What's a Heretic to Do?

[Mr Spinkles]

Put yourself in the shoes of a Christian (or any religion, really). You have your worldview, and it works great for you--you love life and the people in it. You tell your friends about your faith, and they find it inspirational. You tell them that Jesus loves them, etc etc and this helps them to be better people.

Now put yourself, if you will, in the shoes of an atheist. You have your particular worldview, and it works great for you--you love life and the people in it. You tell your friends about your views but, alas! They find it depressing--they've never heard this kind of challenge to thier beliefs before. They begin to question whether or not God (who's supposed to love them) exists at all. Prayer loses its meaning to them. They fall into depression and cynicism as their whole belief system comes tumbling down around them under an onslaught of doubt.

Now, I'm not saying atheists can't be happy. I used to think atheists couldn't be happy, yet here I am, happy as ever.

The point I'm making is that even if we suppose there is no God: is it ethical to cause beilevers to question their faith, when their faith helps them be happy or do good deeds? Is it better to know the truth, or to not know the truth but be happier?

 

[Master Vigil]

Well, I certainly believe it to be wonderful to get people to question. For then they can understand what religion and spirituality is really for. And some really do need awakened to how some things just do not make sense.

"Is it better to know the truth, or to not know the truth but be happier?"

But what is the truth? None of us know for sure. We know what we believe. We know what makes sense. We know what we want to know. Will questioning lead a person to truth? Maybe, but that truth may be different for everyone.

 

[Bastet]

I tend to agree with Master Vigil here...I don't think there's anything wrong with causing someone else to question their beliefs. Whether they come up with the same answer as you is really up to them...it's all a journey, and not everyone has the same destination.

 

[Alaric]

It's better to tell them now in a way that shows atheism to be a good worldview than leaving them to lose their faith later, either slowly or abruptly, when noone is around to cushion the blow. Frankly, I don't think anyone has a right to be happy by believeing in lies. It always hurts others in the end.

 

[Engyo]

Personally I am continually questioning and learning; trying to dispel my illusions and gain a clearer view of myself and the world.

If someone can provide information to help me do that, that is great. I proivide information in the same way. I intend no direct challenge to anyone's aith and/or belief; however, if new information causes them to re-examine their standing, I don't find that problematic.

 

[Master Vigil]

And again Alaric, some are lies, some are not. That is where the truths collide and cease to become truth. What you may believe as truth another may not. The only difference is, you require physical evidence, they do not. That to me does not dispel either side, but only makes the truth's even more different and distinct. And I don't see how someone being happy in a religion hurts anyone (except in religious wars, but even then no one is happy.) Instead I see people living peacefully, and dying happily. Whats wrong with that?

 

[Lightkeeper]

Why would anyone want to make someone question their faith? If you are secure in your beliefs you probably wouldn't want to do that. Live and Let live. When we are new to a belief system we tend to have a great need to spread the word, probably to bolster your own beliefs. We can only teach what we are. If you are a truly happy person, people will probably want to know why and will ask.

 

[Rex]

Doesn't stimulating your mind make you a happier person?

 

[Master Vigil]

I taught a class on Taoism and Zen, and it was through their questions that I came to the understanding I have now. And it was through their "interigation" that I came to love Taoism enough to understand that my own philosophy is Taoism. But if it wasn't for their questioning and my teaching, that would never of happened.

 

[Mr Spinkles]

What about belief in Santa?

Children believe in this ridiculous lie for years....is it right to take their fantasy away?

If the truth will only cause harm and no good, then isn't ignorant bliss the way to go?

How about a third example: in school they test to see what your IQ is, but they never tell (usually) students because there is no value in knowing one's own IQ. Would it be better to know the IQ and not be ignorant, or to not know the IQ but not risk limiting yourself or being arrogant?

 

[Alaric]

And again Alaric, some are lies, some are not. That is where the truths collide and cease to become truth. What you may believe as truth another may not. The only difference is, you require physical evidence, they do not. That to me does not dispel either side, but only makes the truth's even more different and distinct. And I don't see how someone being happy in a religion hurts anyone (except in religious wars, but even then no one is happy.) Instead I see people living peacefully, and dying happily. Whats wrong with that?

I just think there are some subtle effects that slowly erode away at your being - they might think they're happy, but not realise that it can be a lot better. What most concerns me most, however, is when they rely on some 'truth' and build on it, meaning that as soon as those foundations start to crumble, the whole house falls down.

There is also the problem of truths not being useful alone. Even if you can prove a fact, your ignorance about other things can cause you to react inappropriately to your 'fact'. That is why for me, the foundation is not made of facts, but of true methods of evaluating certain 'facts'. The foundation of science is not simple laws of physics, but the scientific method, and the foundation of morality is not built around laws or even empathy, but the categorical imperative (the best I've seen). So for example, I would be interested in Taoism if it prescribed some method of looking at the world, rather than a fact or set of facts through which to look at the world.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Is it better to know the truth, or to not know the truth but be happier?

Hi, Mr_Spinkles.

In my opinion: so long as happiness is benign and non-intrusive, happiness trumps knowledge.

 

[Lightkeeper]

Is it better to know the truth, or to not know the truth but be happier?

Hi, Mr_Spinkles.

In my opinion: so long as happiness is benign and non-intrusive, happiness trumps knowledge.

I agree with this. To each his own. Not everyone has the same truth.

 

[Master Vigil]

I understand alaric. The Tao does not give laws or rules, only nature. And we learn from nature and ourselves to live like the Tao.

 

[Ceridwen018]

This really is a good tough question, and the answer really depends on what kind of person you are. As for me, I absolutely love questioning and debating. In fact, I can get so frustrated sometimes trying to figure out how people, who would say something like 'live and let live', think and how their minds work, because that attitude is so foreign to me. I'm not saying that it is an inferior attitude, per say, its just not something I can easily understand.

Christians would say, of those who are not Christian, that ignorance is certainly not bliss, because to be aware of god's word is one's own resposibility, which if neglected, can earn you a ticket to hell. From an atheistic perspective however (aka, no afterlife), the seeming negative effects of 'false beliefs' are perhaps not as apparent. It certainly would be easy to say 'live and let live' because we do not believe in any supernatural consequences, however like Alaric was saying, the truth is out there, and wether we're happy with our lives as they are or not, it will come upon us all sooner or later.

Bottom line? I think that everyone should be open to other's opinions, with the thought that they can learn something. Questions exercise your mind, and yes Lighteeper, strengthen your faith. think of it this way: if your faith really is true and strong, what's a little questioning gonna hurt? *smiles sweetly and innocently* :roll:

 

[Mr Spinkles]

Put yourself in the shoes of a Christian (or any religion, really). You have your worldview, and it works great for you--you love life and the people in it. You tell your friends about your faith, and they find it inspirational. You tell them that Jesus loves them, etc etc and this helps them to be better people.

Now put yourself, if you will, in the shoes of an atheist. You have your particular worldview, and it works great for you--you love life and the people in it. You tell your friends about your views but, alas! They find it depressing--they've never heard this kind of challenge to thier beliefs before. They begin to question whether or not God (who's supposed to love them) exists at all. Prayer loses its meaning to them. They fall into depression and cynicism as their whole belief system comes tumbling down around them under an onslaught of doubt.

Now, I'm not saying atheists can't be happy. I used to think atheists couldn't be happy, yet here I am, happy as ever.

The point I'm making is that even if we suppose there is no God: is it ethical to cause beilevers to question their faith, when their faith helps them be happy or do good deeds? Is it better to know the truth, or to not know the truth but be happier?

 

[Master Vigil]

Well, I certainly believe it to be wonderful to get people to question. For then they can understand what religion and spirituality is really for. And some really do need awakened to how some things just do not make sense.

"Is it better to know the truth, or to not know the truth but be happier?"

But what is the truth? None of us know for sure. We know what we believe. We know what makes sense. We know what we want to know. Will questioning lead a person to truth? Maybe, but that truth may be different for everyone.

 

[Bastet]

I tend to agree with Master Vigil here...I don't think there's anything wrong with causing someone else to question their beliefs. Whether they come up with the same answer as you is really up to them...it's all a journey, and not everyone has the same destination.

 

[Alaric]

It's better to tell them now in a way that shows atheism to be a good worldview than leaving them to lose their faith later, either slowly or abruptly, when noone is around to cushion the blow. Frankly, I don't think anyone has a right to be happy by believeing in lies. It always hurts others in the end.

 

[Engyo]

Personally I am continually questioning and learning; trying to dispel my illusions and gain a clearer view of myself and the world.

If someone can provide information to help me do that, that is great. I proivide information in the same way. I intend no direct challenge to anyone's aith and/or belief; however, if new information causes them to re-examine their standing, I don't find that problematic.