What the New Testament says about God is true

[Trailblazer]

God will not destroy this earth.

No, I don't think He will.

He will do away with/destroy/bring to ruin those who ARE unrepentantly destroying the earth.

Maybe He will, but I am not going to second guess God.

 

[YoursTrue]

No, I don't think He will.

Maybe He will, but I am not going to second guess God.

That's what the Bible says. He will destroy/ruin/put out of existence those who are destroying the earth. And I am glad to know about that. However He does it.

 

[YoursTrue]

That is what I believe.

I looked up the meaning of the word destroy and here is what I find:
"destroyed; destroying; destroys
: to ruin the structure, organic existence, or condition of
destroyed the files
also : to ruin as if by tearing to shreds
their reputation was destroyed
a disease that destroys the body's ability to fight off illness

2a: to put out of existence : kill
destroy an injured horse

In any case, the Bible says that God will destroy/ruin those destroying or ruining the earth.

 

[Eli G]

Again, as if Baha'is are going to take the story in the Bible literally? ...

I know they won't, as they are unfamiliar with the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. They do not recognize the God of Isaiah, Jeremiah, or any of the Israelite prophets.

The Bahais cannot distinguish between Israel and the nations that did not worship Jehovah. They do not understand why the true God chose a nation that He Himself formed out of Abraham to be His special people, while sternly warning them that turning aside to worship other gods would bring them disastrous consequences.

It is clear that the Bahais, as a sect of Babism, and this other as a sect of Islam, cannot comprehend anything related to the God of Israel or His inspired written Word.

Indeed, as far as I know, the Bahais adopted from the Muslims the notion that the chosen people would descend from Ishmael rather than Isaac, which clearly contradicts the original Jewish scriptures. Islam appeared after the 6th century AD, well after the establishment of the original Jewish religion, and even Christianity had already become the official religion in numerous regions worldwide.

 

[Eli G]

This is what I found for the NWT translation of Rev 11:18
18 But the nations became wrathful, and your own wrath came, and the appointed time came for the dead to be judged and to reward your slaves the prophets and the holy ones and those fearing your name, the small and the great, and to bring to ruin those ruining the earth.”

I see a pretty big difference between "destroying" and "ruining" so I checked a good many translations, and indeed "destroying" is the most prominent.

I'm not big on Rev, so thanks for the incentive to pull it up.

The Greek verb for "to ruin" is διαφθείρω, and it appears in the following texts:

Luke 12:33, referring to moths consuming treasures
2 Cor. 4:16, about the man we are outside wasting away
Rev. 8:9, mentioning ships being wrecked
1 Tim. 6:5, concerning minds that had been corrupted

This gives you a clearer understanding of the Greek word and its usage in various contexts. From my perspective, examining all the texts collectively, that Greek term signifies a ruination that leads to destruction, emphasizing the process over the outcome.

While God will bring ruin upon those ruining the earth, He will not permit them to utterly destroy it, but He will bring ruin to them before destroying them totally.

Psal. 37:10 Just a little while longer, and the wicked will be no more;
You will look at where they were,
And they will not be there.
11 But the meek will possess the earth,
And they will find exquisite delight in the abundance of peace.

 

[Trailblazer]

I know they won't, as they are unfamiliar with the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. They do not recognize the God of Isaiah, Jeremiah, or any of the Israelite prophets.

Well, that is just patently false, as can be seen by anyone who has ever read the Baha'i Writings. For example.

Question.—How many kinds of Prophets are there?
Answer.—Universally, the Prophets are of two kinds. One are the independent Prophets Who are followed; the other kind are not independent and are themselves followers.

The independent Prophets are the lawgivers and the founders of a new cycle. Through Their appearance the world puts on a new garment, the foundations of religion are established, and a new book is revealed. Without an intermediary They receive bounty from the Reality of the Divinity, and Their illumination is an essential illumination. They are like the sun which is luminous in itself: the light is its essential necessity; it does not receive light from any other star. These Dawning-places of the morn of Unity are the sources of bounty and the mirrors of the Essence of Reality.

The other Prophets are followers and promoters, for they are branches and not independent; they receive the bounty of the independent Prophets, and they profit by the light of the Guidance of the universal Prophets. They are like the moon, which is not luminous and radiant in itself, but receives its light from the sun.

The Manifestations of universal Prophethood Who appeared independently are, for example, Abraham, Moses, Christ, Muhammad, the Báb and Bahá’u’lláh. But the others who are followers and promoters are like Solomon, David, Isaiah, Jeremiah and Ezekiel. For the independent Prophets are founders; They establish a new religion and make new creatures of men; They change the general morals, promote new customs and rules, renew the cycle and the Law. Their appearance is like the season of spring, which arrays all earthly beings in a new garment, and gives them a new life.

With regard to the second sort of Prophets who are followers, these also promote the Law of God, make known the Religion of God, and proclaim His word. Of themselves they have no power and might, except what they receive from the independent Prophets.

Bahá'í Reference Library - Some Answered Questions, Pages 164-166

It is clear that the Bahais, as a sect of Babism, and this other as a sect of Islam,

Again, that is patently false. The Baha'i Faith is not a sect of Babism or a sect of Islam. It is brand new religion of God.
The Baha'i Faith grew out of Islam and Babism, just like Christianity grew out of Judaism, but the Baha'i Faith is no more a sect of Islam than Christianity is a sect of Judaism.

If you want to talk about the Bahai Faith I suggest that you get your facts straight, rather than making them up.

cannot comprehend anything related to the God of Israel or His inspired written Word.

Baha'is comprehend more about God than any Christian will because Baha'u'llah has revealed more about God than is contained in the Bible.

In addition, Baha'is don't gave to rely upon the words of men who were allegedly inspired by God, since we rely upon the words of Baha'u'llah, who received a revelation from God and wrote His scriptures in His own pen.

 

[Eli G]

Jehovah has no prophets in any religion of those who do not know him.
He does not compete with any god of the nations; he is the only living and true God.


PS: Zoroaster was not a worshiper of Jehovah. Actually he was contemporary with Cyrus, the conqueror of Babylon, and at that time, Israel had existed for more than a millennium.

 

[Trailblazer]

Jehovah has no prophets in any religion of those who do not know him.
He does not compete with any god of the nations; he is the only living and true God.

The one true God sent prophets/messengers at various times throughout human history and religions were established as a result.
The adherents to those religions know the one true God.

In Christianity, God is not only known by one name, Jehovah.

How many names does God have in Christianity?

We find a lot of names for God in the Bible. Some scholars record up to 24 names in the Bible. Some of these names are Jehovah Jireh, Jehovah Rapha, Jehovah Nissi, Jehovah Shalom, Jehovah Raah, Jehovah Tsidkenu, Jehovah Shammah, Abba Father, Adonai, Alpha and Omega, El Roi, Elohim, El Elyon.Sep 4, 2021
How many names does God have in Christianity? - Follow in Jesus' Path


In the Bahai Faith, God is called by many names.

What do Baháʼí call their God?

The Baháʼí scriptures refer to God by various titles and attributes, such as Almighty, All-Powerful, All-Wise, Incomparable, Gracious, Helper, All-Glorious, Omniscient and All-Loving. Bahá'is believe the greatest of all the names of God is "All-Glorious" or Bahá in Arabic.
God in the Baháʼí Faith - Wikipedia

PS: Zoroaster was not a worshiper of Jehovah. Actually he was contemporary with Cyrus, the conqueror of Babylon, and at that time, Israel had existed for more than a millennium.

Zoroaster was a prophet/messenger of God, so He taught about the one true God, who was at that time called by another name.

Zoroastrianism was founded in Persia in the 6th century BCE by the priest Zarathustra, known to the Greeks as Zoroaster. Zarathustra reformed existing Persian polytheism with his teachings about the highest god, Ahura Mazdā, and his primeval clash with Angra Mainyu, the Destructive Spirit.Sep 9, 2024

Zoroastrianism | Definition, Beliefs, Founder, Holy Book, & Facts
Britannica
https://www.britannica.com

 

[Eli G]

Jehovah, the God of Israel, forbade them from worshipping any foreign gods or adopting foreign customs... initially, he even prohibited them from intermingling sexually with outsiders.

The Bahais hold that all major world religions are divinely originated and share fundamental principles. However, this belief is clearly unbefitting of Jehovah’s worshippers, the sole living and true God. Consequently, the Bahais do not recognize the true God and thus have no authority to speak in His name.

2 Cor. 6:14 Do not become unevenly yoked with unbelievers. For what fellowship do righteousness and lawlessness have? Or what sharing does light have with darkness? 15 Further, what harmony is there between Christ and Beʹli·al? Or what does a believer share in common with an unbeliever? 16 And what agreement does God’s temple have with idols? For we are a temple of a living God; just as God said: “I will reside among them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they will be my people.” 17 “‘Therefore, get out from among them, and separate yourselves,’ says Jehovah, ‘and quit touching the unclean thing’”; “‘and I will take you in.’” 18 “‘And I will become a father to you, and you will become sons and daughters to me,’ says Jehovah, the Almighty.”

 

[Trailblazer]

Jehovah, the God of Israel, forbade them from worshipping any foreign gods or adopting foreign customs... initially, he even prohibited them from intermingling sexually with outsiders.

I do not care what was written about God in the Old Testament many thousands of years ago.
God has spoken again since that time, through several Messengers.

The Bahais hold that all major world religions are divinely originated and share fundamental principles. However, this belief is clearly unbefitting of Jehovah’s worshippers, the sole living and true God.

I am well aware that Baha'i beliefs are clearly unbefitting of Jehovah’s worshippers.
Likewise, Jehovah’s witness beliefs are clearly unbefitting of Baha'is.

The Jehovah’s witnesses do not have any special access to the one true God, they only believe that they do.
The JW religion is the most arrogant of all the Christian sects because they believe that they alone have the only truth.

Consequently, the Bahais do not recognize the true God and thus have no authority to speak in His name.

Since Baha'u'llah was a Messenger of the one true God, Baha'is recognize the true God and thus have authority to speak in His name.

"Witness, therefore, how numerous and far-reaching have been the changes in language, speech, and writing since the days of Adam. How much greater must have been the changes before Him!

Our purpose in revealing these words is to show that the one true God hath, in His all-highest and transcendent station, ever been, and will everlastingly continue to be, exalted above the praise and conception of all else but Him. His creation hath ever existed, and the Manifestations of His Divine glory and the Day Springs of eternal holiness have been sent down from time immemorial, and been commissioned to summon mankind to the one true God. That the names of some of them are forgotten and the records of their lives lost is to be attributed to the disturbances and changes that have overtaken the world."

Bahá'í Reference Library - Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, Pages 172-175

I suggest you quit while you are ahead because all you are doing is providing free ad space for the Baha'i Faith.

 

[Eli G]

I do not care what a false prophet says in our times, since Jesus warned that such individuals would appear.

Bahá'ís believe in the evolution—biological, spiritual, and social—of humanity while rejecting both the notion of humanity's fall from perfection and the subsequent salvation through the blood of Jesus Christ. This positions them as clear adversaries of Christianity.

The followers of the true God and the rest of the world have always been at odds due to their differing beliefs and practices. This conflict arises because the development of the world, separated from God since our first ancestors, is guided not by the Creator but by sources of "wisdom" opposed to God.

The wisdom of a world detached from God has resulted in a dire human condition marked by wars, famines, injustices, violence, greed, and other evils. No form of government or philosophy has managed to bring lasting peace and happiness to humanity. Instead of improving, the situation is deteriorating, contradicting the utopian dream of a peaceful and secure world. Despite good intentions, placing hope in humanity inevitably leads to disappointment.

Those who know the true God understand that His promises will be fulfilled through the kingdom of Jesus, the descendant of David with the legitimate right to the throne of humanity as a global ruler. Only this heavenly kingdom will truly solve human problems, addressing not only the miseries caused by bad governance but also the ailments inherited from our first rebellious parents, such as disease and death.

At that time, the earth will be filled with true knowledge, originating from God rather than from man or his malevolent spiritual guides.

PS: In the Bible, the collection of religious ideas opposed to those known from the true God and His prophets is referred to as "Babylon the Great." This ancient city is the mother of all false beliefs that have spread across the earth. It is accused in the Bible of murdering God's prophets, serving as the true spiritual source from which all false teachers and prophets have drawn. This global harlot of all false religions has a "marriage" relationship with the world's rulers for mutual benefit. The Bible views this relationship as spiritual adultery, as it pretends to have a special bond with the Creator while selling itself to rulers for its own gain.

 

[Trailblazer]

I do not care what a false prophet says in our times, since Jesus warned that such individuals would appear.

Apparently you care a whole lot, or else you would not be on this thread denigrating the Baha'i Faith.

If you are so sure you are right, you would not have to do that.
I don't see any other Christians here.

 

[Eli G]

I am presenting the biblical perspective on Bahai beliefs. Christians place their faith in the inspired Word of God, written by numerous men over nearly 16 centuries, yet all these writings were inspired by the same God, Jehovah.

No Christian sees these writings as flawed or insufficient, as they provide humanity with the hope that Jesus, the Son of God and Messiah, who was promised since Genesis 3:15, would be the one to liberate humanity from all its troubles.

Your personal attacks and tantrums do not concern me. As a Christian, it is my duty to help you understand certain aspects that you are confused about regarding the Bible and Jesus Christ. Obviously, you have the right to believe what you want, but do not let it be due to a lack of help.

 

[Sgt. Pepper]

Apparently you care a whole lot, or else you would not be on this thread denigrating the Baha'i Faith.

If you are so sure you are right, you would not have to do that.
I don't see any other Christians here.

I know that you will remain strong in your faith, my friend.

 

[CG Didymus]

Indeed, as far as I know, the Bahais adopted from the Muslims the notion that the chosen people would descend from Ishmael rather than Isaac, which clearly contradicts the original Jewish scriptures. Islam appeared after the 6th century AD, well after the establishment of the original Jewish religion, and even Christianity had already become the official religion in numerous regions worldwide.

So... The Hebrew Bible says it was Isaac that was taken by Abraham to be sacrificed.

The New Testament says it was Isaac.

The Quran and the Baha'i writings of Baha'u'llah say it was Ishmael.

So, my question is... If it's true, that it was Ishmael, who changed the story to Isaac in Genesis? And when did they do it?

If in the oldest manuscripts it says that it was Isaac, then why, way back before then, would any Scribe think that was a necessary thing to do?

And he got all the Scribes to copy his version of the story? And all the priests went along with it? One day they are ready that it was Ishmael, and the next day they are handed a new scroll that has him replaced with Isaac?

Have Baha'is thought this through? Do Baha'is really care? No, it's in the writings of their prophet, therefore... that is the truth. It was Ishmael, and those darn Scribes tried to pull the old switcheroo.

 

[Eli G]

@CG Didymus I am also as curious as you are about that.

Since Islam arose in the 6th century, it's apparent that they adapted certain biblical teachings to suit their local interests. Obviously, in order to replace the Jewish writings with new ones, only a part of them could be recognized and other documents would have to be invented.

Something comparable occurred with the Samaritans. This group formed due to the occupation of Israel's territory by foreigners following the Assyrian conquest of the northern kingdom of Israel. Over time, some Israelite priests were brought there with the Mosaic writings, resulting in a unique religious blend that has persisted for centuries. According to the changes in the Samaritan Pentateuch, their version of the law of Moses, Mount Gerizim was deemed the place to worship Jehovah, not Jerusalem.

However, it was not through the Samaritan religion that one could approach Jehovah, for they were not considered God's people. The Messiah they awaited, as foretold by Moses, though eventually beneficial to them, would not be a Samaritan but a Jew.

PS: Attacks against the truth do not actually originate among humans, but among entities that oppose God's rule in the spiritual realms. Humans are only their puppets.

 

[Trailblazer]

I am presenting the biblical perspective on Bahai beliefs.

No, you are presenting YOUR perspective on Baha'i beliefs.

Christians place their faith in the inspired Word of God, written by numerous men over nearly 16 centuries, yet all these writings were inspired by the same God, Jehovah.

Baha'is place their faith in the Word of God which came directly from God to Baha'u'llah, not through men who were allegedly inspired.

No Christian sees these writings as flawed or insufficient, as they provide humanity with the hope that Jesus, the Son of God and Messiah, who was promised since Genesis 3:15, would be the one to liberate humanity from all its troubles.

No such promise was ever made.

It would be kind of difficult for Jesus to liberate humanity from all its troubles, since Jesus said he was no more in this world and his work was finished here.

John 14:19 Yet a little while, and the world seeth me no more; but ye see me: because I live, ye shall live also.

John 16:10 Of righteousness, because I go to my Father, and ye see me no more.

John 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.

John 17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

Your personal attacks and tantrums do not concern me.

You are the only one here who is launching attacks and having tantrums. Anyone who can read can see that.

As a Christian, it is my duty to help you understand certain aspects that you are confused about regarding the Bible and Jesus Christ. Obviously, you have the right to believe what you want, but do not let it be due to a lack of help.

As a Baha'i, it is my duty to carry the message of Baha'u'llah. What anyone does with that is entirely their own business.

I am not the one who is confused, since Baha'u'llah unsealed the Book so it could be understood properly.

Daniel Chapter 12:8 And I heard, but I understood not: then said I, O my Lord, what shall be the end of these things? 9 And he said, Go thy way, Daniel: for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. 12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days. 13 But go thou thy way till the end be; for thou shalt rest, and stand in thy lot at the end of the days.

Misunderstanding and misinterpretation of the Bible has been a big problem since the very beginning. Christians disagreed as to what the Bible meant and that is why there are so many different sects of Christianity. I believe that Christians have misinterpreted much of the Bible because they did not have the key to unlock the meaning, and that is understandable because it was prophesied in Daniel 12 that the Book would be sealed up until the time of the end, meaning nobody would really understand it.

Note that Dan 12:13 says "at the end of the days.” This chapter is about what will happen at the time of the end, when Christ returns.

12 Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

The 2,300 years came in 1844 and the book was unsealed by Baha’u’llah. Unsealing the Book means we can now understand what much of the Bible means that could never be understood before by reading the Baha’i Writings, thus fulfilling the prophecy in Daniel 12:4 that knowledge shall be increased.

 

[Trailblazer]

PS: Attacks against the truth do not actually originate among humans, but among entities that oppose God's rule in the spiritual realms. Humans are only their puppets.

Attacks against the truth originate among humans on earth.

“From the beginning of the world until the present time each ‘Manifestation’ 1 sent from God has been opposed by an embodiment of the ‘Powers of Darkness’.

This dark power has always endeavoured to extinguish the light. Tyranny has ever sought to overcome justice. Ignorance has persistently tried to trample knowledge underfoot. This has, from the earliest ages, been the method of the material world.
In the time of Moses, Pharaoh set himself to prevent the Mosaic Light being spread abroad.

In the day of Christ, Annas and Caiaphas inflamed the Jewish people against Him and the learned doctors of Israel joined together to resist His Power. All sorts of calumnies were circulated against Him. The Scribes and Pharisees conspired to make the people believe Him to be a liar, an apostate, and a blasphemer. They spread these slanders throughout the whole Eastern world against Christ, and caused Him to be condemned to a shameful death!

In the case of Muhammad also, the learned doctors of His day determined to extinguish the light of His influence. They tried by the power of the sword to prevent the spread of His teaching.

In spite of all their efforts the Sun of Truth shone forth from the horizon. In every case the army of light vanquished the powers of darkness on the battlefield of the world, and the radiance of the Divine Teaching illumined the earth. Those who accepted the Teaching and worked for the Cause of God became luminous stars in the sky of humanity.

Those who would have men believe that religion is their own private property once more bring their efforts to bear against the Sun of Truth: they resist the Command of God; they invent calumnies, not having arguments against it, neither proofs. They attack with masked faces, not daring to come forth into the light of day.

No one casts stones at a tree without fruit. No one tries to extinguish a lamp without light!

Regard the former times. Had the calumnies of Pharaoh any effect? He affirmed that Moses was a murderer, that he had slain a man and deserved to be executed! He also declared that Moses and Aaron were fomenters of discord, that they tried to destroy the religion of Egypt and therefore must be put to death. These words of Pharaoh were vainly spoken. The light of Moses shone. The radiance of the Law of God has encircled the world!

When the Pharisees said of Christ that He had broken the Sabbath Day, that He had defied the Law of Moses, that He had threatened to destroy the Temple and the Holy City of Jerusalem, and that He deserved to be crucified—We know that all these slanderous attacks had no result in hindering the spread of the Gospel!

The Sun of Christ shone brilliantly in the sky, and the breath of the Holy Spirit wafted over the whole earth!

And I say unto you that no calumny is able to prevail against the Light of God; it can only result in causing it to be more universally recognized. If a cause were of no significance, who would take the trouble to work against it!.”

Bahá'í Reference Library - Paris Talks, Pages 102-106