djhwoodwerks
Well-Known Member
Don't let the governing body hear you say that, they might think you're out to get their job!
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Who gave Jesus all authority in Heaven and Earth?
- Thread starter savagewind
- Start date
Don't let the governing body hear you say that, they might think you're out to get their job!
djhwoodwerks
Well-Known Member
The antichrist will be the single leader of the earth, for a time.
djhwoodwerks
Well-Known Member
You can't call yourself a Christian just because you study the Bible either!
What is "THE NAME", not "the names", of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit that we are to be baptized in?
Acts 2:38 (ESV) 38 And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Acts 10:48 (ESV) 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ.
Acts 19:5 (ESV) 5 On hearing this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
djhwoodwerks
Well-Known Member
Are you sure you're a witness?
I've asked you this question twice now and unless I've missed it, I don't believe I have, you haven't answered it,
Are you a rank and file witness, or, are you one of the 144,000 anointed?
Kelly of the Phoenix
Well-Known Member
Amen. This isn't one of those "no, I'm not a doctor, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn once" kind of moments.
Blessed of JEHOVAH
Member
Well you know how your suppose to end your prayers in Jesus name. They most likely after praying to Jehovah to baptize in the Father the Son and the Holy spirit ended their prayer in Jesus name. Just like any other prayer for us cause it isn't new for us to end a prayer in Jesus name. Remember it was new for them they were used to ending there prayers with a sacrifice cause they lived under law until Jesus. They always prayed to Jehovah though.
I have found if you pray to Jehovah in the name of Jesus and continuously ask for wisdom in abundance and the hunger to do his will , and anything else that he wants for you over time you will be filled. Let me show you the treasure of Jehovah. Isaiah 33 : 6 ( 6 He is the stability of your times; An abundance of salvation, wisdom, knowledge, and the fear of Jehovah This is his treasure.
Blessed of JEHOVAH
Member
You know a lot of what the majority of Christians believe when it comes to the Antichrist comes from nostradamus a profit of satan. He's a profit of satan because he never professed to be a follower of Jehovah but he was a profit of this world. The one who has power over this world that we live in is satan. (1 John 5 : 19 We know that we originate with God, but the whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one.)
Lets find what the bible has to say about the Antichrist. (1 John 2 : 18 Young children, it is the last hour, and just as you have heard that the Antichrist is coming, even now many Antichrists have appeared, from which fact we know that it is the last hour.)
Now what I was trying to explain to you before when it came to the trinity teaching is it teaches that God came in the flesh as Jesus. That is incorrect i've tried to show many that the bible says that Jehovah is God and Jesus is his son. John 3 : 16 tells you that Jesus was sent to earth by Jehovah God his Father. John 3: 16 ( 16 “For God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, so that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life.)
Jesus even told you himself that he didn't come here on his own but was sent by Jehovah God. John 8 : 42 ( 42 Jesus said to them: “If God were your Father, you would love me, for I came from God and I am here. I have not come of my own initiative, but that One sent me.)
The scripture in 1 John explains that every inspired statement showing Jesus Christ coming in the flesh originates with God OK not Jehovah God the father but Jesus Christ the Son. Anything say different is the Antichrist. 1 John 4 : 2 - 3 ( 2 This is how you know that the inspired statement is from God: Every inspired statement that acknowledges Jesus Christ as having come in the flesh originates with God. 3 But every inspired statement that does not acknowledge Jesus does not originate with God. Furthermore, this is the Antichrist’s inspired statement that you have heard was coming, and now it is already in the world.
Ah, but I did not rid it. I think it is just in another spiritual reality actualized as immaterial information on some hard discs of mine
Let me think about it. I might change it again for you. After all, you are special to me: you are the first Christian I know who likes Monty Python
.Ciao
- viole
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Blessed of JEHOVAH
Member
I'm not here to take any ones job or to please men but it's Jehovah who i aim to please in the name of Jesus. Galatians 1 : 10 - 12 ( 10 Is it, in fact, men I am now trying to persuade or God? Or am I trying to please men? If I were still pleasing men, I would not be Christ’s slave. 11 For I want you to know, brothers, that the good news I declared to you is not of human origin; 12 for neither did I receive it from man, nor was I taught it, but it was through a revelation by Jesus Christ.
djhwoodwerks
Well-Known Member
Nice witness try, but incorrect!
Acts 10:48 (ESV Strong's) 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ.
Peter commanded them to "be baptized in the name of Jesus", it doesn't say, "he commanded them to be baptized, in the name of Jesus, amen".
Acts 2:38 (ESV Strong's) 38 And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.
Peter didn't say, "repent and be baptized for the forgiveness of sins, in the name of Jesus Christ, amen".
Peter said, "repent and BE BAPTIZED in the name of Jesus Christ FOR the forgiveness of sins".
Peter "ISN'T" praying!
And you still have failed to say whether you are a rank and file member of the witnesses or if you are of the 144,000 anointed. Are you displaying "theocratic warfare"? Are we not entitled to the truth?
McBell
Unbound
Christians
djhwoodwerks
Well-Known Member
I don't know how long you've been a witness, but if you are just a rank and file witness, using Jesus' name is of no use to you since He is not your mediator. This is from the wtbts's book, "Worldwide Security" chapter 1, pages 10-11 paragraph 16,
*** ws chap. 1 pp. 10-11 par. 16 The Desire for Peace and Security Worldwide ***
Likewise, the Greater Moses, Jesus Christ, is not the Mediator between Jehovah God and all mankind. He is the Mediator between his heavenly Father, Jehovah God, and the nation of spiritual Israel, which is limited to only 144,000 members. This spiritual nation is like a little flock of Jehovah’s sheeplike ones.—Romans 9:6; Revelation 7:4.
The governing body is the mediator of the rank and file jw.
Blessed of JEHOVAH
Member
Blessed of JEHOVAH
Member
Listen i'm not trying to trick you, but when your baptizing yes it may be in public but aren't you speaking to Jehovah God? When your speaking to God aren't you praying to him. Look if what you say is true then the scriptures conflict.
Matthew 28 : 19 ( 19. Go, therefore, and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit.) That's what Jesus said to baptize in before he ascended.) How I explained it to you does not conflict with the scriptures no man taught that explanation to me, but the Father through Holy spirit did.
Sorry if I made you angry but i will not argue over scripture and don't worry about who I am worry about who is the real God Jehovah or Jesus. Try to understand the things i've already told you and stop trying to ambush people. Praise Jehovah in the name of Jesus.
djhwoodwerks
Well-Known Member
I don't know why "you" end your prayers in Jesus' name, as a rank and file jw, He is not your mediator. He is "my" mediator, that's why I do.
djhwoodwerks
Well-Known Member
No worries, you aren't and can't, trick me!
Why would one be speaking to God when baptizing another?
I agree, that's what Jesus said to do. Provide "one" verse of anyone baptizing in the name "Jehovah", or commanding anyone to be baptized in the name "Jehovah".
What do you think "the name" of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit is?
You haven't made me angry!
Is that what you call, debating scripture, "arguing"?
I'm not "worried" about who you are, apparently you are a "closet" apostate!
Try telling your elders or the 'slave' that!
1robin
Christian/Baptist
Well I am glad your not Catholic but if you were it would have explained what you have claimed.
Before our discussion moves on we are going to have to drop back to the beginning and get some fundamentals established before we can build on them.
So lets go back to the argument over the nature of scripture.
I have no way what so ever to know if when you claim God said this or that to you, whether he actually did or your just a cook. So what God tells me or what he tells you is not common ground since I cannot verify what he may have told you, nor can you verify what he might have told me. Personal revelation is not common ground. So if we have a disagreement over what God did, wants, or commands the only possible common ground is scripture. So if you deny the authority of scripture you have eradicated the only thing that we both have access to. So any meaningful discussion must take place upon the written word of God, upon logical laws built upon scripture, and rational conclusions from scripture. That is why I keep trying to get you to start with scripture as a whole and build from that point. You seem unwilling to do so, so I keep trying to explain why any meaningful discussion must begin with the word. Let me make one last attempt.
For the sake of time I am only going to give one or two verses to support my conclusions but there are dozens or even many dozens I can supply for each point made here.
1. Among the qualifications for an author of the bible is for the teachings it includes to be apostolic in nature.
a. Everyone who wrote anything in the bible was directly commissioned to teach in Christ's name.
b. The apostles examined and approved the messages and apostleship of the other apostles.
c. Those writing and their authors have been scrutinized over the last 2000 years in the NT case more so than any other work in human history and they
have withstood withering critical analysis.
d. Nothing you or I claim God told us has been examined in the same way. So when you and I do not agree we must appeal to scripture to determine who
is right. That is one of the most essential and necessary purposes of God's written revelation.
e. So the official doctrine of the body of Christ or his church (the brotherhood of all believers) is to be based on the cornerstone of the written word.
New International Version
Now, brothers and sisters, I have applied these things to myself and Apollos for your benefit, so that you may learn from us the meaning of the saying, "Do not go beyond what is written." Then you will not be puffed up in being a follower of one of us over against the other.
Matthew 4:1-11New International Version (NIV)
Jesus Is Tested in the Wilderness
4 Then Jesus was led by the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted 2 After fasting forty days and forty nights he was hungry. 3 The tempter came to him and said, “If you are the Son of God, tell these stones to become bread.” 4 Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Man shall not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.
You said your in Jesus now and above you have what Jesus said, so you should willingly abide by it.
Here is an entire paper on solo scriptoria: http://www.bible.ca/sola-scriptura-proof-texts.htm
2. So whatever you say, it either confirms or contradicts scripture. Lets see what God says about this.
a. New International Version But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be
under God's curse!
b. If anyone (even an Angel) teaches anything contradictory to scripture they are cursed. So when you rule out the authority of scriptures you are
teaching something contradictory and different than those verses I supplied in point 1. above.
c. Not only are you contradicting those verses above and dozens just like them you are denying their authority outright.
3. You mentioned a while back the use of logic and then only made subjective conclusions. Well let me lay out an absolute of logic.
a. The law of not contradiction states that a in not equal to a'. This law cannot possibly be incorrect under any circumstance yet this is a law you attempt to
defy in your arguments.
b. In simple terms the law means that two contradictory claims to truth cannot possibly both be correct in the same way at the same time.
c. You have said that scripture lacks authority and then made arguments giving scripture as the authority demonstrating those claims.
Contradictory therefore one or both claims are untrue.
e. You have used your own claims to personal revelation yet you deny personal revelation for others who have far greater credentials. Contradictory
therefore one or both claims are untrue.
f. You mentioned Mormonism which if you agree to their doctrines you have adopted contradictions again. The Mormon cult includes accepts
teachings which contradicts biblical doctrines which it also affirms. Examples....Mormonism claims baptism for the dead is Godly, we become God's after
death, and that a pathetic translation of the Egyptian book of the dead is actually revelation, ect.... all of which contradict the bible. Again a contradictory
position and therefore one or all of these claims must be untrue.
g. You deny Christ's divinity which is emphatically affirmed in the bible, yet in other instances you accept scripture. Contradictory again and therefore
some or all of what you have said must be false.
My position is perfectly consistent. My authority is the scripture, all my personal revelation is consistent with that authority. A seamless whole.
Your position is contradictory to its self and to scriptural authority.
Unless you can first argue from the common ground of scripture (who's credentials, credentials, and integrity infinitely exceeds your own) there exists no foundation by which any doctrinal claims can be resolved. That is a primary intended purpose of scripture and it performs that roll to perfection. So until you can do so I will not carry on discussions until a foundation for common ground is adopted by you. Currently, I must either believe you when you make claims that contradict everything I am aware of on one hand, or I must believe Christ, the apostles, the early Church fathers, 2000 years of mainstream scholarly conclusions, logical and rational methodology, and my own personal experience which are all consistent with each other. For now it is easy to see who I should go with.
Before I read all that, because it is a lot (I think I am half way through) I have to say that I do not contest original writings of scripture. I can't say what was God inspired and what wasn't.
I can say that other people who have come before us HAVE ADDED TO IT.
The proof is right there in front of everyone's eyes but they (and you) refuse to see it.
OK?
An example? Matthew 28:19 was changed from disciple nations (which to me means to teach people like Jesus would do) to MAKE disciples of nations. I KNOW, KNOW, KNOW that it is wrong to read "make" there.
I believe that God has given me the go on that.
Why won't anyone believe me?
Because it's funny? Blind people should NOT be funny and it it is why I have said God calls me unrighteous because I think it is funny.
I think it is funny that the whole world in error lies. Does that make me Satan?
I can say that other people who have come before us HAVE ADDED TO IT.
The proof is right there in front of everyone's eyes but they (and you) refuse to see it.
OK?
An example? Matthew 28:19 was changed from disciple nations (which to me means to teach people like Jesus would do) to MAKE disciples of nations. I KNOW, KNOW, KNOW that it is wrong to read "make" there.
I believe that God has given me the go on that.
Why won't anyone believe me?
Because it's funny? Blind people should NOT be funny and it it is why I have said God calls me unrighteous because I think it is funny.
I think it is funny that the whole world in error lies. Does that make me Satan?
I do not know what this means.
IF scripture had the authority that YOU say it does, then my job and your job is to make people believe in Jesus Christ per Matthew 28:19
I am certain it was Jesus Christ who told me it is a lie.