, but that if he could see him when he was separated from his side, then it meant that he was going to receive what he had asked for.

Elijah could not take out the holy spirit and give it to Elisha; only Jehovah could do that. That is why Elijah put that condition on it; obviously, if Jehovah allowed it to happen, then it meant that he had approved and agreed to Elisha's request. It turned out that Elisha was able to see Elijah when he was raised to heaven, so he received doble portion of the spirit that had been deposited in Elijah ... and he could immediately verify it for himself, and all those who saw him.

This is another scriptural demonstration, similar to that of Moses mentioned before, that the holy spirit can be distributed in portions, taken from some and put into others, etc., at the will of Jehovah, confirming once again that the holy spirit IS NOT a person ... otherwise that supposed person would be being fragmented, since the Scripture says clearly that Elisha asked for two portions of the spirit that was in Elijah.

 

[pearl]

I find No mention of God's spirit being used at Genesis 2:7.

and the earth was without form or shape, with darkness over the abyss and a mighty wind sweeping over the waters Gen 1:2
then the LORD God formed the man* out of the dust of the ground and blew into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being. Gen 2"7
The Spirit of God is often likened to the wind, which blows where it wills

 

[nPeace]

and the earth was without form or shape, with darkness over the abyss and a mighty wind sweeping over the waters Gen 1:2
then the LORD God formed the man* out of the dust of the ground and blew into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being. Gen 2"7
The Spirit of God is often likened to the wind, which blows where it wills

That sounds correct.
It makes the point clear too... that the holy spirit is not a person, but force in motion, or active force.
Thanks for that.

Tell me if there is anything here which you don't agree with.

*** it-2 p. 1017 Spirit ***
The Greek pneuʹma (spirit) comes from pneʹo, meaning “breathe or blow,” and the Hebrew ruʹach (spirit) is believed to come from a root having the same meaning. Ruʹach and pneuʹma, then, basically mean “breath” but have extended meanings beyond that basic sense. (Compare Hab 2:19; Re 13:15.) They can also mean wind; the vital force in living creatures; one’s spirit; spirit persons, including God and his angelic creatures; and God’s active force, or holy spirit. (Compare Koehler and Baumgartner’s Lexicon in Veteris Testamenti Libros, Leiden, 1958, pp. 877-879; Brown, Driver, and Briggs’ Hebrew and English Lexicon of the Old Testament, 1980, pp. 924-926; Theological Dictionary of the New Testament, edited by G. Friedrich, translated by G. Bromiley, 1971, Vol. VI, pp. 332-451.) All these meanings have something in common: They all refer to that which is invisible to human sight and which gives evidence of force in motion. Such invisible force is capable of producing visible effects.

Feel free to read further. The information is quite interesting.

Would you agree that it's God's spirit, which he directs, sends out, gives, and uses to accomplish his will?

(Isaiah 32:15) Until the spirit is poured out on us from above
(Isaiah 44:3) . . .I will pour out my spirit on your offspring. . .
(Psalm 104:30) If you send forth your spirit, they are created; And you make the face of the ground new. . .
(Acts 2:33) . . .Therefore, because he was exalted to the right hand of God and received the promised holy spirit from the Father, he has poured out what you see and hear. . .
(Ezekiel 36:27) I will put my spirit inside you. . .
(Luke 11:13) Therefore, if you, although being wicked, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more so will the Father in heaven give holy spirit to those asking him!. . .
(John 14:26) But the helper, the holy spirit, which the Father will send in my name, that one will teach you all things and bring back to your minds all the things I told you.
(Acts 5:32) . . .so is the holy spirit, which God has given to those obeying him as ruler.. . .
(Acts 8:18) . . .the spirit was given through the laying on of the hands of the apostles. . .
(Acts 10:38) . . .God anointed him with holy spirit. . .
(1 Corinthians 2:12) Now we received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit that is from God, so that we might know the things that have been kindly given us by God.
(2 Corinthians 1:22) He has also put his seal on us and has given us the token of what is to come, that is, the spirit, in our hearts.
(1 John 4:13) . . .he has given his spirit to us. . .

@pearl I was thinking too, of 1 peter 1:21, and 2 Timothy 3:16
*** nwtsty 2 Timothy Study Notes - Chapter 3 ***
inspired of God: This expression translates the compound Greek word the·oʹpneu·stos. It is composed of the words the·osʹ (god) and pneʹo (breathe; blow), thus literally meaning “God-breathed” or “breathed by God.”

 

[pearl]

inspired of God: This expression translates the compound Greek word the·oʹpneu·stos. It is composed of the words the·osʹ (god) and pneʹo (breathe; blow), thus literally meaning “God-breathed” or “breathed by God.”

Where we get the expression Scripture is 'God breathed'. Personally, I think the Paraclete of John's Gospel about says it all. Plus the Spirit 'blows' where will, no one religion may lay claim too it.

 

[URAVIP2ME]

and the earth was without form or shape, with darkness over the abyss and a mighty wind sweeping over the waters Gen 1:2 then the LORD God formed the man* out of the dust of the ground and blew into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being. Gen 2:7
The Spirit of God is often likened to the wind, which blows where it wills

Yes, as God sends forth His spirit (Psalms 104:30) like seeing mighty wind because we see the created results.
At Acts of the Apostles 17:25 God gives: life and breath. Life ( the spark of life ).
Thus, God did Not blow a spirit person into Adam but God's breathed the 'breath of life' into lifeless Adam - Genesis 2:7
Without the 'breath of life' a person dies - Genesis 7:22