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Who can fathom the infinite?

IndigoChild5559

Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
I have this feeling often. It moves me to awe and to humility. I think that it is something that resonates among all religious people. I'd like to provide a sampling of how it gets expressed in a number of different religious traditions, beginning with my own.

Job 42:3
"Surely I spoke of things I did not understand, things too wonderful for me to know."

Job 11:7-9
“Can you discover the depths of God? Can you discover the limits of the Almighty? They are high as the heavens, what can you do? Deeper than Sheol, what can you know? Its measure is longer than the earth and broader than the sea.”

Ecclesiastes 3:11
“He has made everything beautiful in its time. He has also set eternity in the hearts of men; yet they cannot fathom what God has done from beginning to end.”

Isaiah 40:28
“Do you not know? Have you not heard? The Lord is the everlasting God, the Creator of the ends of the earth. He will not grow tired or weary, and His understanding no one can fathom.”

The Zohar
“There is a mystery within the mystery that none can know, for the light of Ein Sof is hidden, concealed even from the most exalted beings.”

Jewish Hymn, Yigdal
"Acclaim and praise the living God who exists beyond the boundaries of time. Most singular of all, concealed and yet also without bound. He has no body — nor even the appearance of a body, it is impossible to measure his holiness"

Romans 11:33-34
"Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable his judgments, and his paths beyond tracing out. Who has known the mind of the Lord? Or who has been his counselor?"

Christian hymn, The Love of God
"Could we with ink the ocean fill,
And were the skies of parchment made,
Were every stalk on earth a quill,
And every man a scribe by trade,
To write the love of God above
Would drain the ocean dry;
Nor could the scroll contain the whole,
Though stretched from sky to sky."

Surah Al-Kahf (18:109)
“Say, ‘If the sea were ink for the words of my Lord, the sea would be exhausted before the words of my Lord were exhausted, even if We brought the like of it as a supplement.’”

Tao Te Ching Chapter 1
"The Tao that can be told is not the eternal Tao.
The name that can be named is not the eternal name.
The nameless is the beginning of heaven and Earth.
The named is the mother of the ten thousand things."

Tao Te Ching Chapter 25
“Something mysteriously formed,
Born before heaven and Earth.
In the silence and the void,
Standing alone and unchanging,
Ever present and in motion.
Perhaps it is the mother of ten thousand things.
I do not know its name
Call it Tao.
For lack of a better word, I call it great.”

Bhagavad Gita Chapter 13, Verse 15
“He exists outside and within all living beings, the moving and the non-moving. He is incomprehensible because He is subtle; thus, He is far away, yet also near at hand.”

The Vedas, Atharvaveda 10.8.32
“The soul of the universe, who has no beginning or end, who is in all and above all—this is the Supreme Being, unfathomable and limitless.”

The Heart Sutra
“Therefore, know that the Bodhisattva who relies on Prajñāpāramitā, the wisdom beyond wisdom, does not dwell in notions.”

Lakota Oral Tradition
“The mysteries of Wakan Tanka are beyond human understanding. You cannot measure the Great Spirit; you can only feel it.”
 
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Heyo

Veteran Member
I have this feeling often. It moves me to awe and to humility. I think that it is something that resonates among all religious people. I'd like to provide a sampling of how it gets expressed in a number of different religious traditions, beginning with my own.

Job 42:3
"Surely I spoke of things I did not understand, things too wonderful for me to know."

Job 11:7-9
“Can you discover the depths of God? Can you discover the limits of the Almighty? They are high as the heavens, what can you do? Deeper than Sheol, what can you know? Its measure is longer than the earth and broader than the sea.”

Ecclesiastes 3:11
“He has made everything beautiful in its time. He has also set eternity in the hearts of men; yet they cannot fathom what God has done from beginning to end.”

Isaiah 40:28
“Do you not know? Have you not heard? The Lord is the everlasting God, the Creator of the ends of the earth. He will not grow tired or weary, and His understanding no one can fathom.”

The Zohar
“There is a mystery within the mystery that none can know, for the light of Ein Sof is hidden, concealed even from the most exalted beings.”

Jewish Hymn, Yigdal
"Acclaim and praise the living God who exists beyond the boundaries of time. Most singular of all, concealed and yet also without bound. He has no body — nor even the appearance of a body, it is impossible to measure his holiness"

Romans 11:33-34
"Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable his judgments, and his paths beyond tracing out. Who has known the mind of the Lord? Or who has been his counselor?"

Christian hymn, The Love of God
"Could we with ink the ocean fill,
And were the skies of parchment made,
Were every stalk on earth a quill,
And every man a scribe by trade,
To write the love of God above
Would drain the ocean dry;
Nor could the scroll contain the whole,
Though stretched from sky to sky."

Surah Al-Kahf (18:109)
“Say, ‘If the sea were ink for the words of my Lord, the sea would be exhausted before the words of my Lord were exhausted, even if We brought the like of it as a supplement.’”

Tao Te Ching Chapter 1
"The Tao that can be told is not the eternal Tao.
The name that can be named is not the eternal name.
The nameless is the beginning of heaven and Earth.
The named is the mother of the ten thousand things."

Tao Te Ching Chapter 25
“Something mysteriously formed,
Born before heaven and Earth.
In the silence and the void,
Standing alone and unchanging,
Ever present and in motion.
Perhaps it is the mother of ten thousand things.
I do not know its name
Call it Tao.
For lack of a better word, I call it great.”

Bhagavad Gita Chapter 13, Verse 15
“He exists outside and within all living beings, the moving and the non-moving. He is incomprehensible because He is subtle; thus, He is far away, yet also near at hand.”

The Vedas, Atharvaveda 10.8.32
“The soul of the universe, who has no beginning or end, who is in all and above all—this is the Supreme Being, unfathomable and limitless.”

The Heart Sutra
“Therefore, know that the Bodhisattva who relies on Prajñāpāramitā, the wisdom beyond wisdom, does not dwell in notions.”

Lakota Oral Tradition
“The mysteries of Wakan Tanka are beyond human understanding. You cannot measure the Great Spirit; you can only feel it.”
There are no infinities in the real world, but mathematics deals with them. The nearest thing to understanding infinity is studying mathematics.
 

Heyo

Veteran Member
How can you possibly know that?
By definition. "Real" is that what we can measure, and there is no infinity sign on any instrument.
There may be two things that are infinite. The universe could be, but even if it was, we could never measure it. That what's behind our horizon, can never be seen, or have any measurable effect on us.
And unless we construct an instrument to measure it, we have to assume that even human stupidity isn't infinite.
 

RestlessSoul

Well-Known Member
By definition. "Real" is that what we can measure, and there is no infinity sign on any instrument.
There may be two things that are infinite. The universe could be, but even if it was, we could never measure it. That what's behind our horizon, can never be seen, or have any measurable effect on us.
And unless we construct an instrument to measure it, we have to assume that even human stupidity isn't infinite.


So anything you can’t measure can’t exist? That doesn’t sound right.

How do you measure a thought? How do you measure beauty, truth, love? How do you measure the entirety of your own experience, here and now?
 

SalixIncendium

अहं ब्रह्मास्मि
Staff member
Premium Member
I'm not. "Tangible" is what we can touch. We can't touch a force or a field, but we can measure them.
Yeah, 'tangible' wasn't the correct word. I retract the statement. It's early and I've only now had my first sip of coffee.

My point was that just because something is immeasurable doesn't mean it's not real.
 

Heyo

Veteran Member
Running isn't real? Breathing?
Notice how you had to change the word class? Is "a walk" a thing? "Walking", or in your case "running" is an activity, not a thing.
That's an important distinction. But once we have made that distinction, we can ask again if running or breathing can be measured in time. And yes, we can. So, while a walk isn't a real thing, walking is a real activity.
 
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