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Who do you think babylon the great is?

Riverwolf

Riverwolf

Amateur Rambler / Proud Ergi
Premium Member
Paul Chavez said:
well I guess what I mean modern Babylon the great in the book of revelation. what do people think she symbolizes?
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Oh, the thing spoken of in the Apocalypse of John?

I doubt very much the poet was referring to anything modern. He was probably using Babylon, the ancient civilization, as a stand-in metaphor for Rome.
 
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anonymous9887

bible reader
that's a good interpretation. I believe it is the world empire of false religion, but I like to hear other opinions because I could be wrong. I consider revelation 18:24 the righteous blood of the prophets was spilled because of false religion, revelation 17:2 only because of what sexual immorality means in the bible as well there is more but too long to explain. How did you come to your conclusion?
 
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lostwanderingsoul

Well-Known Member
Ancient Babylon was the source of a pagan religion called the Babylonian Mystery Religion. Among other things they believed in a trinity and worshiped a "mother and child." Much of their pagan ideas were carried over to a religion that claimed the name of "Christian" but still kept the pagan ideas. This religion grew and spread throughout the world and continues to fool people into thinking they are following Christian ideas when they are acrually following pagan beliefs.
 
Jayhawker Soule

Jayhawker Soule

-- untitled --
Premium Member
lostwanderingsoul said:
Ancient Babylon was the source of a pagan religion called the Babylonian Mystery Religion. Among other things they believed in a trinity and worshiped a "mother and child." Much of their pagan ideas were carried over to a religion that claimed the name of "Christian" but still kept the pagan ideas. This religion grew and spread throughout the world and continues to fool people into thinking they are following Christian ideas when they are acrually following pagan beliefs.
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Rubbish.
 
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lostwanderingsoul

Well-Known Member
Wikipedia is written by people who do not know any more about it than anyone else. their personal religious beliefs will show up in anything they write
 
metis

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
"Babylon the Great" is a reference to the Roman Empire, and "Babylonia" (feminine version of "Babylon" as found in I Peter) is a reference to the city of Rome.
 
Jayhawker Soule

Jayhawker Soule

-- untitled --
Premium Member
metis said:
"Babylon the Great" is a reference to the Roman Empire, and "Babylonia" (feminine version of "Babylon" as found in I Peter) is a reference to the city of Rome.
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Perhaps. Still ...
Alan James Beagley, David Chilton, J. Massyngberde Ford, Peter Gaskell, Kenneth Gentry, Edmondo Lupieri, Bruce Malina, Iain Provan, J. Stuart Russell, Milton S. Terry and theologians point out that although Rome was the prevailing pagan power in the 1st century when the Book of Revelation was written, the symbolism of the whore of Babylon refers not to an invading infidel of foreign power, but to an apostate false queen, a former "bride" who has been unfaithful and who, even though she has been divorced and cast out because of unfaithfulness, continues to falsely claim to be the "queen" of the spiritual realm. This symbolism did not fit the case of Rome at the time. Proponents of this view suggest that the "seven mountains" in Rev 17:9 are the seven hills on which Jerusalem stands and the "fall of Babylon" in Rev 18 is the fall and destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD.

Several Old Testament prophets referred to Jerusalem as being a spiritual harlot and a mother of such harlotry (Isaiah 1:21; Jeremiah 2:20; Jeremiah 3:1–11; Ezekiel 16:1–43; Ezekiel 23, Galatians 4:25). Some of the these Old Testament prophecies as well as the warnings in the New Testament concerning Jerusalem are in fact very close to the text concerning Babylon in Revelation, suggesting that John may well have actually been citing those prophecies in his description of Babylon.

For example, in Matthew 23:34–37 and Luke 11:47–51, Jesus himself assigned all of the bloodguilt for the killing of the prophets and of the saints (of all time) to the Pharisees of Jerusalem, and, in Revelation 17:6 and 18:20,24, almost identical phrasing is used in charging that very same bloodguilt to Babylon. This is also bolstered by Jesus' statement that "it's not possible for a prophet to be killed outside of Jerusalem." (Luke 13:33). [ibid]
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If forced to place a wager, I would probably opt for Rome as the safer bet, but I don't think Jerusalem can be dismissed out of hand.
 
metis

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Jayhawker Soule said:
Perhaps. Still ...
​
If forced to place a wager, I would probably opt for Rome as the safer bet, but I don't think Jerusalem can be dismissed out of hand.
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My understanding is that it shows up in other references.

Gotta go-- company just arrived.
 
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anonymous9887

bible reader
Jayhawker Soule said:
Perhaps. Still ...
​
If forced to place a wager, I would probably opt for Rome as the safer bet, but I don't think Jerusalem can be dismissed out of hand.
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well actually it cannot just be the roman empire just because Jerusalem began to be trampled on from 607 all the way down to a recent time. luke 21 clearly explains that Jerusalem would be trampled on until the appointed time of the gentiles is fulfilled. so the destruction of Jerusalem was just a continuance of the trampling.
 
Jayhawker Soule

Jayhawker Soule

-- untitled --
Premium Member
Paul Chavez said:
well actually it cannot just be the roman empire just because Jerusalem began to be trampled on from 607 all the way down to a recent time. luke 21 clearly explains that Jerusalem would be trampled on until the appointed time of the gentiles is fulfilled. so the destruction of Jerusalem was just a continuance of the trampling.
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Why would you foolishly think that Luke would hold any relevance for me?
 
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