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What's up with Thailand and Hitler?

dust1n

Zindīq
Bangkok, Thailand — It started as a craze for T-shirts printed with cartoon images of Hitler’s face. This dubious trend among teenagers in Thailand soon moved on to include SS style bike helmets, temporary swastika tattoos, and pictures of cute teddy bears doing the Nazi salute.

Soon, kids were seen on the streets of Bangkok posing for photos, grinning next to cartoon effigies of the man responsible for the deaths of 12 million people during the Holocaust. Then it emerged other incidents had taken place including a Nazi themed school fashion show and a sports day parade in the northern city of Chang Mai in which a group of students dressed up as SS soldiers as a surprise for their teachers.

“Hitler Chic,” as it was dubbed in the media last year, has quickly snowballed in Thailand, revealing a lack of historical education and awareness in a country that was left largely untouched by World War II.

Unsurprisingly, the new craze has prompted confusion among foreign tourists and outrage among several international organisations, including Itzhak Shoham, the Israeli ambassador to Thailand, who said the trend “hurts the feelings of every Jew and every civilized person.”

The complaints elicited bemused responses from Thailand’s cultural elite, who brushed it off as misplaced humor, stemming from kids who aren’t taught about the history of the Holocaust in school. One blogger said they thought the world had lost its sense of humor. “Why is this different from the West’s obsession with Che Guevara?” he wrote.

Interest in the trend seemed to be dropping off until last week when pictures on Twitter started circulating of a fried chicken joint in Bangkok allegedly named Hitler. Modeled after Kentucky Fried Chicken, the restaurant's logo features the face of the Fuhrer plastered onto the body of bow-tie wearing Colonel Sanders, the founder of KFC. The images prompted a renewed outburst of anger, followed by a heavily worded statement from Kentucky Fried Chicken saying they were considering suing the restaurant.

"We find it extremely distasteful and are considering legal action since it is an infringement of our brand trademark and has nothing to do with us," a spokesperson for Yum!, KFC’s parent company said.

It was later pointed out that the pictures of the restaurant may be old and that the chicken joint in question has since changed its name.

True or not, the revival of the debate around Hitler Chic has prompted some to call for history to be re-instated as one of the key subjects in the Thai syllabus to avoid further misunderstanding and embarrassment.

Varakorn Samakoses is the president of Dhurakij Pundit University in Bangkok and former deputy minister for education. He says a lack of emphasis on history teaching in Thailand means students are graduating without a proper grasp of events that shaped the world around them.

“Kids are much more interested in the present and the future, they are not taught to appreciate or take seriously what happened in the past,” he said, adding that because Thailand avoided much of the hardships suffered by other countries during World War II and under colonial rule, people find it harder to relate to stories of genocide and chaos.

“Even teachers are ignorant of these issues,” he said. “This is something that should change. History should be one of the most important parts of the syllabus. [Children] should know what goes on because history always repeats itself.”

Lack of education and empathy may be a big problem here, but its not restricted to Thailand. Other countries have also picked up on the Hitler Chic craze, including the sale of Hitler key rings in 7/11 stores in Taiwan, Nazi T-shirts in Japan and Korea and a clothing store in Hong Kong caught decorating the counter with Nazi flags.

But the message that foreigners don't approve of Hitler Chic seems to be catching on.

Last Saturday, a young Chinese man was perusing a set of Hitler T-shirts at Chatuchak weekend market in Bangkok. The man and his friend joked as they held up different T-shirts, including one of the German dictator dressed as Ronald McDonald.

“I want this. I will wear it at home in China,” he said. “I work at McDonalds so I like it very much.”

When asked if he knew who Hitler was, the man – who declined to give his name – smiled sheepishly. He nodded to indicate he did and then seemed to get embarrassed. As this reporter walked away, his friend muttered something under his breath and the pair left abruptly. Later this reporter saw the T-shirt he was going to buy, still hanging up.

Thailand has a new popular sensation - Hitler - CSMonitor.com

Uniforms and other imagery related to Nazi Germany are sold in East Asia, where some consider it fashionable. Hong Kong and Japan have each witnessed a growth in the casual wearing of SS uniforms, as well as increased interest in White power music. Sometimes in East Asia, Nazi uniforms are used as part of cosplay.[15] In South Korea, an area generally isolated from Nazi cultural influences during the Nazi era, Time magazine observed in 2000 "an unthinking fascination with the icons and imagery of the Third Reich."[16] Nazi-inspired imagery featured in various early releases from Japanese band The 5.6.7.8's.[17]

In some parts of the world, World War II is not taught in schools as a battle of political ideologies, but as a conventional war. This type of education treats Hitler and the Nazi Party as charismatic and powerful leaders of countries during wartime, instead of war criminals as elsewhere. George Burdi, the former head of the neo-Nazi record label Resistance Records, claimed to have sold many CDs to Japan, because some Japanese believe themselves to be the master race of the East.[18] In Turkey, Hitler's book Mein Kampf became a best-seller in early 2005 following price cuts and rising Turkish nationalism.[19][20]

Nazi chic - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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"Hitler is not dead." Advertisement for a wax museum.

 

von bek

Well-Known Member
As time passes, we will see more of this sort of thing. A few centuries from now, I suspect people will think of guys like Hitler and Stalin as being like how people today may think about Vlad the Impaler or Atilla the Hun. When there are no more survivors of the evil perpetrated by the Nazis, I fear that what they really stood for will fade into the background while others project their ideas of a glorious strongman, who may have made some mistakes, but still had the best interests of their people and country foremost in their minds and policies. (Please do not misunderstand me, I do not share any romantic ideas about them, just thinking aloud.)

Of course I should give full disclosure, when it comes to Stalin, I like his politics but I hate his methods and callous disregard for human suffering. Same goes for Mao Zedong. (When it comes to Hitler, I absolutely despise both his politics and his methods!)
 

Sultan Of Swing

Well-Known Member
As time passes, we will see more of this sort of thing. A few centuries from now, I suspect people will think of guys like Hitler and Stalin as being like how people today may think about Vlad the Impaler or Atilla the Hun. When there are no more survivors of the evil perpetrated by the Nazis, I fear that what they really stood for will fade into the background while others project their ideas of a glorious strongman, who may have made some mistakes, but still had the best interests of their people and country foremost in their minds and policies. (Please do not misunderstand me, I do not share any romantic ideas about them, just thinking aloud.)

Of course I should give full disclosure, when it comes to Stalin, I like his politics but I hate his methods and callous disregard for human suffering. Same goes for Mao Zedong. (When it comes to Hitler, I absolutely despise both his politics and his methods!)
The thing is, about 'glorious strongmen', like Vlad, Attila, Genghis Khan, etc... they didn't round up six million Jews into death camps and slaughter them. I think that one point above all will imprint Hitler into history as a monster, only really admired by like-minded fascists, or some minority of weirdos.
 

Jumi

Well-Known Member
Many young people will always be drawn to something considered evil by their culture or other cultures. They don't really think about the meaning of it, they just think it's "bad ***" and it's part of their rebellion.
 
Many young people will always be drawn to something considered evil by their culture or other cultures. They don't really think about the meaning of it, they just think it's "bad ***" and it's part of their rebellion.

I'm not sure how many of them even consider it particularly 'bad ***'. While WW2 is an integral part of a Western education, it is not in many parts of the world, where they learn almost nothing about international history except that closely related to their own history.

Many have a neutral to positive view of Hitler either because he is seen as a powerful and effective leader, and people are unaware of his ideology and the holocaust; also there are those who like the fact he hated and killed Jews and communists.

Indonesian Nazi cafe:

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The Emperor of Mankind

Currently the galaxy's spookiest paraplegic
Bangkok, Thailand — It started as a craze for T-shirts printed with cartoon images of Hitler’s face.

I was going to say Westerners (well, Europeans at any rate} have been wearing t-shirts emblazoned with Che Guevara's face for some time so it really shouldn't be that surprising. But then I scrolled down and that point became horribly insignificant.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Evil is fascinating when its effect is far removed & isn't personal.
I have a mechanical alarm clock with a red cheeked Chinese gal waving Mao's Little Red Book.
I also have a pre-1900 advertising poster for Rumsey fire fighthing equipment.
It displays a hotel fire with caricatures of black folk misbehaving, eg, stealing pigs.
There's humor in things so outrageous.
But opinions will vary.
 

Laika

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
This is actually really fascinating to see; a lesson in context if you will. So long as there is a clear distinction between using these as cultural rather than political symbols- and therefore is pretty 'harmless'- I can understand this. The Nazis did have great uniforms and there propaganda was effective in inspiring strong emotions in people, both positive and negative. human beings, particuarly young people looking to rebel, have a socially unacceptable fascination with power as part of realising there adult identities and figuring out where they fall in the 'system'. The "cool" factor is the easiest way to sell an ideology particuarly if it is a symbol of rebellion without people really thinking about it. it's the latter bit which is more worrying.

I think we need to keep in mind that Western cultures made fun of the Nazi's ALL the time as part of the way we come to terms with the evils they committed, to the absurd extreme such as Godwin's Law of the Internet. Beyond the Che T-shirt, and that really bad fourth indiania jones movie, you won't see Communists being treated the same way as an object of humour. it's something that has puzzled me. I can fairly comfortably use Che as my avatar because it's 'culture', but if I used Stalin or Pol Pot avatar on this forum, I would expect it to be treated as 'politics' and to get really bad reaction for it.

There was a controversy in China recently where graduates dressed up in the uniforms of the 'Red Guards' from the days of the Cultural Revolution but this disturbed people because it was within living memory and still leaves deep wounds, but the period is rarely discussed in public. As with Nazi Chic in Thialand, the lessons of history just haven't sunk in. Where the line gets drawn on what is taboo is odd to say the least.

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http://sinosphere.blogs.nytimes.com...-photos-cast-doubt-on-what-they-learned/?_r=0
http://sinosphere.blogs.nytimes.com...-photos-cast-doubt-on-what-they-learned/?_r=0
 

von bek

Well-Known Member
The thing is, about 'glorious strongmen', like Vlad, Attila, Genghis Khan, etc... they didn't round up six million Jews into death camps and slaughter them. I think that one point above all will imprint Hitler into history as a monster, only really admired by like-minded fascists, or some minority of weirdos.

If Vlad the Impaler had lived in the 20th century, there is no reason to believe that he would not have taken advantage of the technology available to carry out mass murder on a frightening scale. He was a cruel man. The passage of time allows people to take these historical figures and assign the values they want to them. Look, I hope a hundred years from now Hitler is still seen as a genocidal killer; but, it is very possible that he will have been reinterpreted as someone else.
 

gnomon

Well-Known Member
If Vlad the Impaler had lived in the 20th century, there is no reason to believe that he would not have taken advantage of the technology available to carry out mass murder on a frightening scale. He was a cruel man. The passage of time allows people to take these historical figures and assign the values they want to them. Look, I hope a hundred years from now Hitler is still seen as a genocidal killer; but, it is very possible that he will have been reinterpreted as someone else.

Really. You should actually read about some history. Vlad the "Impaler" was considered a hero by many for conducting a successful military and diplomatic campaign against the Ottoman Turks who quite frankly carried out the same abuses that Vlad carried out. I really cannot trust the opinions of people who look at history through rose colored glasses. Never mind that the Turks carried out a destructive campaign for the sole purpose of expanding their empire and that Vlad Dracul was the leader of the territory next in line of conquest and did everything he could to uphold his own culture against an infringing religious culture. You seriously believe the Turks were any more "kind" in their conquest of Anatolia and destruction of the Byzantines?

Spare me. I think the Bulgarians of today and Romanians as well are right in honoring the efforts of an individual, failed in his own rights, for attempting to conduct a campaign that would be held by liberal ethnologists as nothing more than an attempt to thwart the military campaigns of the Ottoman Turks to overrun others with disastrous results to their standing culture.

What say you?

Wish to adhere to fanciful stories by some English author or willing to look at actual history. I don't see the claims against Vlad being labelled against those Balkan patriots who set off the first World War.

For you see that the passage of time has painted this individual based upon a painting and a fanciful piece of fiction as being so much worse than his contemporaries when in truth his contemporaries were nothing more than him. The conquests of the Ottomans in the Balkans and elsewhere posed a serious cultural threat to many and the peoples of those nations rightfully see this man as someone who fought back with the same viciousness that can be seen world wide through many cultures.

Vlad the impaler? Never mind that numerous lives lost as Osman conducted his campaigns or the many numerous lives lost under the Hapsburgs, the Hannoverians, the rise of Prussia, the formation of France...........

Yes, Hitler will always be seen as a genocidal killer. But what about Stalin? What about Mao? But to bring up the Dracul dynasty in a historical sense.........forget it. Stop watching Hollywood and look at some actual history.
 

psychoslice

Veteran Member
I don't support Hitler but I do like all the flags and uniforms, especially the SS, I even have a swastika tattooed on my you know what lol. no true.
 

Servant_of_the_One1

Well-Known Member
I kind of admire Hitler's speech styles. Also iam big fan of Nazi military clothes and Nazi sense of unity and bravery.
The Nazi Empire would succeed if they didnt attack Russia.


But i dont support the killings of Jews and other civilians by the Germans.
 
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